http://dbd.game/killswitch
Nerf All Powerful Perks To The Ground?
Okay, so something that I've been thinking of lately is the question of "what if all the A and S tier perks on both sides were nerfed to bring them down to a B or C tier?"
I started thinking of this after I considered how there are so many perks in the game, and I usually only see about 20-30 perks in circulation when I play. On both sides. This got me thinking of how so many perks are so powerful that a survivor or killer can plainly argue that they must rely on them to win.
On the survivor side, we have perks like Dead Hard, Sprint Burst, Iron Will, Windows of Opportunity, Adrenaline, Self-Care, Prove Thyself, etc.,
On the killer side, we have perks like BBQ, Eruption, Deadlock, Pain Res., STBFL, Lethal Pursuer, Pop Goes the Weasel, etc.
I'm just wondering if all these perks were nerfed so hard to the point where most perks could all be considered what is B-tier now, would skillful gameplay rise?
Obviously, a lot of these perks are very different, some each would have to be nerfed in different ways as they are used during different times within a match and in different scenarios. Some would have to be technically nerfed less than others.
I also wonder if we would see less metas formed if all perks were made with the intent of them offering very little value to a player. (Probably not as specific builds could see more of a rise with every new DLC and such)
If you ask me, I think the game would be better off if perks and items offered basically as little as possible to a player, at least alone, specific builds would obviously add value to each perk. I wish the game put more onto the player's actual skill instead of how they use their perks within a match (which I know, corresponds to their skill, but I think it is a specific section of a player's overall skill). I also wish the devs stamped out every meta when they see them form (not perk combos, METAS, the popularity makes a difference).
Maybe I'm crazy. As someone who plays both sides I'll admit I love my BBQ and Windows.
Edit: I love how everyone is focused on which perks I picked to represent the "powerful" side of perks. Some are up their because I often see them in circulation, other are there because I legit just looked up "most powerful" or "most used" DBD perks. I'll give you all Deadlock, Self Care, and Eruption (because its getting nerfed) for perks that shouldn't really be on the lists, but that's all. Remember perks can be powerful in different ways and at different times. As of writing this edit, only three of you have actually put some thought into the idea of "nerfing all powerful perks" to a lower tier. and lessening the effects perks have on a game overall. So thanks to you three 👍️
Also, look at all-powerful Otzdarva's perk tierlists and you will only find slight differences between what he deems powerful perks and what I do.
https://i.imgur.com/fYz7obB.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/0PJU7Cp.jpg
Edit #2: I see a lot of people moaning about how BBQ isn't a powerful perk. It gives killers the perfect piece of info at the best time. Even though it is a very simple perk, it is powerful. Not OP, but powerful and convenient. Players see and use it all the time. What makes a perk popular? Its power. I wouldn't want it totally nerfed into the ground, because I don't think there's too much you could do with it in terms of a nerf. But it hella qualifies for my list lol.
Comments
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That is an interesting idea. I agree that the extremes on both sides should be toned down. For example a killer should not be able to hold a 3 gen for 40+ minutes because their perks regress the gen every time a survivor made a bit of progress. Also survivors should not be able to get out of 4+ bad situations back to back with their perks.
I'm not exactly sure how the balancing would work though because the balance we have right now is largely achieved through perks.
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Problem is that people have no idea what an A tier perk is.
On the survivor side, we have perks like Dead Hard, Sprint Burst, Iron Will, Windows of Opportunity, Adrenaline, Self-Care, Prove Thyself, etc.,
On the killer side, we have perks like BBQ, Eruption, Deadlock, Pain Res., STBFL, Lethal Pursuer, Pop Goes the Weasel, etc.
Case in point.
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I'm kinda blown away that you think BBQ, self care, and pop goes the weasel are among the "all powerful" perks. Theyre not even considered strong perks.
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There shouldnt be any S tier perks on either side. Games should be won by a players skill and not what perks they chose to bring.
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Precisely. I have NO idea why the others are claiming the perks I listed aren't super powerful. The fact that they appear in matches as frequently as they do speaks to their power alone. Obviously there's more to it tho.
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I hella disagree. If they're not some of the most powerful perks, then explain to me why they appear so much. I said POWERFUL, not OP.
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Listing Deadlock was more of a way of pointing out a meta. BBQ gives killers great info for when they need it the most, which makes it powerful. It's definitely not OP tho.
Idk why you wouldn't consider Iron Will and Windows of Opportunity powerful lmao.
Self Care is not great anymore, but its still in heavy circulation. That's the only one where I'll say you've pointed out a flaw in my post.
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Self care is the only one I'll give you.
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Not nerfed to the ground, but nerfed, sure.
But I do agree somewhat with this philosophy even if I wouldn't say all the perks you listed necessarily need to be nerfed to achieve this goal. At the very least Self-Care and Pop don't really need more nerfs. And Eruption is getting nerfed in a few days regardless. But the reason this is a good idea is because a lot of the meta perks are meta simply because of the type of perk it is and there's no real way to bring every weaker perk on each side up to that level without making some of them busted. Strong perks on each side are already too impactful as it is and this effectively addresses that. Buffing weak perks up to the level of the current meta would just exacerbate that issue.
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Someone understood what I said lol. Too many people are thinking "Damn you really think THIS perk is powerful!?".
I just want to put the idea out there.
