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Comments
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It's both a QoL and a buff to soloQ. For example, seeing the gen progress significantly buffs the survivor perk adrenaline since now a survivor who runs it could freely go get in the chase when a gen is almost ready to pop and almost always get a guaranteed value from it. As I said I don't mind yall making life for solo better but to sale this as only a QoL change is a little dishonest since it is also a buff.
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You are not seeing the big picture here.
Solos are indeed have been at the worst position for a long time. (I play both roles, and most of my survivor plays are solo.)
Although it is a buff for all survivors, solos are the ones who will benefit from it the most.
In a few weeks, hopefully, a correction will be made to fix the issues that these improvements will bring.
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how does swf benefit from this when they can literally use their words
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Laughs in Windows of Opportunity.
Respectfully, this is a QoL change (and not a bad one in that regard) but weaker killers especially need to capitalize on survivors' mistakes to compete. More information makes it easier to avoid these crucial mistakes so it will have an influence on balancing. I can't count the number of matches I won because the survivors were not working on a gen that already had significant progress, which gave me the time to go for another chase, camp, regress that gen or even push them off. These two things (QoL and balancing) correlate with each other. If there was no issue in adding free information when it comes to balancing we could just as well give all survivors aura vision on the killer as long as one of them has a line of sight. After all SWFs have that information too.
I respect this change but I strongly believe that this will have an impact on the balance of the game (as many others do).
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it clears coms, and gives more up to date info, both are huge buffs. Clearing coms is the #1 issue in any competitive multiplayer game.
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Literally let them do it. If they buff the communication for soloQ so that you get similar ways to communicate like with SWF the devs might realize how strong survivors are if they are efficient on gens and that we need to buff the weaker killers at some point.
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As a killer main I have to say that I am not surprised, I am not agitated, I am not even mildly excited.
I don't see how a smol progress bar will stop me from enjoying the game as killer.
As a soloQQ survivor, all this does is make me painfully aware of what was obvious all along.
As a killer I have been dealing with this and even way, WAY worse things all these years before this update.
tl;dr you're not good enough to complain about balance
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Speaking takes more time and more energy that getting an ever-accurate overview on the side of the screen.
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Killers were only promised a kill rate adjustment. BHVR never ever said anything at all about killers ever getting quality of life improvements as compensation. Survivors got a quality of life improvement, and updated additional quality of life improvement, and discussion of future changes...... but killers get absolutely zero words on their player experience. How is that a good thing? Are killers people too, or are they just reduced to their kill rate?
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Lmao 10chars*
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No, oh, and ######### you too baby killer.
– BHVR and the survivor community, sincerely.
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Aint he right though?
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why doesnt the hud disable if you queue with another survivor if its meant to be a soloq buff
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Let me remind you that killers STILL cant see how many hooks each survivor is at.
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They need to monitor the changes, then buff killers if needed. The game can't be better balanced without these buffs to solo survivors.
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They need to give killers quality of life improvements too. Killers are more than their kill rate %, and they deserve quality of life improvements too. "Just buff killers" could mean generic number buffs, that raise the kill rate, but do absolutely nothing to make the killer experience feel better.
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True. Tunneling is not frequent enough, only in 80% cases, we should fix that ASAP!
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Surely those would be handled on a case by case basis, though, right? And if we're saying killers need individual changes that both buff them and raise their quality of life... isn't that exactly what they have been doing, most recently with Ghostface and Legion?
Survivor QoL changes like this are gonna be quicker and easier to do, I'm certain of it. They uniformly affect all survivor players. Killer changes are necessarily going to take more time.
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There needs to be quality of life improvements that affect ALL killers.
Because we all know what a lot of people secretly want. They want survivors as a whole being buffed, but only the low tier killers getting buffed, so overall, the top tier killers are becoming weaker than they were before.
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Sure, but what would those be? What QoL improvements do all killers benefit from, that wouldn't be pretty minor and underwhelming? There's a couple finnicky totem spots for snuffing, that's something that'd be strictly QoL and would benefit everyone, but I'm struggling to think of much else.
If we want QoL improvements it would be far more effective and appreciated to address killer-specific annoyances, which is basically what they've been doing.
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That is NOT a valid reason for killers not being able to see progress over THEIR objective.
Genrushing is VERY frequent, so why have gen progress shown?
The logic is so effing dumb.
