Leatherface movement speed
Hello!
Why Leatherface has very strange code in his Chainsaw Sweep movement speed?
Now Leatherface reaches Chainsaw Sweep maximum movement speed after 60% duration of his first charge.
This code exists since December 2020 | Twins DLC. They changed way how Leatherface reaches his Chainsaw Sweep maximum movement speed. They nerfed Leatherface very significantly and we didn't get a information about it.
What is a problem with his acceleration someone can ask.
With default Bubba first charge duration is 2 seconds. It means that he reaches Chainsaw Sweep maximum movement speed after 1.2 seconds.
Acceleration nerfs all duration addons on Leatherface.
1) Award Winning Chili - because of this code he needs 1.5 seconds to reach maximum speed.
2) Chili - because of this code he needs 1.35 seconds to reach maximum speed.
3) Because of that we got a very huge problem with his Ultra Rare addon - Carburetor Tunning Guide.
He needs 60% of his first charge to reach maximum movement speed, right? With Carburetor Tunning Guide Cannibal has 1 big charge. It means he needs 4.5 seconds to reach maximum movement speed
(7.5 seconds * 60%) = 4.5 seconds
It means Carburetor Tunning Guide doesn't work like intendent and this addon needs to be fixed or reworked.
Question is - how Leatherface's acceleration should work? How acceleration was working before Twins DLC?
I have screen from Wiki, how Leatherface should work and it would be very healthy for his addons.
He was reaching maximum speed after 0.6 second always. No first charge duration or something.
It was really good, because Carburetor Tunning Guide wasn't bugged & Chili addons together were a good combination for Cannibal. Now with double Chili addons Bubba needs 1.65 seconds to reach maximum movement speed - it's garbage. He is so slow at the start.
Can we get old acceleration back on Cannibal? It would fix Carburetor Tunning Guide & make him much fun to play. If someone say that he is too strong and he deserved to this nerf - I completely dissagre with this.
It's very easy to counter his power. A lot of invisible Hitboxes on certain maps, lockers & windows & more & more.
What you think guys?
Comments
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yeah its pretty weird how acceleration works. his total distance traveled without a single chili is too short, but stacking chili is punishing, so he is pigeon held to run award chili+beast marks. If you run out of purple chili, you run yellow chili but yellow speed offers no positive in term of total distance gained and only gives negative to his chainsaw charge speed, so this pigeon him into running primor blub.
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As a Bubba Main I can say that Award Winning Chili & Chili addons are good just with speed addons. Chili addons without speed are garbage at high level. I like speed addons. Maybe small number, but in good hands these addons can be very helpful.
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opposite opinion. I think chili add-on are mandatory while speed is optional. I could play leatherface with just yellow chili and no other add-on but it makes your chainsaw a lot shorter meaning that you have to rev closer to the survivor.
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Movement speed addons on Leatherface are very underrated. If you know when you should rev while using speed addons you can achieve insane value. Without Chili we need more skill in our charges management (pressing tokens perfectly). Beast's Marks increases movement speed from 132.25% to 136.21%. It's massive against Survivors on high level. Duration isn't that important like movement speed in my opinion. But, of course duration is strong and that's why speed & duration together is the best combo addons on Leatherface. For example instead of playing Yellow Chili & Primer Bulb I prefer to play Beast's Marks & Primer Bulb. It's much better. Movement speed is increased & Bubba is getting movement speed faster (no chili).
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both speed add-on decrease your chainsaw charge time by 12%. you lose distance for using them at the start but with duration add-on, the extra movement speed loss is made up by 2.5-3rd charge if used with purple chili. Using only speed, you do not have enough duration at base-kit for speed to add a noticeable increase in total distance because the chainsaw ends too quickly(even with perfect timing) to get a noticeable benefit.
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I had a feeling the Chili addons were having an effect on his movement speed. This makes a lot of sense and it explains the Tuning Guide bug. Hope they fix it.
