A Question For Killer Mains
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Usually its because for one reason or another, I recognize that I need a kill NOW in order to keep things under control.
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Higher skill matches tend to see 3 out of 5 gens done by the time the killer gets 1 hook out of 12. That's 60% of the objective done by the time the killer's got about 8.3% of theirs, at this point the killer is thinking something along the lines of "alright better make a difference pretty quick or I'm screwed with nothing but 2 or 3 hooks out of friggin 12."
As this scenario begins happening more frequently, the killer gets conditioned to expect it and act accordingly or be stomped and made fun of in endgame chat for being "bad."
In short - You can't have the ability to go from 0 to 60 in 1 chase and expect the killer to act cool, especially if it's an M1 killer
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As killer, I try to play with the mindset that I'm supposed to hunt the survivors. As such I try to move away from hooks whenever I can. There are a few exceptions
1: If I just keep running into the same survivor, whether by chance or they are really bad, I'm not going to just run around them
2: If a survivor invites me to chase from the start of the game I'll usually do it. But I'm not going to suddenly stop when they are on deathhook.
3: If I think it's a SWF because then its necessary to balance things out.
4: Once 3 gens are done go gloves off. That means get someone out of the game.
A corollary to the question, and maybe a more important one, is why not tunnel? It's such an obvious strategy, why not do it?
1: Once you tunnel, the rest of the game is boring and it can also be really long. If I've eliminated a survivor, only one gen is done, and I haven't hooked anyone else, I could still be looking between another 5 and 10 minutes of gameplay if the survivors continue to unhook, heal up, etc. However, barring a few possible exceptions, I'm not going to lose. At that point being the killer is just a chore.
2: Because I know how it feels when I'm a survivor and what I do if a teammate is tunneled. If I'm a survivor in the above situation I'll take off my headphones, put on some other music, and park myself on a gen. In the first few hours I played the game watching a survivor get eliminated was tense, now unless gens are almost done, it just means the game is over.
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It’s easy and works. Tunneling out early basically guarantees a win as killer.
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Ok, ill say this with no intention of being toxic. The reason its done, is because it all but guarantees a win for the killer. With 4 gens up and 3 survivors remaining. The chance of survival is abysmal. It is by far the easiest way to ensure victory. So why wouldnt they do it is the better question to ask IMO.
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I try to go for double hooks on everyone, but if the survivors are getting gens super fast, even with fast chases where I cannot keep up as I don't run slowdown builds or if I am at one gen in those situations, I would say if I see a 2nd stage survivor and a survivor who hasn't been hooked, I am for sure going for the 2nd stage survivor.
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Higher skill matches tend to see 3 out of 5 gens done by the time the killer gets 1 hook out of 12. That's 60% of the objective done by the time the killer's got about 8.3% of theirs, at this point the killer is thinking something along the lines of "alright better make a difference pretty quick or I'm screwed with nothing but 2 or 3 hooks out of friggin 12."
It's not 60%, there's the exit gates too, and survivors slow down massively as the game progresses. This obsession with first chase is giving a really skewed perception of the game's balance and tipping point.
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First, I want to suggest you try to play killer, even if it's a fraction of your total play time. It'll make you a better survivor.
I play both roles but I don't think it matters here. I find tunneling and camping frustrating, whatever side I'm in.
As far as I'm concerned, survivors always dictate how I play.
If the game is going at what I see as a normal pace, I try to chase equally and only start killing the moment there are only 2 gens left. For that purpose, always depending on how the survivors play, I may tunnel (but at that point, I don't mind doing it.) If I've been matched against beginners, I'll even feign to miss someone or "forget" a slug where it can be healed and move away for some hypothetical point to defend.
However, if I notice, one way or another, survivors are doing 3 gens in parallel, it's likely I'll tunnel from the get go (and I will not like it at all : the match will be short, either way, and there will be no nice chases at all)
If, on top of that, they go for a gen-before-friends style and even do not heal (with exceptions like I'm Legion or Plague) then I'll even punish the tactic by forcing a hook state.