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Read what Eruption does again, and have a good, long thinking, it'll hit ya, eventually.
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I don't know if it's smart thing to answer someone who defend tunneling, but "genrushing" is a killer skill issue that focus on one survivor, which was pointed many times by pro-players. So the word "dumb" you throw so easily could be very ironical and backfire. But nothing wrong in acknowleding skill issue, I just for saying it straight, not by complaining.
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Even if i'm a Killer main i don't care much about this change and if help to close the gap between solo Q and SFW is fine BUT "focusing too much on balance" is something really bad to say.
Balance should be your first concern but seem you really don't care at all about balance and in a game like that balance is everything
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Killers were not at their strongest with old Ruin, because there was so much broken stuff in the game for Survivors at this point. Old DS, even nerfed DS with actual 60 seconds of immunity. Old Balanced Landing. A lot of really strong Structures (Old Ironworks, old Torment Creek and all this stuff).
Killers were at their strongest pre-CoH. When CoH was released, Killers were weaker. But now with all the changes happening in the big Perk-Update, Killer really is the easiest it has ever been.
If you suck, this is on you. Just accept it or try to improve. But dont blame the game for your lack of Skill (as little skill is needed in DBD...).
Also, what I find funny - before the Solo-QoL-Change, Killers were always saying that they go against SWF all of the time. But now this does not seem to be the case, now the Solo-Buff is the evil thing. Which should not matter if you go against SWF all the time...
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1) An FoV slider
2) Quieter chase music
3) More reliable survivor noises (like footsteps), that aren't muffled or deleted if the survivor breaks line of sight
Those are improvements that could affect all killers.
No, it would not be far more effective and appreciated to address killer-specific annoyances. Making improvements to specific low tier killers, does absolutely nothing to address the gameplay on the higher tier killers. The goal of the survivor changes, isn't supposed to be "let's buff survivors, then buff lower tier killers, and leave higher tier killers the same, so it's an overall nerf for the higher tier killers".
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Those would be fair, sure. Of course, they're not as necessary as the solo queue changes were on the balance side, but if we're looking for pure QoL those would be fine additions that I'd support- I'll take that L, I didn't think of those.
I am curious what you mean by that last part, though. What exactly would the problem be with bringing the balance to a point where all the killers are equally viable? The current top-tier killers are very strong, they hardly need any buffing and other than 'global' QoL so to speak the top tier killers shouldn't benefit too much from any changes made to the killer side. If we enter an era of the game where Nurse and Blight are noticeably weaker compared to now, but you can also get respectable results on any killer on the roster... is that not better?
I'm not saying anyone is aiming for that, for the record, but it seems like an odd boogeyman to bring up. That sounds like a pretty favourable outcome for everyone.
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People absolutely are aiming for overall nerfs to the top-tier killers. You can see it in the flood of posts specifically asking for nerfs to top tier killers. You can see in these threads, where people say "buff survivors, then buff specific killers as compensation".
Here's a quote from earlier in this thread "Killers can always be buffed again if necessary (or at the very least some of the weaker ones which need it regardless)". Of course there are a lot of people that think it's cool to just buff trash killers and ignore the top killers, it's not a odd boogeyman.
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Okay, but why is that a problem? Is it not good for the game to be in a state where the top tier (which is like, three or four killers, so not even that many) aren't as powerful but everyone else is at the point where they're super viable at most levels of play?
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Fun is everything. Balance should serve the enjoyment people get out of your game
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It is good for the game to have at least a few killers that are powerful. BHVR will never make all the killers super viable at high level play, and has never said that was even a goal they were considering.
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BHVR has also never said that their goal is only to buff lower-tier killers, so we're talking in the realms of hypotheticals here. Hypothetically, what is being pitched is buffing the lower tier killers to be closer to the top tier, while buffing solo survivor because it obviously needs it, and leaving the current top tier mostly where it is.
That sounds like a good thing to me.
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I dont know if its a smart thing (yes I do know, it isnt) to answer to someone that uses the word "pro-players" in a DBD forum, but "tunneling" is a survivor skill issue, so the word "skill issue" you throw so easily, IS very ironical and WILL backfire.
Who's next? yawn
This isnt a Dota forum bud.
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I don't know. I still think kill rate increases were due to the disabling of certain perks
during EGCafter exit gates are powered. Well, then again this will tell us one way or the other, if kill rates do change.0 -
Joking aside, her rework reflected exactly that.
