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If you were to change COH, DH and Medkits differently from how bhvr did it, what & how would you?

Smoe
Smoe Member Posts: 2,918

Also what would have made the patch overall better in your opinion?

Comments

  • ShroudedGhostFace
    ShroudedGhostFace Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 135

    The Dead Hard nerf is fine.

    Revert the Medkit changes entirely.

    Give COH a 60 second cooldown after the boon totem is snuffed by the killer. Keep the ability to use self care.

  • KenwanObinobi
    KenwanObinobi Member Posts: 185

    I would remove all the perks and create perks that do not change the overall aspect of the game or the balance of it.

    It means perks that cannot be META, exactly as VHS did with the weapons or monster's perks, they just give some flavor without changing/breaking the gameplay.

    Same for the items, no self heal allowed, only healing others but a little faster or with less skill check etc...

  • xPrinceHarlequinx
    xPrinceHarlequinx Member Posts: 180

    If BHVR would stop going back and forth between gen regression and healing with nerfs and buffs and instead focused on making the matches a more interactive push and pull of a round. The weak killers continue to stay weak, solo q is a nightmare even with the hud buffs, and patch after patch one side is furious or the other because at the end of the day both sides just want to have fun and while there are addictive, and sometimes enjoyable moments, it just feels like we are all just searching for that high we originally experienced when we started playing.

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 2,918
    edited April 2023

    What would make the matches more interactive if you were to give some examples?

  • 1ettuce
    1ettuce Member Posts: 1,141

    Dead Hard nerf is basically fine in terms of strength but still not fine in terms of fairness, I would've preferred it put you into the dying state after using it unsuccessfully so survivors couldn't keep a chase going after a killer baited it out (like they could and still can)

    COH nerf is okay, I still would've preferred they go in the direction of making shattered hope basekit and buffing other boons, and maybe then you coulda kept the self healing part of COH idrk tho

    Medkit nerf is also probably fine in terms of balance but it's just really boring. There's basically no difference between medkit rarities now and the addon changes were honestly super lazy. Would've done literally anything else with them that would just be interesting

    Great skill check bonus on heals going from 5% to 3% is the weirdest crap ever, I know it's small but it bothers me anyways

    Solos should have better counterplay to hit and run

  • Shroompy
    Shroompy Member Posts: 6,692

    The medkit and coh changes were without a doubt the most impactful changes since 6.1.0 and that is FAR from a bad thing

    Medkits have been the strongest items BY FAR and absolutely destroyed stealth killers, and hit n run playstyles

    Its about time they were changed, and they were changed in probably the best way possible

  • Dbdfan398
    Dbdfan398 Member Posts: 184
    edited April 2023

    COH - tokens like SH PR. Can use it like twice a match.

    Healing - put a speed cap on this

    DH - give incapacitated for X time

  • jajay119
    jajay119 Member Posts: 1,061
    edited April 2023

    Medkit nerfs are fine

    For me CoH should have been changed to:

    -One self heal per ignition to bring it in line with the type of nerfs seen for med kits

    - only one CoH can be in play at any time. There have been times when 2 thirds of the map have been covered by 3 CoH boons and that's far too unfair.

    -Cooldown for reignited the boon once snuffed

  • NotAnotherDoctor
    NotAnotherDoctor Member Posts: 296

    All they had to do with Dead Hard was make it unusable at exit gates similar to DS or put a cool down when it's used at pallets so that it can't be abused.

    As killer, it's great because it can't be abused anymore and you can really see a difference in the game from that standpoint.

    As a survivor, I'm still running it but I'm running it as a secondary perk now. I can see why people wouldn't wanna run it at all though

  • Firellius
    Firellius Member Posts: 4,391

    I think the medkit changes are fine, but I would've made CoH's heal speed boost only apply to altruistic healing and left it at that.

  • xPrinceHarlequinx
    xPrinceHarlequinx Member Posts: 180

    Rework the objective on the survivors side so that there are multiple different ways to power the exit gates that are more than just holding m1. Tie the ability to complete those objectives with charges surv can earn by being in chase with the killer or by retrieving them from chests or cleansing totems. The survivors start the trial with enough charges to complete 1/2 of one of the objectives (for reference, half a gen) that need to be done but in order to do another they either have to go interact with the killer or find something to recharge their charges.

