Upcoming DS changes - Q&A

Nyzechu said:

I have a suggestion for Mori changes, can we change Moris to be only possible on 3rd hook? So this way Killer still gets the mori animation and instead of going for that last hook he gets the kill AND survivors get a chance to use their DS to get away in case of a tunnel.

With NOED maybe address it where it has a timer instead of constant insta down.
OR just keep the speed but take the instadown maybe?

I dislike NOED too because it rewards Killers for not optimizing their map pressure and chases. However I get why it exists for slower killers! ♥

Thank you for this change, it was long overdue.

@Kenshin said:
as long as the 3 second stun stays and enduring works against it its fine. finally a counter to it now. just hope they dont increase the time to 4 seconds again.

If they increase the stun time back to the value we currently have, then Im done playing killer tbh

Nyzechu said:

@The_Crusader said:
Wow it's the real Nyzechu!

I do agree that moris are OP vs standard survviors, but when you get a 4 man swf on comms with instaheals, the best toolboxes etc you kind of need the moris to balance it out imo.

Likewise survivors toys are OP vs standard killers but become much more balanced when its a killer with an ebony mori and Iri heads or 5 blinks.

You never need moris to balance it out! ♥ I mean it, you can be better at the chases and if the survivors are really good they deserve to escape or excell too. it is not all about the 4ks but for the fun of the game. ♥

Barron said:

"we think NOED has multiple counters but DS doesn't" lololololololololololol

Dribbling from hook. Enduring. Actually missing the skills check. Not being greedy and taking the ds user to the closest hook.

It's time just to put bots in for killer mains to play against.

Why not just drop the Obsession part? It is pointless and absolutely wrecks several perks. I will never run OoO as survivor because I never run DS and don't want to lose my perk bonus to someone else. I will never again run Dying Light because it is absolutely pointless. Not to mention the headache you are causing with other perks.

I congratulated the devs on a well-thought out plan for DS, but I have to criticize the fact that you guys never seem to understand the consequences/pitfalls of some of your ideas. Very short-sighted with this Obsession issue. If someone uses DS, they used it, why does the killer care if they are the Obsession?! I know I don't. I'd rather be able to count on who Rancor/Dying Light/PwYF/StBfL is going to work/not work on. Now I have to alter constantly as killer, or just give away my perk bonus as survivor?! Absolutely foolish.

@Barron said:
Dribbling from hook. Enduring. Actually missing the skills check. Not being greedy and taking the ds user to the closest hook.

Relying on your opponent to screw up is NOT a valid counter tactic because at a certain skill level you get people that never screw up. It's like saying you can dodge bullets because the shooter aims away from you.

Also your first and last points are literally the same thing. Fact is killers have 2 perks (Enduring/Unnerving) that soft counter DS, and 2 tactics that are situational and risky (dribble/slug). That sure sounds fair SMH. The new DS has some actual counter play to it. It stops a killer from being able to tunnel you off a hook (except if they have a mori) which is something that is good for survivors in general.

All these survivors complaining are the type of survivors that think they are good at the game for running DS. No you suck at the game, a real survivor can escape easily without DS. This coming from a survivor main with over 1400 escapes so... where's that Doc 'git gud' pic?

HeroLives said:

The_Crusader said:

HeroLives said:

The_Crusader said:

Comparing Rancor to DS

DS was an OP perk that could cost killer the game. There was often at least 1 in almost every game.

Rancor grants you 1 kill out of 4 survivors. You see it once it maybe every 500 games, and even then its mostly on people with Spirit that dont have many other perk choices unlocked.

Know why many people never used it? Because it really wasn't that good.

- If you win the game you get nothing from Rancor until the last gen is complete.

- The location reveal of survviors was pretty useless mostly since you had no idea which direction they were heading in. Only on a small number of occasions was it useful if a survivor happened to be hiding nearby.

- If multiple survivors were alive at the end you probably weren't going to find the obsession.

I've had Rancor used on me only a couple of times since it came out. I've never gone down to it. It's too easy to play stealthy when there is 1 gen left.

I'll tell you why Rancor is important right now - because devs keep talking about a downside to becoming the obsession. There is no downside and there never has been a downside unless the killer was running 1 of 3 perks, Rancor, Dying Light, Remember Me. Those perks were rare to see too, outside of Freddys with Remember Me anyway. So for the most part there was no downside.

Now Rancor IS the downside. Dying Light has been nerfed to beyond useless. STBFL and PWYF don't punish the obsession, they benefit the obsession. Being the obsession against Remember Me is bad early on as it means tunneling, but good late game if the obsession dies as it means you can then open the exit gates at normal speed.

That leaves Rancor as a killers only choice when it comes to providing a downside for the obsession.  It's a pretty hefty penalty too. Might actually make someone think twice about using DS unless it's their last hook, and that's what we want. People being afraid to become the obsession.

And my whole point circles back to “we made this to prevent tunneling” and if you use it to prevent being tunneled you can now take a mori or get slugged. See the issue?

1) Moris have barely changed. Even if all 4 survivors brought DS, chances are 3 of them weren't going to use it, and it was possible to dribble the obsession to the hook anyway.

DS became a problem over 12 hooks/3 hook stages per survivor because more hooks = more chance of a survivor hitting 35%, or being too far to dribble from the hook. When you only needed 4 hooks DS barely happened.

