This won't be last nerf for the Nurse

DBD is a casual party game and an asymmetrical one at that. It can never be truly balance by its inherent nature and DBD does not have a largely competitive player base as you would have in say COD or PUBG or whatever.

Its a casual game with a mostly casual low skill player base and the majority of that player base are unskilled survivors.

Yeah but SupaAlf was doing that specifically for a win streak and even he acknowledged it was a broken combo carrying him. Not that Alf isn't a top tier Nurse player as clearly he is but he piled on the OP BS to ensure his winstreak wasn't at risk.

I have already seen Nurses running double recharge/range builds with Eruption lol... sure good Nurses don't kick gens or break pallets for that matter and likely still wont

No, I did not say anything of the sort - so what I seem to be saying to you is not what I am saying.

I don't think any Nurse main with some skill feels like a match is impossible to win, if they do they are not very good with Nurse. I have been on the PTB too and Nurse is still fine

DBD may be a PVP game but it is not inherently a true 'competitive' game and can never be by the very nature of asymmetrical games.

It has nothing to do with mental gymnastics, it is just a fact that the majority of the DBD player base are unskilled survivors and if you balance for the top minority the unskilled causal majority will not play as the game will be completely inaccessible to them.

You are mistaking this as me saying this as my personal preference; the fact is BHVR have to balance the game this way or the game will die. You don't market and balance for the top 0.1% - this is just plain bad business and BHVR will never do this. Not accepting this fact will set you up for a lot of disappointment

Out of those games, which of those is like dbd? (An asymmetrical 1 v 4{sorta} )

So bringing up a streamer then denying Comp.... seems counterintuitive

Good Killer players will find what's good for Nurse... it's not hard

Then why is no one playing it casually? Like really, most people play like their life depends on it. I don´t know about your definition of casual, but thats not my definition of casual.

The thing that makes her OP aren't her Addons nor M1-special effects from perks. The thing that makes her OP is the fact that she can totally ignore pallets, windows, walls and even switch between floors. BHVR is trying to fix the wrong problem. She needs a complete change/rework of her base power.

And to add to that, the hand holding is for survivors only. Why the killer community should sweat and play like people with 5000 hours when survivors get a lot of free info patch after patch and by just pressing E in the right moment they can restart a chase? Or by just pre dropping pallet after pallet 3 gens are done because of poor map balance?

Killers shoudn't be balanced around top players because survivors aren't balanced around top survivor at all. Simple as that, and as you say the casual players are the life of this game, upset them to the point of no return and the future of the game won't be bright.

I think i joked about it lasting 2days, it seems i was right.

Nerf nurse threads, roll out! lol

Source: no one who plays sweaty is playing casually.

You dont market, but you DEFINITELY balance.

Source: Every single competitive game ever.

Can you imagine in any ######### multiplayer game, you're trying to do your objective as quickly, efficiently and effectively as possible, and you're getting ######### from the enemy team? LOL

I can just see it in a game like Dota, "dude you just killed me 5 times in a row, can you stop please?" Or, "dude you just destroyed 3 of our towers, stop "tunneling" our towers!"

Sorry for bringing up such a minor point but I wanted to bring up something from VHS as I was in the closed beta there both before and after the hacks.

The hacks did very little to hurt VHS. It still came out with over 6,000 players playing at the same time (so probably over 10,000 or 20,000 players as a base) even with no advertising and lost over 95% of the players in a short time frame. It lost them due to balancing for the top. One of the main issues the game has is that Monster is weak and there are situations a Monster can be put in with a coordinated group where there is literally no counterplay. When it was pointed out that new players to Monster would not continue in the role if Monster remained as unengaging and weak as it is the devs and Teen mains pointed to the top Monster players who did really well, said that showed the role was fine, and ignored all the advice to the contrary.

With the Monster role being how it was that led to a lack of Monster players which then increased queue times to unbearable amounts which caused all but the most die-hard players to stop playing, etc until the game it got into the state it was in.