    Something along those lines.

  • foodie
    foodie Member Posts: 437

    DH is fine, Medkits should be reverted, COH should provide self-heal with a cooldown. If you heal yourself, you cant do it again for a said amount of time or you can heal yourself 3 or 5 times throughout the match. I think it's important for soloQ survivors to have a healing option that won't take 60+ seconds

  • sizzlingmario4
    sizzlingmario4 Member Posts: 6,914

    I would’ve differentiated the different medkit rarities a bit more. A purple medkit is hardly any better than a brown one right now. Other than that, I think the changes are mostly fine. CoH self-heal needs to stay gone, forever.

  • Sonzaishinai
    Sonzaishinai Member Posts: 7,976

    My idea for DH was to make it activate when injured. Deactivate on use and to activate it again you'd have to either heal or go down before reentering the injured state. So people couldn't circumvent healing with it by using it as a psuedo healthstate that regenerates. The actual change is honestly better though.

    CoH change is fine, it's still a good perk. And better for solo's despite what people on the forums say. The aura reading is very good

    Medkits honestly also is fine. They are still really strong. And it's actually a interresting option now to use them either on yourself or allies where as before using it on allies was a waste.

    People have a bit of a bad habbit of calling every nerf a nerf into the ground and never even trying the perk/change.

    Dead hard is still very strong. Medkits are still the best item for survivor. PR is stronger then before in many cases. Eruption also still is very good. This community just has a very poor judgement what is and isn't useable

  • zarr
    zarr Member Posts: 1,005

    The Dead Hard nerf is fine. It is not a strong enough perk anymore to justify using it over other Exhaustion perks, which was the goal, as that encourages perk diversity. You only get to use DH at most two times in a trial, which is already a huge downside over all the other Exhaustion perks, which shine precisely because you get constant value out of them. Even more importantly perhaps, you don't get to use it in the first chase, and the first chase is usually the most important of the game. On top of that, Deep Wound nullifies DH, so if you get tunnelled off hook it might not do anything for you. If you get camped on hook, you might only get it one time, or never. If you don't get hooked before the round is already in its concluding stages, you might also never get it. And then on top of that there's killer abilities, perks, and add-ons (as well as latency...) that can rob you of your chance to make much of any use of your DH even in the limited instances where you have do access to it. Same for instadown/Exposed, should you heal after getting unhooked.

    Given that, I'd even say DH could be back to 1 second duration, and unhook endurance should become unhook invincibility (with removed collision).

    DH can still be used, but I personally wouldn't use it without also using another Exhaustion perk and Decisive Strike alongside it, which already takes up 3 perk slots.

    Circle Of Healing was overnerfed, in its current state it is not worth using. I would simply make it so that it enables survivors to heal at normal self-healing speed in its range (32 seconds), and limit the 50% healing speed boost to altruistic heals. I don't ultimately care so much that Circle is gone now for its own sake (although it had been a bit of a saving grace for solo), but with it, the other Boon perks are not viable anymore either, as those had really only been worthwhile alongside Circle. So at the very least, I would buff the other Boon perks now, such that anyone would even consider spending the time to find and bless totems just for those.

    Med-kit nerfs are welcome, but BHVR's approach seems very haphazard. Now all med-kits are virtually identical, and most add-ons do nothing whatsoever worthwhile. I think they could have kept the charges how they had been, and simply made self-healing with a med-kit take 32 seconds. Then add-ons could be used to more significantly change the purpose of med-kits, with some add-ons allowing very quick self-heals but coming with charge penalties such that you can only get one heal out of it, or others that disable the ability to heal yourself with the med-kit (or increase the time it takes to do so significantly), while increasing charge efficiency and healing speed on altruistic heals tremendously. There could also be add-ons that show you the auras of injured survivors and their healing progress indicated by their auras, or show your aura to injured survivors, or that grant bonuses when completing a heal with the med-kit, such as brief Endurance or Haste. There's a lot of things they could have done that would make med-kits much more interesting and exciting than they are now.