It may be simple bad luck but since the last couple of patches, especially since last Tuesday, my matches have mostly been gen-before-friends parallel gens. After a few hard fought draws and losses, I've switched to immediately tunnel (and won all my following matches). Having to win like that sapped me of my will to play so I've been on other games since. That's how much I don't like it.
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Just out of curiosity, what would you estimate your win/loss ratio is as killer, and do you have any video of your killer gameplay uploaded anywhere? Would be very interested to see what a highly-skilled "old school" killer who doesn't tunnel can do vs. a semi-competent SWF who finish gens in 4 minutes.
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(second one is old gameplay)
For me a win is 4 kills or around 9+ hooks is a win (even if it means 1 kill), 3 kills is win too, 2 or less is lost.
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Yeah...3/5 done is, in fact, 60% generator completion.
Idk what level you're playing at, but 5 minute gens are definitely a reality. The 20 second gate pull is negligible and frankly, for some killers, indefensible unless you possess nwo and/or remember me + the rng puts the gates close together. There are times that items enable the completion of 4 gens (80%) before the killer gets a single hook. It's absolutely astonishing to me that this is the case and people are actually wondering why the behaviors of camping, tunneling and slugging are so common.
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But it's not 60% of the -objective-, which is what you said in the post I quoted. The survivors' objective is to escape, not finish the gens. If all gens get done and all survivors die before they can power the gates and leave, that's still a win for the killer.
And nothing of what you said has anything to do with what I said. Survivors slow down as the match progresses. That first chase will likely have three survivors working on gens, the second chase will likely have only one. That is major slowdown compared to the start. Loads of games get hung up on 2 or fewer gens left.
It's absolutely astonishing to me that this is the case and people are actually wondering why the behaviors of camping, tunneling and slugging are so common.
Sure, blame it on gen times, even though the initial increase from 80 to 90 seconds did nothing to decrease those.
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You do realize that you are arguing about 4%. I mean your technically right but if you add the 20 seconds to the total objective time then 3 gens isnt 60% it's 56% which is a pretty small amount to be so bullish on.
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It's 20 seconds minimum. Not every survivor will be next to an exit gate. They also have to leave before they're safe, because even past the exit gate itself, you can still get downed and pulled back, done that plenty myself. There's loads of games that get 3 or 4 extra hooks after the gates are powered.
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Efficiency. A survivor on 1st or 2nd stage can still do generators/saves. Alternatively, if I can down a 2nd survivor before the first is unhooked, I will focus exclusively on hook states for these two survivors. That way if one survivor on death hook decides to run to safe structures in hopes of wasting time while their team finished the gens, I still have the option of going after a second survivor with hook states and possible take them out of the game if needed.
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Tunneling is a weird concept due to how some players are. Like I still have an old hatred for Claud’s from the 2017 insta-heal era of DBD. So I’ll almost subconsciously target them if I see two people.
Or it’s some detective work on my part to figure out who running the annoying build that will mess with me. Then I want them gone no ifs, ands, or buts.
My current targets are flashlight guys camping pallets. It’s all mood stuff usually. Heck I sometimes tunnel because someone tried to screw over a teammate.
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There are many reasons, some very obvious ones and also quite a lot of unintentional tunneling. Apart from game goes bad and you try to save it I usually tunnel in following cases (not always to death but at least to get 1-2 ppl on death hook to end momentum quickly if required):
- I am sent to a bad map with a less powerful killer, especially if it is a survivor map offering
- A survivor tries to get my attention at the beginning of the match. I ignore this player, maybe get a free hit and then tunnel whoever goes down first. You might ask why ... so reason is that I saw this often in SWF to protect the others done by a very good mate costing me 3-4 gens to down. Also they tend to anyhow run around me all the time leading to two players off gen and probably a few free hits or even hooks.
- Flashies, head on, etc. stuff. I am absolutely ok with them using their tools but this can make hooking properly hard and therefore I will work on making it easier for me.