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You understand
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Lost me as iron will and self care
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Sounds like it would lead to more tunneling and camping because killers wouldn't be able to cover for their powers' weaknesses with perks as well.
Also, why should good perks be made worse rather than making the bad perks better?
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Do I have to explain why Iron Will is powerful? Self Care I get but it's up there because it's still in heavy circulation from what I can see.
But Iron Will... 😒 cmon
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I find it hard to believe that you see pop in a lot of your games when call of brine, overcharge, and pain res exist in their current state. The only way i could see pop appearing is if it was being run along side all three of the other perks listed. and even then, i seriously doubt it.
There's an argument for BBQ, but a flimsy one at that
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iron will is only really strong on like 3 survivors. and even on those survivors you still have scratch marks and blood.
even before the nerf it was the least problematic meta perk
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Its still one of the stronger survivor perks. Its either Iron Will or you moan every 3 seconds or something.
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I think the game would get super boring for survivors. Perks and items are all they have that makes the gameplay varied.
Killers at least have powers that are diverse and interesting, with which you can express skill.
Survivor would become just a lil dude running.
I'd rather have unused perks buffed to be better contenders than pointless nerfing just for the sake of nerfing.
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BBQ isn't powerful. It's decent. Deadlock is not powerful, it's just an incredibly easy comfort pick. Iron Will isn't good anymore since its value was removed and it gets disabled by perks that are almost mandatory. Windows of Opportunity is a learning tool but outside of knowing when a pallet is broken, it does nothing that a normal survivor player won't learn from just playing.
The problem is that you're conflating 'popular' with 'powerful'. But perks aren't just picked for being strong. Hell, even acquisition muddies the waters already. Yeah, you're going to see more Self-Cares than a lot of other healing perks because Self-Care is on Claudette, a free starting survivor. DS, prior to 6.1, is another perfect example of this: The perk itself was dead weight in almost all circumstances, but it was a perk that massively improved game health and thus had an astronomical pick-rate.
That's why I mentioned that people have a really bad grasp on what is and isn't an 'A-tier' perk.
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I've been saying they should do perk overhauls every few months if they can manage it. Shake up as many as they can. That way there's none of this over-reliance on certain perks. You'll need to adapt and, well, get your general game sense up then.
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Imo there is no such think as 'nerfing A tier perks to make them C tier' there is only so much nerfing you can do before the perk isn't itself anymore and even then it will still get used a lot.
What needs to happen is people lightening up and actually try to have fun with what they're doing, rather then getting so wound up when you don't win. Killers are still doing very well on the whole despite the likes of DH and CoH in play. The game is as balanced as its ever been.
I don't expect to win any of my matches, so its a nice surprise when I do and I genuinely enjoy the game.
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yeah because it worked so well last time and hasn’t totally made the game worse no meta shake up is needed to be honest they need to revert perks on both sides cause the mega shake up did more damage than good and by nerfing more perks to the ground it’s just making the game feel even worse just because there are good perks does not result in them needing a nerf
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What if we started just by nerfing the most complained about killer perk, and the most complained about survivor perk, which would be eruption and dead hard? Considering how many things get nerfed by of survivor complaints, surely we should be able to have a heavy nerf for dead hard, since it's the most complained about survivor perk by miles.
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No dh has already been nerfed and won’t be nerfed again lol
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I mean sure I guess. Typically speaking so few perks are run because another perk does basically what they do but better. Not sure what you can really do short of nerfing the popular perks into the ground. Which ultimately will lead to a new probably even worse meta.
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What an amazing "nerf"
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I’d like a weekend where all perks are killswitched so we can see how much they impact gameplay and balance from there
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Nah. Game would be boring and stale. Besides, a new meta would form anyway and we’d back to square 1. You can’t “get rid of the meta”. It is not possible without getting rid of all perks.
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Disagreeing with Windows
With the rng in this game there is no amount of learning that will let you know where everything is.
Knowing if a strong window has spawned or is blocked from a distance is very strong info
It's the most used perk after dead hard for a reason
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Then it would mean that there would be Killer favored Perks (builds)
Like Bamboozle on Bubba, Corrupt on most Killers, Sloppy on most Killers
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You loved the old Dead Hard didn't you?
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I bait as much as I can and most times when I'm successful on a bait the survivor gets the old DH for distance. Eating DH is pretty normal for Demo. The only thing you can do vs decent survivors is bait the shred when they are at the corner with flicking your camera as the hiss happens. This means outplaying the survivor rewards the killer with old DH.
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Idk what you're saying lmao
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I feel like this is a problem with Demo though. Which really sucks as BHVR can't do anything to him anymore
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I don't think it's isolated to just Demo. How do you outplay DH at tiles as Billy? If you use your chainsaw the survivor can just E it. Same thing should apply to Bubba. Huntress gets her hits near corners which allows DH to have a predictable window. Wesker can struggle the same way with DH. Knight/Nemesis are free 3rd/4th health states. As nem you can just E the zombie. Demo might be the most affect by the perk but I don't think its fine vs a bunch of m2 killers.
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I posed a DH rework on another thread just now. Can I get your thoughts?
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"meta" perks used on all Killers
All Killers will use the same perks... Bubbas running the same perks
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Gen kick meta used to be a thing when I posted this. Yeah it was pretty common with those perks.
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