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I need to repeat it. Don't underestimate speed addons on Leatherface. With speed addons you can get a down on the loop. Without speed addons, you will get Pallet on your face, because Survivor will reach a loop.
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It very easy to notice especially with both chilis addons together. I hope it will be fixed!
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I see, I can't remember the last time I used both together. I usually run the purple one + Beast Marks.
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Purple Chili & Beast's Marks is the best combo for Leatherface. So, good choice!
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"What you think guys?"
I think you should be happy you have movement speed buffs on addons with no negatives.
Go have a look at Billy's addons for a point of reference.
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If they somehow made his camping less oppressive, they could make his chainsaw a little stronger in chase to be more consistent against good survs. But I'm not sure how to nerf his camp in a reasonable way.
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Leatherface isn't working correct. His acceleration makes his "best" addons very weak sometimes. Addons like: Chili & Award Winning Chili & Carburetor Tunning Guide are much weaker because of that. Chili addons have negatives - longer acceleration. Carburetor Tunning Guide is useless at this point. Depth Gauge Rake has 2 big penalties and 50% of his addons are weak normally. Fox example: The Grease, Long Guide Bar, Tantrum Addons, Shop Lubricant, All Chains...
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If they would make him stronger in chase, maybe Bubbas would play more normally than camping. For Bubba Mains acceleration change would be very nice. Acceleration now is very bad - it makes him much much weaker.
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How much stronger in chase should you be?
Honestly I think they probably should adress the acceleration issue but make LF go down to 110% speed so that he uses his chainsaw aggressively.
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It would destroy Leatherface. C or D killer
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The only thing that would do is encourage camping even more. His camping needs to be addressed, but by no means is he OP in a chase. I would even argue that he’s too addon dependent and should have yellow chili basekit in return for nerfing his camping (which they should, because his camping potential is gross).
They can remove/rework the purple chili into something else so the best case scenario would be 2.5 seconds total per charge if you still ran yellow chili (if purple stayed then you could get up to 3 by combining both addons plus the basekit buff and that’s too much).
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I dissagre with these changes. He doesn't need longer duration at base kit. We are talking about changing his acceleration to make his addons healthy for him and that's all. With correct acceleration code duration addons would be nice to play. Playing with Carburetor Tunning Guide is worse than everything & playing chili addons without some speed is also not the best. All What I want to make acceleration little bit more healthy & just better. I'm not talking about rework or something - just a small change in his acceleration code. I'm A Bubba Main since 2019 and I suffer a lot... Massive bugs on him - like massive cooldowns (fixed 8 months ago), bugged Carburetor Tunning Guide, very bad acceleration, sometimes he can not use his Chainsaw for rest of the game... & more & more. He is very balanced Killer in my opinion.
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I think he's asking for acceleration to not scale as hard. Like instead of going from 86% m/s to 132.25% over 2 seconds(?) which is like entire first charge, he is likely asking something like 110% m/s to 132.25% m/s.
what that does is make his chainsaw less add-on dependent because he is moving faster at the start so he is covering more distance. I am not entirely sure, but i think what acceleration add-on used to do is shorten how fast it takes for leatherface to go from 86 m/s to his max movement speed. so for example, if it takes 2 second to from 86 to 132.25%, a 20% acceleration would reduce it to 1.6 seconds. that is why those add-on felt like they were doing nothing because... well by the time you accelerated, your chainsaw would end.
again i am not expert or anything, but that is what I understand from playing him. 110% leatherface? your crazy.
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They should just bring back old acceleration (before Twins DLC). Bubba should reach max. speed after 0.6 seconds everytime. Now, he needs 60% of his first charge and it's destroying his addons.
- Award Winning Chili - he needs 1.5 seconds (instead of 1.2 seconds) to reach max. speed.