I know the devs had advance notice this was coming as when I was in the closed beta I accurately predicted and told the devs that the situation VHS is in now would happen if Monster was balanced around only top tier players and I wasn't the only person saying this.

The hacks didn't help and there was a lack of advertising (but the lack of advertising may be a good thing if the problems with VHS get ironed out as, once the game is long term sustainable, as new players are easier to retain than ones who already tried but disliked it) but those were, from my experience and time involved in the game, lesser factors. The playerbase numbers upon Early Access were pretty healthy.

The root cause why it hasn't been successful was because Monster was balanced for the top and being a new Monster player was too unforgiving, harsh and unfun. Most new players, after pointing this out, would receive torrents of 'just get gud' posts instead of their concerns being heard and understandably wouldn't stick around on the off chance that they might have fun later. There have been minor improvements since but still not anything that would make it new player friendly enough in my opinion to retain new Monster player. However, the hacks didn't really hurt the playerbase at all; there was no discernible difference in the playerbase because of the hacks and VHS had, upon Early Access release, a decent sized playerbase.

Did we say same? No. Do we believe that she affected the majority? Also no, but apparently she effected ENOUGH to call everything to attention and that's what happened.

We also said those who are good with her will still be good with her. Needing an add on to be good seems Abit conditional for being called good. Willing to bet if we look for this so called "high lvl nurse play" we're going to find some mix of the following for a lot of it:

Survivors being stomped due to being potatoes, the nurse in question using the add ons or perks or both as a major crutch, the nurse in question doing the usual "hard tunnel and camp cause it's the only way to win" strat.

While yes it will take longer to go place to place without those add ons, she GOES THROUGH OBSTACLES. Certain maps like the game she's still faster than anyone while she loses Abit of time on other maps. That's a map issue.

And (I'm being asked to type this again) you still need that example.

I'll agree with @Stabby_Widdershins and go a little bit more into detail into what was said. Yes, Monster is weak in VHS and there is no realistic counterplay in a lot of situations. If Teens group up in a wide open space, as an example, one of the Monsters (WART) literally has no way to get them as the weapons will slow WART, break the armor, and then Banish WART. There is also a Rift mechanism which has a good purpose but essentially puts the Monster into a no win situation if the Teens, who have voice comms in game, coordinate and use it to ambush the Monster

The tracking is also horrible for new players as it is nearly entirely audio based. I'm able to use it but that's only because I played a lot of Spirit but without MDR so I'm used to hearing for footsteps. Beginning me in DbD who had to learn how to use scratch marks or anyone with an auditory impairment would be completely lost. Also, as soon as you hit a Teen you look up so you lose sight of the Teen.

Monster sounds like a backfiring dump truck with no stealth options while Teens can commonly solo you just by being silent and waiting for you to walk by. Any weapon hits that aren't one shots, which just banish you outright, slow you down enough that with multiple weapons even if you catch a Teen out of position the Teen by briefly firing, taking two steps back, repeating they can turn a hit the Monster should have had into a loss for the Monster.

These are some of the major issues that remain. It was worse than what I described for Monster before but when any issues were brought up people would point at Dowsey when he played it or TricksterShadow's performance and say but see! Pointing out that the average video game user wasn't going to spend the hours necessary to be as good as Dowsey or TricksterShadow at a video game but would just play something else was not accepted by the majority of the community or the dev team because, hey, the very top players can do well so everything is okay.

The game does have a lot of potential and I still play it occasionally and provide feedback but it does need major changes for it to catch on. If you want to try it out feel free but as the only regular players left are either the diehard Monster players who are amazingly good or really good Teens but with at least the chance of getting a newer type Teen in the group so don't be surprised if you get stomped non-stop. It can be really stressful too. As an example, during pre 6.1 DH and just recently released CoH I would log in as a Killer on DbD (and mainly Clown) to destress from playing Monster in VHS. I'm hoping major changes come soon as it does have a lot of potential to be a really good game but Monster has to be fixed before it has real growth potential. The attitude seems to have shifted to trying out new things for Monster because the reality is kind of bleak for player retention so that might prompt some changes of substance.