I´m curious how the stats were the week before the patch and well how they are in a month.
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I've wanted a FoV increase for my motion sickness for years but that's not QoL according to them but mapwide info is lol...
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It's not a good thing, because it's trying to make the top tier killers weaker. We were told these survivor changes were supposed to be quality of life changes. Your idea is trying to sneak in an ulterior motive of weakening certain killers.
It would be fine if all killer got quality of life improvements, and lower tier killers additionally got some buffs. But specifically trying to exclude higher tier killers from compensation is a garbage idea.
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I mean, the survivor change that we have here is a QoL change. It might go a little further because it is slightly more specific, but the information in general - generator progress - is already shared... by survivors on comms. Spreading that same information to solo queue is QoL, because it's not giving them something optional or extra; it's catching them up to what they should have already and making that already available information smoother to access.
I'm not sure what you mean by that last part. What would higher tier killers be "excluded" from? We've already touched the few QoL things all killers could get, so it must be the idea of buffing lower tier killers, but... the top killers don't need buffs, they're already at the top. That's not exclusion, it's just basic common sense.
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The problem is that then no killers can compete with competent groups. I’ve said it before and I’ll say again: it’s not ok to not count the “edge case” of swf and then turn around and nerf killers based on a small number of people performing well.
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But nobody's suggesting nerfing killers in this context, it is only being suggested that lower tier killers are buffed.
The argument is that leaving the top tier exactly where they are would result in them being slightly weaker, not that they should or would be actively nerfed.
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Unless the buffs make them match the strength of the top tier, then it’s pointless to do anything. Buffing a killer like Trapper will do nothing unless the changes are insane. The game needs to be completely reworked/balanced. Buffing the low tiers will not have a significant impact.
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Some killers are probably reeling from the idea of having to wait for potential changes when the last time killers waited for changes, it took something like 2-3 years. Also, just because they're probable does not mean they are guaranteed. Consider grabs, they have never been fixed and those broke over 4 years ago.
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OK, first of all, why do you (and others) only act like only Survivors got better over time. Killers got better over time as well. And they got some insane Tools like currently a very strong Slowdown-Meta.
The thing is, the gap between SoloQ and SWF got smaller, but SoloQ is nowhere near SWF-Level. The strong part about SWF is to remove the RNG of your teammates. If you have a 4 man-SWF full of good players, you will play every game with good players. If you are Solo, you might end up with 3 good players as well - or 3 really bad ones. And some Icons will not suddenly make Survivors efficient. People who waste their time looting chests or cleansing Totems (or being inactive and running around) will not suddenly to something because they see Icons.
I have seen Survivors not doing anything (like, nothing, no Icon Chance) for 4 full minutes into the match. And this is no exception.
And well, Killer will always be more stressful than Survivor. Because it is just logical that the "Team" which is alone will have it harder against the Team of 4 players.
I would even question if Killer really needs a Buff with that Survivor-Update. Because, lets face it - for some people, all the Buffs will never be enough. They can probably change Gens that they need 2 minutes to complete and some Killers would still struggle and demand more. They can remove half of the Pallets and some Killers would still struggle.
The sad reality is that many players in this game are just not good and just unable to accept Mistakes. Oh, you got tunneled? Or was the reason you died because you went to the Gen injured while the Killer was nearby? Oh, you lost? Was the reason SWF/more information or maybe the 20 Hatchets you missed as Huntress?
This community is really the worst when it comes to self-reflection.
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You cant be serious when you say you would take old DS for old Ruin. Old Ruin was a terribly designed Perk, it was only good against bad Survivors (which are the majority). Back when Ruin was in its initial state, I was able to hit Great Skill Checks 9 out of 10 times. It did not affect me that much (aside from the lack of Bonus-Progression for hitting Greats of course). So reworked Ruin was way more annyoing for me (especially paired with Tinkerer). I would argue that it was overnerfed, but this was to remove it from the Meta.
Old DS however... Nobody wants that back. Really, did you even play back then? Old DS was not "immune for 60 seconds after an Unhook" and also no mild inconvenience like it is now. Old Ds was basically "I cannot pick up the Obsession" (unless you were able to dribble them, but this was a huge Timewaster). Non-Obsession DS was even more stupid, you thought you can pick up a Survivor just for them to be free shortly after without any tell.