- Chili - he needs 1.35 seconds (instead of 1.2 seconds) to reach max. speed
- Carburetor Tunning Guide - he needs 4.5 seconds (instead of 1.5 seconds) to reach max. speed (addon is completely destroyed)
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At this moment
- Beast's Marks - 12% of charge time penalty
- Award Winning Chili - longer acceleration
- Depth Gauge Rake - 18% charge time penalty & 2% movement speed (useless addon)
- Carburetor Tunning Guide - completely destroyed by acceleration code
- Knife Scratches - 12% of charge time penalty
About useless addons
- Chainsaw File & Homemade Muffler - 0.5 or 1 second of Tantrum is completely garbage. Someone can say it's good for beginners. It's not true. Recharge addons are much better.
- Long Guide Bar & The Grease - Bubba can hold his Chainsaw longer, just good for facecampers on the hook.
- Grisly Chains & Begrimed Chains & Rusted Chains - drop items, okay fine. Mangled & Broken is very bad for Leatherface because his power is to down Survivor instantly. Survivors instead of healing and waste time to it, they will just gen rush gens.
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i think it always worked like that. they fixed a bug at one point for carburettor tuning guide to make it scale off acceleration and that change made that add-on worthless. his add-on are really bad apart from 3 add-on(both chili and beast mark if used with purple chili). iri flesh and primor blub is ok but cooldowns for abilities are not fun for killer.
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I posted screen how old acceleration was working. He was reaching movement speed after 0.6 seconds everytime. That's why all duration addons were very good (including Carburetor). I'm a Bubba Main I can notice every small change on this Killer. And you are wrong about double chili - these addons with current acceleration are garbage.
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-"110% leatherface? your crazy."
I am guessing you never saw the movie where he hits himself in the leg with his chainsaw?
Horvath always said if he had been on the team Billy would have been 110% movement. LF would make a lot more sense if he were 110% speed but to compesnate you get a lot more speed when you used your saw. Most of the speed addons would go but you would get some of the speed as base kit.
Look at Billy and how bad his saw is right now compared to say 2016 (not talking about before flick nerf - ignore that). LF isn't even on the radar when you consider how pathetic Billy is right now.
There are a number of really stupid things about LF that make no sense. For one LF has no collision with hook poles. That would be a really smart way to adjust this killer so that he can't do the most obviously troll thing that everyone knows bad LF players do.
LF overall is one of the most boring and simple killers : walk behind someone and chainsaw. Changing him so that he needs the saw to "catch up" would make him a lot more interesting. In one sense he would be more like spirit with a chainsaw in that he uses his saw for movement and chase (obviously without the stealth part).
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I need to repeat it. I don't wanna talk about rework for Leatherface. I just want a small change in his code - acceleration code. That's all. I know Billy is garbage and he needs a huge buff. But there - I'm talking about Leatherface, I don't care about Hilbilly, but of course I would love to see him in better state. And I just gave you examples that Bubba has garbage addons as well (2-3 exceptions). About using his Chainsaw. On high level, just Bubba Mains knows how to use his Chainsaw efficiently. I guessing that 99% players in Dead By Daylight don't understand his power at all.
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Look at Billy and how bad his saw is right now compared to say 2016 (not talking about before flick nerf - ignore that). LF isn't even on the radar when you consider how pathetic Billy is right now.
Billy's position in the game should not be related to another killer's position in the game. Billy is pretty bad. i'd give Billy higher priority over LF.
LF overall is one of the most boring and simple killers : walk behind someone and chainsaw. Changing him so that he needs the saw to "catch up" would make him a lot more interesting.
You certainly do not play much leatherface. leatherface at high-level is based around catch-up with chainsaw in the chase. LF at 110% would be worse at catch-up and worse at pallet break zoning. Leatherface just has bad base-kit(for high level), but both his chili and beast marks enable him to counter hold-w strategies if your good at him which most LF are not good at him. he takes too much game-sense for most players.
