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Did we really have to change Background Player??
This was the perk I was most excited about playing ever since I tried it on the PTB, it had really great synergy with some Perks like BT, No One Left Behind, Guardian...
Honestly it was super fun to play and made for some really incredible saves with a nice self-speed boost as well to get away after unhooking especially during EGC...
So why did it need to be changed? I was most looking forward to playing more of this because I only had a small time to enjoy it on the PTB.. I'm really sad to see that this was one of the major perk changes going into live :(
Comments
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It needed changing because it was a farmers wet dream. One could just farm the survivor off hook, and then sprint away. It would encourage tunneling like barely any other perk.
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Because it directly encouraged tunnelling?
The perk should never have made it past the theory stage, let alone making it into the PTB. It was fundamentally a terrible idea.
Even the mere possibility of this perk being in play would increase tunnelling. Why go after the rescuer if they're just going to Sprint Burst away?
If you're relying on this perk being paired with another one, Guardian of all things, to prevent it from being used for tunnelling, that's already a red flag.
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Because "iT IncEnTIviZeD tUNnElINg" according to the community. In reality it was an interesting perk made for a specific build but people only see perks being used cynically so like reassurance they got a good perk nerfed. This community has a habit of getting in it's own way sometimes.
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It encouraged farming and tunnelling which is the last perk the game needs right now in its current state
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You actually play DBD, right?
"I wOuLdNt UsE iT tO tUnNel, So WhY wOulD aNyOnE ElSe?"
Lets just give the killer a perk that shows them the aura of a survivor for 30 seconds after being unhooked, so that they can avoid them. Sounds fair right?
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I don't see a ton of on purposeful griefing from survivors to each other in my games. Maybe my MMR is too high for that and you see it at lower levels, it's possible I guess.
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It's not just griefing from survivors. If the killer perceives the rescuer as a less optimal target, then they will go after the unhooked survivor. This perk was undermining everything that BT, OTR, DS, etc. is trying to do. Encourage the killer to avoid the unhooked survivor.
You know what a much better alternative would be?
- When you unhook another survivor, you gain a 8% increase to repair speeds for 60 seconds.
Bingo, you now make the unhooker the target instead of the unhooked. You combine this sort of perk, with something like Sprint Burst, to make you a difficult to catch target. If you get chased, you save your friends, if you don't get chased, you smash gens.
Save friends, smash gens.
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The new version isn't as unhealthy for the game, and it does at least have a niche in flashy-save/breakout/sabo builds.
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So your solution for a perk change for it in a game where gens go to fast...is to make them go faster?
Also old background player literally paired with BT. You used that with, BT and guardian and it punished the killer for going back to hook cuz neither target would really be good to go after. Instead we have a perk that legit either just gives the killer free hits when the survivor runs up and fails the flashlight save or literally nothing but free exhaustion for a survivor on a gen.
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Again, if the perk relies on being paired with other perks to prevent it from being abused, it's already a terrible idea.
"gens go too fast" is an issue of balancing, and perception.
Gens don't go too fast if you prevent them going too fast, and this wouldn't make gens go too fast if you chased the unhooking survivor instead of the unhooked survivor.
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Literally what is wrong with tunneling? It’s a viable strategy that the developers of this game constantly reinforce. What’s wrong with another kil—survivor perk designed to make it more efficient?
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Yes, they had to change it because people forgot Guardian removes any traces from the rescued survivor, and the only two thought processes people around here have after being rescued are "I need to immediately reengage in a chase with the killer" and "I'm just going to stand still under hook to get healed even if it is to my team's detriment".
No one in this entire community knows how to run behind cover or, God forbid, hide on a locker for 5 seconds to avoid the killer tunneling them out even after every trace of their existence has been removed and they've been given a speed boost to make it easier for them to run away.
Background Player + Guardian was a really cool combo that made tunneling off the hook harder and made rescuing people safer. The only thing this combo needed was a small push. Some sort of "You see each other's aura until the rescued player gets fully healed" and maybe some tiny healing speed boost like +10%, or perhaps a quick&quiet effect for the duration.
But no, people in this community absolutely despise stealth play, so the perk had to get changed.
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It's an entirely valid strategy, it just needs to come with more cost.
Killers need to be giving up pressure in some way if they're choosing to tunnel out a survivor, but currently tunnelling is a win-win. You eliminate a survivor early (who doesn't get a chance to do anything but run and die) and the remaining three survivors don't have the manpower to repair 5 gens and escape.
There needs to be a valid cost-benefit trade-off to tunnelling out a survivor. Making survivors more costly to tunnel by making them more difficult to down, is one way to do that.
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"You know what a much better alternative would be?
- When you unhook another survivor, you gain a 8% increase to repair speeds for 60 seconds."
Ah, there we go. That's always the solution. Either more gen speed or the eleventh health state.
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Except if you stack it with overzealous and deja vu you're just doing gens 20% faster by yourself without a tool box and still have room for DH.
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Well, what else is there? Survivors can’t have stealth because killers hate that. Survivors can’t have additional health states or second chances because killers hate that. Survivors can’t have haste or endurance because killers hate that. What incentives do you suggest here?
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I completely disagree, I think it's a very unique playstyle that can be extremely effective under certain circumstances..
