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It's a shame Zanshin Tactics is so bad compared to Windows of Opportunity.

JustWhimsical
JustWhimsical Member Posts: 590
edited February 2023 in Feedback and Suggestions

This perk, compared to windows which allows you to plan out a route is just so bad, considering you rarely ever can force the survivors into areas to get value out of it yes there are a few killers that can and will benefit from knowing things like vault locations like Bird lady, but it's just simply not really good to run it whereas Windows is a great pick for extending chases and knowing information you likely wouldn't know unless in a swf and even then not everyone in a swf calls out what pallets they are dropping.

Would it be too much for this perk to get a secondary effect, I am not really sure what secondary effect it should get, but do you think it would make this perk a better pick compared to its survivor counterpart?

Comments

  • Dinan
    Dinan Member Posts: 33

    it needs a complete rework cuz its useless, same with premonition and this is not happening etc etc.

  • TeabaggingGhostface
    TeabaggingGhostface Member Posts: 3,108

    Maybe it could force blindness on injured survivors you're chasing

  • JustWhimsical
    JustWhimsical Member Posts: 590

    Maybe if they made blindness a little more appealing, but I always thought blindness, after hemorrhage got reworked, is the weakest status for killer.

  • RainehDaze
    RainehDaze Member Posts: 2,573

    Third Seal is tied to a hex.

    Zanshin Tactics showing you nearby vaults and pallets and applying Blindness to an injured survivor you're in chase with (or a survivor, etc.) and for a few seconds after would be... well, it wouldn't be great, it's mostly just a negation of WoO, but it's at least something.

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,842

    Maybe merge it with Nemesis? That or add a side effect with Blindness. It still wouldn't be great but at least better than it is now.

    But for the love of god please don't remove the current effect. There are killers that can benefit from this information.

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,347
    edited February 2023

    Yeah.

    Since Survivors typically lead the chase, it's important to know what tile resources you have available in front of you.

    Since Killers follow in chase, it's much less important.

    Could call it "Pocket Sand" and Afflict Survivors with Blindness for 30s at the start of a Chase. (lol)

  • dinomazing
    dinomazing Member Posts: 119

    Your survivors really shouldn't be leading the chase. They can't hurt you. Their only ability is to run.

    And you can either direct where they go as killer or take a health state from them if they don't follow your lead.

  • Carth
    Carth Member Posts: 1,182

    This isn't true at all. As a killer you can attempt to head off a survivor sure, and there's a few killers who can teleport ahead(typically to fixed locations...tvs, lockers, gens), dash forward quickly in a straight line, or have some other way of moving faster but there's exactly one killer who can truly cut off survivors at will and that's nurse. Everyone else the survivor 100% leads the chase as the TR + red stain gives a huge head start to the survivor. The tradeoff is due to the killers naturally higher move speed the killer will eventually catch up and some killers get to use their power to attempt to head off a survivor but the chasing is always the survivor leading(defined as picking a direction and moving in it - typically to a tile to begin looping or some other structure)

    If we assume your statement is true that killers are the leaders I'd have to ask you to explain why zanshin isn't as popular as windows by a huge margin. If killers "lead" the chase then zanshin would be just as useful as windows is for survivors since you can lead them better. However this isn't the case as evidenced by perk useage rights in the past as well as third party tracking sites and the majority of people in this thread who all agree zanshin is bad.

  • ReverseVelocity
    ReverseVelocity Member Posts: 4,545
    edited February 2023

    I swear by Zanshin on Clown and Pyramid Head. It's a generally niche perk though and could 100% benefit from a secondary effect. I wouldn't run it on many other killers in it's current state.

  • Devil_hit11
    Devil_hit11 Member Posts: 8,804

    precisely. why would they give you a hex perk effect in a normal perk?

  • RainehDaze
    RainehDaze Member Posts: 2,573

    By making its duration and circumstances narrower. Such as "whilst in chase".

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,347
    edited February 2023

    Noted by @Carth , that’s elaborating on what I mean by typically Survivors lead the chase.

    If you’re not a mobile Killer, typically in chase the Survivors run, and you approach them over time, though they can choose where to run.

    Yes, for some stealthy insta-down Killers like Ghostface or a 99% Myers I can see it being useful for approaching a generator from the pallet side to prevent Survivors from using the pallet as a means of distancing themselves from your insta-down. However knowledge of tiles can usually replace that, as well as you knowing if you broke a Pallet there before or not.

    For long range teleport Killers it’s still kind of hit or miss as the 32m range is a bit short to understand the pallet density of other locations that you haven’t been at yet at the start of the Trial to corral Survivors into RNG dead zones and of course availability of those teleports.

    It can probably help some setup Killers like Trapper or Hag to understand where to place their traps quickly, but is a niche use and likely overshadowed by other Perks, especially as the player becomes more knowledgeable about tile types.

    In all seriousness if you wanted to make the perk thematic to its description for how the game currently plays “You are mentally alert and aware of key points on the battlefield”

    I’d do something like this:

    “Damaging the Health State of a Survivor shows you the Aura of the Generator with the Most amount of Repair progress for 4/5/6s, the repair progress can be determined by the intensity of its Aura.”

    Edit: Or to be similar to its current incarnation “You see the repair progress of generators within 32m by the intensity of their Auras”

  • Carth
    Carth Member Posts: 1,182
    edited February 2023

    By this logic no regression perks outside of ruin should exist in the game nor should any exceed base regression rates as ruin exists and is a hex perk.

  • Pepsidot
    Pepsidot Member Posts: 1,662
    edited February 2023

    What if it had a really strange effect to pallets - once per pallet. So if the killer m1's a pallet that's still upright, it respawns at the next closest pallet tile. Could be used to move the location of strong pallets and could be used in chases.

    May encourage pre-dropping though - although that's less time wasted looping - a bit like spirit fury + enduring. Also, could be useful, but also detrimental sometimes so the killer would need to be careful. Could also be too beneficial for killers if they try to 3 gen in areas that already have very few pallet spawns. Just a random thought/idea.

    Edit: If it's too good - make it so survivors see the aura of the new pallet spawn for a few seconds and/or increase the recovery time when the killer m1's - this would also be unaffected by unrelenting.

  • Turretcube
    Turretcube Member Posts: 469
    edited February 2023

    Maybe Blindness could be made to affect the survivor icon hud as well? Don't know if it would change anything, but it might make blindness perks and add-ons more appealing and make small affect's that have been suggested here possibly better?

  • Steakdabait
    Steakdabait Member Posts: 1,277

    i mean WoO is a non-issue perk to start with. so i don't really care at all if the killer WoO is bad. WoO just shows where pallets are, it doesn't magically make survivors good at looping. Complain about the fact that these maps can spawn set ups can spawn in the first place rather than complaining about a perk that lets you see them.