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-"Billy's position in the game should not be related to another killer's position in the game. Billy is pretty bad. i'd give Billy higher priority over LF."
This is a logic fault. First let me say I feel that all the killers should be within 15% power level of each other from the best to worst. The only exception is if some killers are "allowed to be bad" and would have MMR caps. Imagine for example if Trapper could never actually go past 1450 MMR keeping you out of the high tier bracket. Would that be fair? It might but why not make him competitive so that he's a B+ killer base kit insted of a D killer requiring an iri addon (bloody coil) to be viable. Trapper with the Bloody coil base kit would be "tolerable". Let him have 4 traps in hand base and that would be a good start to make him decent. Change the purple sack back to +2 traps in hand (meaning you also start with +2 extra traps).
-"leatherface at high-level is based around catch-up with chainsaw in the chase. LF at 110% would be worse at catch-up and worse at pallet break zoning"
I am fully aware. I am suggesting to retune him so that he's 110% but the saw is better - yet more necessary to really start a chase.
This would make LF a unique chainsaw experience very different from Billy. LF would be more of a pouncing charger and in some ways would be like Wesker (although since he came first Wesker is really more like LF around loops).
Much like Wesker mains do LF would also be doing more "chainsaw for distance". Two could be changed to do things like have a longer paced slower saw charge OR be a more intense shorter charge.
The biggest problem with the game is that it always feels like killer is an afterthought. LF is super low on the priority list and might never get fixed if they are going to lose him with the TCM game coming out soon.
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I think that your idea closer to my idea for wesker. I think wesker would be better if his dash was more usable at pallet loops and there was more precedence on being good at landing his virulent bound and less strength in the infection mechanic/m1 play. 110% m/s could work for Wesker if pallet sliding did not kick you out of his ability and he had a bit more movement speed between his 1st/2nd bound. I also think it would be pretty cool if he had an add-on that added +1 max virulent bound charges. your idea works more for him because Wesker has better direct mobility and better direct potencial to down people at pallets with correct adjustments.
Billy and Wesker for me are pretty similar in terms of curving strategy at loops.
LF is similar in some regards yet a bit different in other regards. LF relies more on precedence of survivor greeding loops to deplete his chainsaw tokens but not over greeding that his chainsaw 1 shot downs when rotating pallets. if you can make leatherface spend all 3 tokens when rotating a loop. he has really long cooldown when it comes to recharge his dash tokens such that you can get to the next pallet before he can charge his chainsaw and down you between the pallet. His cooldown is careful thought where if survivor stays healthy, the leatherface wants to keep greeding his chainsaw to get instant down but if the survivor stays injured and you break the pallet in the correct manner. His pallet break is fast enough that he can hit you as m1 killer before you get to the next tile. If he was 110% m/s you could potentially play entire game injured vs leatherface because he would not be able to punish you with his pallet break due to 110% m/s catch-up. The other aspect of 110% m/s is that you could potential hold-w outside of his chainsaw max distance meaning there would not be good moment to use his chainsaw because your constantly out of range to do so.
LF chainsaw is more of side ability. he's kinda m1 based but his m1 based gameplay is like... chainsaw based? I am not entirely sure how to describe it. His chainsaw replaces his m1 play but his m1 play modified with chainsaw in mind. in that sense he is simiar to old billy yet different.
The biggest problem with the game is that it always feels like killer is an afterthought. LF is super low on the priority list and might never get fixed if they are going to lose him with the TCM game coming out soon.
I am not sure what to say about this. I would say survivor's fun is emphasized more. There is more care into survivor being fun to play then killer being fun to play. Often when killer is fun to play, the survivor is whiny because they find killer unfun to play against. LF is ok but he is add-on dependant.
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As if bubba players even used it to chase anyway, lol
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They already confirmed he is staying, so idk why you're bringing up he might be removed lol
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This post isn't to talk about Billy and other Killers, sorry. This discussion is pretty useless.
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