Just because some people might use it incorrectly, doesn't mean that it can't be used really well with the perk combos that I mentioned above, and the fact is unfortunately the people who will troll will troll whether or not this perk exists, that's not going to change.
Using BT + Guardian for example would make it so you could intentionally throw off a tunnelling / camping killer by giving the unhooked player speed and endurance buffs that should last long enough to get away (especially without leaving scratch marks or blood) and while also still giving yourself a speed boost to get away as well.. (or you can retreat together knowing the direction of the Killer and both having a speed boost)
During the PTB when I was testing it, I had a very high success rate of getting 3-4 Escapes on my teams using this strategy and it was really fun, and nearly invincibile in EGC.
There were honestly so many different fun plays you could do with it... I'm really disappointed the community wanted to get rid of it..
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Because forcing me as a killer playing nice to chase a double sprint burst survivor is stupid? Since it was double SBs length. So you were literally put in a lose state for playing nice. Meanwhile if they didn't have the other perks to prevent its abuse youd just be better off killing the unhooked.
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That's really sad to see, I didn't know people were so narrow-minded about new things being added to the game :(
I'm testing and not enjoying any of the other new perks the same way, I think I'm going have to go back on DBD break again lol
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"I think it's a very unique playstyle that can be extremely effective under certain circumstances.."
Sure, and the other 99% of the time, it helps tunnelling.
"That's really sad to see, I didn't know people were so narrow-minded about new things being added to the game :("
It's actually the opposite. You're being naive and not seeing the big picture, because you're too narrow-minded about your one extremely specific certain circumstance.
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Oh there we go, assuming someone is a survivor/killer main.
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To be fair, cynically is probably the best way to view things like this. I've heard stories of attempts to stop camping with things like hook states don't progress if the killer is close bend readily abused by survivors by keeping up Chase nearby (or something in that vein). Such things are exactly why Reassurance got nerfed to "once per hooking" before going live
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So you don't see it now as much, but it definitely still happens and it used to be much much much worse when the perk We're Gonna Live Forever used to just give an unconditional bloodpoint boost for unhooking survivors regardless of situation they were in. So this isn't without precedent for how people use perks to be actively harmful to their teammates.
The issue with ptb-Background Player is that while an interesting concept on paper, in practice what people immediately pointed out and saw happen on the ptb in real time was that by the sheer nature of the perk helping the person whole is the least in need of help to escape a chase simply left killers chasing the already injured survivors that were just unhooked. It isn't that it magically turns people's brain in to "I gotta tunnel", but that realistically there was no other good option other than to do so. It also was a significant amount of sprint burst time at being I think 6 seconds originally. Like it just wasn't going to be healthy to play against or with.
Another issue is that the ptb version of the perk absolutely destroyed perks that killers use that incentivize them not to tunnel like Make Your Choice.
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I don't enjoy playing "Meta" and I think it's fun to have different playstyles available in the game to keep things from getting boring.. this was one that actually worked really well, and if you EVER actually tested the build that I ran you would know for yourself that it actually PREVENTED tunneling and sort of confused the killer on what they should do..
As some others have pointed out, it's a bit of a lose / lose situation for the Killer because it isn't good or easy for them to tunnel, and it's also not easy for them to chase the unhooker. They have to choose between 2 decisions that are going to harm them and make them waste time either way no matter what..
Honestly if you actually consider how powerful it can be and often was against exactly tunneling or camping killers, I genuinely thought that they changed the Perk because they thought it was "Too OP" combined with certain perks, not the opposite which is what some of you are saying about it being too harmful to the team.. because it is simply not actually true if you've played it and tested it enough you would know that it is quite effective.
Also why would a Perk that has to be combined with other Perks be a problem or make it considered weak? Literally, at least in my opinion, the absolute funnest part of DBD is coming up with unique perk combinations that synergize well together and create uniquely powerful situations when played correctly. There's nothing wrong with that, it is often really fun and still gets wins for both sides, I don't see the problem.
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Do you understand that your specific build "that definitely worked really well and prevented tunnelling"... was a niche build that no one else would run? That outside of that one specific build, this perk made the game worse?
...why would a perk be bad if it has to be combined with other perks to not be a toxic mess?
I feel like I'm going around in circles here. Please just read my previous posts.
"yeah ok, maybe this deadly pathogen kills everyone who comes into contact with it, but if you mixed it into potato salad it actually treats athletes foot, so why not disperse it into the atmosphere?" "I just like putting potato salad on my feet why is that so wrong?"
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I'm understanding it less as "has to be combined with other Perks be a problem" and more "has to be combined with other Perks not to be a problem"
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Yes because even though smart players would have been able to use it well, it would encourage most players to just get other players killed. Overall it would have negatively affected the game.
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They could have added an activation delay to Background Player. Have it activate 5 - 10 seconds after unhooking a survivor, so you could bait the killer into chasing you and then suddenly zooming away after a while, helping both you and the unhooked survivor escape.
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So, like self-care without botany.
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What it should have done was give the unhooked guy the big speed
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This is probably the best explanation given so far actually.. thanks, yeah it is unfortunate though, if only it wasn't ruined for the "smart players" by those who wouldn't use it correctly :(
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