2) I'd rather be slugged and left to be picked up than to be downed and immediately hooked again and brought one stage closer to death.

- Killers slugs survivor to slow the team down
- Survivor gets slugged but gets to keep his 'extra life' if you get what I mean

It's a win/win for both sides.

3) Killers aren't going to slug and wait 60 seconds. It's a waste of time. If they stay near your body then gens get done and they get hurt by it. Compare that to now when they can just hook you straight up and this is a huge improvement for survivors.

Honestly I don't think too much will change...

- High rank killers normally hook then move onto a new target anyway, so they won't be affected by this

- Low rank killers love their tunneling, they'll probably just take the DS, which is what they do now when they chase the obsession for 3 gens anyway.

But again I'd rather be slugged and left to be picked up by another survivor than put on the hook again and brought one step closer to death.

I see your point I really do, and I get that. That didn’t even cross my mind when talking about rancor. 

Im talking about when a killer does very poorly and can get a 4 man 3 man 2 man mori Bc of luck at the end even though they really did nothing to earn it. I’m not saying it’s going to happen all the time, I’m saying It’s going to be game breaking when it does. The lower ranks are really going to suffer from it for that reason exactly that you just listed and those tunneling killers down there are going to get rewarded for it, Bc a survivor wouldn’t have to use it unless they are being tunneled seeing as it triggers the option once you’re unhooked. See what I’m saying? It’s cheap af. It’s a reward for killers who will purposely put on rancor and tunnel for that reason. 

So no I don’t think it’s cool Bc now if a survivor(s) is tunneled throughout the match and they are now up for a mori with rancor for a perk the devs dress up as “its to help prevent tunneling”. Here is exactly why I say this. A lot of survivors are going to carry this, as a killer I’d anticipate it(which you are) so now you have endgame(assuming the survivors even make it that far) to be rewarded for a play style(tunneling) that the devs created this perk to “prevent” when really it backhandedly encourages it. Bc if the survivor gets the perk triggered(and uses it) it was in fact Bc the killer was tunneling. 

Rancor is going to be a problem for this reason. It rewards toxic gameplay now. 
As if the red mori wasn’t already something survivors bite their tongue about. 
Now it’s double the mori both of which are cheap Bc you don’t really have to work for either just hook each person once, or if you’re going to use rancor tunnel each survivor once. It’s borederline skill less Bc any decent killer will hook everyone atleast once, on a really good killer this is so over powered it’s incrdibly stupid that they’d even allow this to walk out of their office and into the game.

especially considering that killers got so incredibly tilted about eating a single ds.would not even eat a single ds to extend a chase(because let’s be honest I’ve been in enough 4 mans to know on average only one person is going to be able to use it considering how hook spacing is now) anyone else who carries it wasted a perk slot. The amount of people on here that over exaggerate is baffling, I know this Bc I run bond and I see it all even when I play solo. 

So please if you’re going to say that a single ds MAYBE two in a match can alter it that much(which they completely can if you chase that single survivor around long enough) you have to accept the fact that a rancor that robs people of 2 hooks and a mori that robs people of two hooks doesn’t do the exact same thing completely altering a match. You’d be a liar if you said they weren’t huge game changers Bc they are.


so imho I think my points are extremely valid, well thought out, not biased ,and incredibly fair points. 



most lower rank killers are the Effin worst about those kind of things.
higher ranks ehhh it’s a mix of all types of killer styles tbh.


I mean im not going to run it, Bc it’s obviously killer bait and I can think  of other perks id rather use over the new ds .Bc honestly I want the toxic killers to eat it knowing they can’t mori my sweet ass because they play like #########, and I don’t think they should be rewarded for a mindless game play of tunneling and camping, just to have them mori me at the end Bc they’re a bastard. 

KateMainNoBrain said:

To me, this change seems good in theory, but the more I've thought about it... the more like a nerf it seems? First off, sure, it's anti tunnelling, but if you can only use it once then what good will it do really... It'll be the exact same as it is now: you'll use it, a killer will get offended (if they're the kind of killer who can't handle dstrikes) and they'll just tunnel you after you use it. Also, it kind of sucks because say you're the last person alive and maybe the killer played really scummy--tunnelling, camping, the whole nine yards--and you don't want them to get a 4k? There's no longer a light at the end of the tunnel, you're just dead if you get caught. I don't know, maybe I'm just another entitled survivor main, but this change seems killer sided... yet again. Especially with how NOED isn't being looked at... it gets buffed to exposed effect at all levels while decisive continuously gets nerfed. NOED is the exact same as decisive, a "crutch" perk. A killer can play awfully and then when end game hits, they're able to find you off of the last generator and kill you in one hit. Both perks reward bad play styles, but maybe this DS change will turn out differently than it seems.

emilys101 said:

This cannot happen. You keep nerfing and nerfing survivors into the ground when DS is the ONLY counter to the countless moris I come across. With this change, it is basically useless as Pop Goes the Weasel with the 60 second timer. Absolutely stupid. With my 1500 hours of killer and survivor, you are making killer easier and easier. I almost quit after Legion was instated, but this is abysmal. I will be quitting after these changes are made, to my disappointment since this was, by far, the most unique game I have come across.