- I enjoy chasing a specific survivor if they are really good and it is just fun. Yeah I usually throw the game by that but in the end I also play for my fun. However I guess this is still more fun for good survivors than to sit at gens all game but yeah I don't really care.
- In rare cases I just get pissed due to tb, pallet flashies or whatever. That happened more often in my early dbd times but annoys me less nowadays. Similar to intentionally slugging bully SWF to death ;-)
To be fair one factor that is mentioned quite often but definitely also true to me is that survivors will complain with basically all kind of gameplays. It seems that for quite a lot players on killer and survivor side everyone and everything is responsible for their loss except their own skills and bad behaviour is therefore completely fine. I am not too surprised as the asymmetric design of the game seems to drive that but I'd really love to see psychological studies on that but ok this is getting off topic now.
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Play Ghostface or another M1 killer for awhile and count how many times the gate gets 99'd before there's anything you can do about it. The 20 second pull doesn't mean jack, so yes, I discount it when talking about the survivor objective.
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I'm pretty new, but I purposely do my best not to tunnel. I find that having a particular "routine" depending on the style of killer makes my games less stressful. It's not super repetitive or anything like that, I don't think, but more like a hierarchy of importance depending on how the game is going.
I play Plague a lot, so at the beginning of the game I like to infect everything I can in my "territory" and infect any and all survivors I see, but I seldom wander too far from my territory. If a survivor leads me in a chase for a while, I think "good job" in my head and wander off to pressure someone else, making sure to keep pressure on the generators. If I see a few survivors together, I'll usually focus on the one I haven't seen before depending on how far into the game it is; when there are fewer generators left, I'll take down the sickly gazelle if I see them (I usually see certain survivors much more often than others.)
At the end of the match, I try my best not to camp hooks, but if it really is down to the wire and I have no kills, I will. Playing this way seems to get me a lot of Bloodpoints and generally makes the game more enjoyable, rather than stressing and feeling as if I'm winning or losing.
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I tunnel every game because I like the competitive side of dbd. It is stressful but it feels rewarding when you win. It also gives the game a faster pace. I tried not tunneling one time, but after a couple of minutes I was genuinely dying from boredom, I got so bored that my will to chase survivors almost left. The reason for that is that that game felt more like a farming simulator but instead of collecting crops you have to collect survivors. It also feels stagnating spending so much time on a single game trying to 12-hook everybody, a game with tunneling lasts about 10 minutes, and a game without it maybe 16 or 17.
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Tunneling is a way to ease the pressure during the match, as removing one person makes the assymetrical situation of facing more people than you less opressive. And by tunneling i mean: focusing one person that can be removed from the game early instead of alternating between hooking every survivor.
Tunneling is not always the smart strategy. From a macro point of view, you can "tunnel wrong", killing one person and giving 3 free escapes to the rest of the team. Or even take 4 escapes if they can make the rescue. You just "tunnel" when you are certain that you can generate more pressure than lose while chasing the person. But it still can go wrong and you lose the match because you tried to tunnel.
Anyway, i always give a second chance to a survivor if he/she is in death hook, unless i'm in certain maps - Borgo, Haddonfield - or against certain teams - a full toolboxes squad, a very coordinated team.
If you are getting tunneled too much, try to use Off The Record or Decisive Strike (even nerfed it can make a difference in the match), Dead Hard, Sprint Burst, etc. Also, try to loop in stronger loops and drop pallet with safety. If you make killers take too much time to catch you, they will probably leave.
Don't take too personal: think from a macro perspective - as most of the good killers do - and you will see that taking a player out of the match in the right time is what make the difference between a win and a loss.
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I do tunnel if I have to, that means if the survivors are splitting and are very efficient at doing gens its rlly hard to win the game without tunneling or without many slowdown perks. This also depends on the killer I play. Killers like Nurse, Blight, Wesker, Xeno, Twins can mostly win without the need of tunneling, because you can delay the game with quick downs, but if even one chase is to long you will lose, if you dont have slowdown perks or tunnel. Means if I rlly want to win I look at the state of the round and decide if I need to tunnel or not.
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