BT basekit was an overall healthy change. Really, it is not really good design when the Survivor on the Hook has to rely on the Survivor unhooking them to have a Perk. I was running BT back then (and still do it, since it is still good), but when I got unhooked without BT while bringing it myself, it was really frustrating.
Regarding Killer being more stressful - see my previous post.
And as I have already written, I currently doubt it that Killer needs a Buff. You can win with every Killer, even the weakest ones, against the MAJORITY of Survivors. And if you are somewhat good at Killer, you should almost never lose with Killers like Nurse, Blight, Spirit or probably even Wesker.
And well, I have 8k hours in this game and probably more on Killer than you overall. It is not like I dont know what I am talking about. (Even tho, I would not consider myself good with any Killer, I dont win the majority of my games (except for Nurse, but this is Nurse), but I also dont blame the game the whole time...).
So yeah, maybe let the Devs do their thing and let them see IF Killers actually need a Buff. But I know that some Killers will always demand a Buff, because they struggle with this game.
And, last but not least - why should a 500 Killer win against Survivors who are more experienced? (same the other way around, why should a 500 hours Survivor win against a much more experienced Killer?) It is completely ok to lose against better players.
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"Speaking of it, why force the entire high playerbase to use the same perks in order to have a better time?"
Nobody is forced to run the same Perks in order to have a better time. I dont feel forced to run any Gen Slowdown. I mean, I could and I would have better results. But I prefer Builds which make more fun instead. Same for Survivor, I am not running DH or any Exhaustion-Perk (except for Adrenaline), simply because I dont need it. Would I survive longer if I would run DH? Sure, I would. But am I forced to run it? No, not at all.
""This community is really the worst when it comes to self-reflection." - and that was really rude."
Nope, it is the sad truth. I think players in this game rarely have the thought that THEY messed up. Because in the end, the individual player is the only constant factor in games. And if you lose way more games than you win, you are probably the problem. (Granted, this applies more to Killer, since the Killer does not have a team which might help them win or hinders them winning, but same applies to Survivor. Because the more games you play, the more you even out the chances)
I know this from another game, players with Winrates way below 50% are blaming their team all the time for losing. So, what is more likely? That those players end up in really bad times all the time OR that they are the problem?
Same with DBD - if you lose many games as Killer, what is more likely? That you always go against really strong Survivors OR the game is very oftena gainst you OR that you might be the reason you are losing more than winning?
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If BHVR gives survivors buffs (in the form of quality of life changes), but only buffs the lower tier killers as compensation, that means the higher tier killers have overall become less powerful than they were before.
It also feels bad, because trying to turn this into a "we should only make specific killer buffs", means that the quality of life changes the killers need as a whole would never happen. And some of these quality of life changes overlap heavily with accessibility issues, and BHVR said they cared about accessibility, even though we still have zero killer specific accessibility changes announced.
And we've got ZERO quality of life buffs for killers. Making killers kick pallets slightly faster is NOT a quality of life improvement. Have you ever ever heard any killer ever say "Wow, it feels better to play killer when I kick pallets ever to slightly faster"? Have you heard any killers say that any of those generic number buffs that BHVR gave killers, makes the killer experience better? Because none of them do. They were just number buffs to make the kill rate. None of those changes were designed to make killers feel better to play.
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The lack of communication on any plans for Killer updates is one of the reasons for the knee jerk reactions.
Everyone is just parroting “Devs will be able to buff Killers better against swf and solo queue”. The official dev replies seem to fall into a “wait and see “ approach with no mention of even possibly looking at the weaker Killers whom still need help regardless of the Survivor HUD update.
The hinted at “Eruption” change also doesn’t seem promising given BHVR’s history of nerfing perks into the grave like Pop and Corrupted Intervention.
Overall, things don’t look too promising for Killers in the future since we don’t know if Killer buffs are even happening and when.
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Accessibility only matters for survivor players, you goofball! Everyone knows that!
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Technically not escaping half of the time isnt even balanced. Balance would be "winning on both sides has the same chance"
If each survivor had a 50% chance to escape (win), then "winning as killer is (1-0.5)^3 + (1-0.5)^4 whixh becomes about 18% to win, and thats with considering a 3k a win too.
Mathematically more fair is a ~38% chance to escape.
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