  • AssortedSorting
    AssortedSorting Member Posts: 1,348

    CoH: Channel at the Boon to Heal yourself, limited to one Survivor at a time. (No more AoE, faster than Self-care and Team-wide, but necessitates going to the Boon itself).

    DH: This one is really annoying. The effect itself is literally an extra health-state on-demand. It needs to be brought down so it isn't the ultimate option, lest everything else become powercreep or just sub-par. Limited uses is a way to go. Otherwise perhaps apply the falling movement stagger on Survivors who DH successfully to remove the speed boost and it isn't quite so much of a chase reset. (The counterplay should never be "wait it out", that's fine in a medieval 1v1 game like For Honor, not a horror slasher like DBD)

    Med-Kits: I like it. Probably would have also introduced some kind of specialization, like the Ranger being able to be used to "Heal Ailments" while Healthy, charges used increase the decay of negative ailments. (Including Exhaustion?). Made the Emergency the fastest healing out of all of the Med-kits with the least amount of charges, probably requiring an addon in order to get a full self-heal from it with the base speed it provides.

  • thrawn3054
    thrawn3054 Member Posts: 5,897

    CoH I'd have left the self heal in place. I'd have removed the ability to stack speeds with any other perks/medkits. Lastly I'd have given it a token system. It can only be lite 3 times. It deactivates if snuffed or after two heals.

    DH didn't need the nerf imo. Sure it was annoying but it wasn't that hard to bait.

    Medkits are a bit more difficult. I think I'd have left them alone with one exception. Self healing with a medkit takes 24 seconds. The only exception to this being the Emergency kit.

    As for how I'd improve the rest of the patch:

    CoB and OC would stay the same. Gen kicking perks no longer stack regression.

    Pain Res I'd have kept the same except I'd add a token system. You'd start with 1 token and gain another token for every 2 hooks you get.

  • crogers271
    crogers271 Member Posts: 1,821

    I don't understand why BHVR does such massive game changes. I'd prefer more frequent updates, but not quite as wild swings.

    CoB to 175%

    Circle of Healing split into two perks, one for self healing, one for healing bonus (maybe this is coming)

    Purple and green kits needed weakened, but didn't think needed to adjust the entire system.

    Weakening DH was needed, but right now it seems a bit too far. Maybe try it out like it was, but DH doesn't activate for anyone until one survivor has been hooked. Alternatively, allow it only to be used after being hooked once, but now DH can be used while in deep wound.

    Then if those changes weren't enough, push them a little more.

  • mizark3
    mizark3 Member Posts: 2,253

    I'd extend DH's duration to 1s, but make it provide Endurance only against Special Attacks. This would help flatten the effective range of Killers so that you can't use DH against Trapper or Clown, but can still use it against Blight and Nurse. (To that end I would also make Spirit's M1 out of phase be considered a Special Attack as long as you would get the score event, or roughly 3-5s.) This would make it so as Survivor you might risk a dead perk against a Killer, but instead of the perk being useless against a strong Killer (EG. Healing vs Plague), you only run the risk against the weaker Killers. It would roughly balance itself out.

    CoH is perfect, arguably with a 25% self-care speed so you could still solo heal, but people would be incentivized to heal you instead of allowing you to take 64s to heal yourself.

    Medkits I would have kept Green's self-speed boost and at 16 charges as well as Purple's 32 charges. It would still take 24 charges to full heal yourself, so you would need to bring an add-on with them for selfish healing. Also Pharmacy would need to be adjusted to put the 8 charge bandage add-on also, to still allow for a self-heal. I also would make the speed boost add-ons have an equal altruistic boost as the universal, so altruistic med-kits are more incentivized even in the add-ons.

    As a side change I would revert both sides' double nerfs done in 6.1.0, down to single nerfs instead. Eg. Pop buffed back to 20% max, DS at 5s, Iron Will back to 100% OR non-exhaustion, Ruin back to 200% OR not be removed on Survivor death.