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Nurse
Comments
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Someone else who wants to nerf the nurse when, even before she lost her range and recharge addons, a coordinated team could quite easily take her on and put her in trouble ?
C'mon ...
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Considering the fact both nurse and the perks has been nerfed, she might have less than 50% kill rates even LOL
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I dislike that idea because it destroys the core of her kit. And also, landing a secondary blink through a wall means you predicted correctly so it does take skill to do.
Nurse is hard to nerf without making her unplayable or unfair because of how straightfoward her kit is. Hold button=go fast through walls. I think that maybe (heavy maybe) they should get rid of her lunge after a blink. WOuld increase he skill required while leave less margin for error.
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Bad players should not be able to beat her. They either need to get better or quit playing. My Nurse results have been the same or better since she was nerfed, in large part because the player base is clueless against her. If people don’t want to put the time in to learn, they should lose.
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Even good players are not beating her. Good Nurse vs Good Survivors will end with Nurse victory most of games. So i don't know what is your point.
Now you will come with "I am beating good Nurses" but then i am never seeing anyone shows how to do it. 🙄 Just their words and we have to believe it.
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What would be nice is if, before talking about DbD, speakers had a minimum of experience and knowledge of the game.
Does Supaalf VS Hens333 mean anything to you?
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The thing is, for some players, it's easier to come crying to the forum for a yes or a no than to try to improve.
They'd like to win without having to make the slightest effort.
It's really pathetic.
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When someone says something you disagree they are probably noobs who don't know anything about game. 😂😂But sadly, i know about DbD, i am good at it. 2700 hours atm.
And about Supaalf vs Hens333. Let's see.
First match, only 4 gens finished. All dead.
Second match, 2 escapes 2 deaths.
Third match, 2 gens finished. All dead.
Imagine giving me video to prove my point 🤣
And he played against very coordinated and very good SWF team. And yet, he destroyed them. So imagine normal players are playing against him. Or any good Nurse.
But yeahhhhh, i am just unskilled bad player. Like you said. SURE!
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It's frightening to see people being fooled like that.
When Supaalf won against Hens' team, he used his famous "XXX wins in a row" build, based on Starstruck.
And I don't mind saying that this build was really problematic on Nurse.
However, the mach we're interested in is obviously the second one, where he uses a "Classic" build.
And here, surprise, he says himself that he needed Tunnel Hens to avoid ending up with 0k.
He makes a second kill, but it's in the endgame, and it's pure luck.
What's more, this video dates back to the time when the Nurse still had its recharge and range addons.
So when I hear players say that survivors can't beat Nurse, it just makes me howl with laughter.
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So he won two matches, had a draw in 1, and that’s supposed to prove that Nurse is broken?
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High level nurses and blights are only playing against high level survivors. And high level survivors can deal with them:
The problem is at a high level survivors dominate killers. There is a reason tournaments often restrict survivors to only 1 of each item, or limiting perks, whereas killers are usually only limited to a few select banned addons (tomestone etc.)
This is shown true in the data for top MMR as well:
Nurse is NOT the best killer in the game, and this was actually BEFORE her nerfs.
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I agree 100%.
If only it were that simple.
He won two games with a build that everyone agrees was problematic on the nurse AND can't be used now.
And the draw was actually a 1K, he got a 2nd kill only by luck, on bad timing from the survivor.
AND if he hadn't tunneled, the result would have been 0K.
But otherwise, absolutely, the nurse was broken before.
And she's broken today.
I swear, the players never cease to amaze me.
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Alright, i'm done talking with you since you want to keep disingenuously arguing a strawman point. Like i said, go complain to the devs then if you aren't willing to have a reasonable discussion with me.
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1) I agree, and nurse was nerfed since then and survivors buffed. So she probably has dipped back below the 50% mark
2) Thats not how statistics works. If we have 10,000 games played with nurse, and 50% of them have a DC/Intentional hook suicide/giving up. Then you eliminate them from the stats. Then if nurse has a 52% kill rate in the remaining 5,000 games. That is still statistically significant. You only need a sample size of around 2,500 in order to get a statistic within a 2% margin of error: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margin_of_error Unless you are trying to make the claim that like 90% of nurse games are a DC, which i think is a bit extreme. 50% is extreme TBH, in my personal experience it is probably around 10-15% of my nurse games.
And if you are trying to argue that the DC games are included, than that would indicate nurse is FAR worse off than you think, because if survivors DC against her all the time and she still only has a 52% kill rate, that is a serious problem and she needs to be massively massively buffed.
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By the way, I seem to be forgetting something...
When Hens333 and his team took on Supaalf and were able to handle him ... weren't they also under competition restrictions?
No repeating perks, no super-powered items?
AND THEY DIDN'T PLAY A NIL GAME (remember that Supaalf had to tunnel AND that the 2nd kill was pure luck)???
What would it be like if they had no limitations on perks, items and accessories?
I think we need to stop being hypocrites, guys.
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With the changes over the years nurse feels too easy now, in today's DBD nurse would've never been released but back when survivors really were OP she was the trump card to hang in there with the best, but now anyone who mained her back when this game really was a one sided show will tell you now its a cakewalk or that's been my experience but if I'm being honest there's no way to fix her without completely redesigning who she is and changing everything about her I'd say personally she just needs to be left alone at this point she's already one of the least picked characters and anything further you might as well take her out
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Yeah, just COMPLETELY disregard EVERYTHING I said in my post 👍
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It wouldn’t matter if I did post games against Nurse, you would find a way to say the Nurse isn’t good or that it is just a few games. Fyi, I have gone against 2 Nurse players since she was nerfed. People don’t play her anymore.
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Nurse is still pretty popular for me. I wish she was not, i wish i had your games but all i have Nurse, Blight, Legion, Spirit...
So what's your point?
You told me to watch this video. 4 top tier survivors were SWF'ing against top tier Nurse. And it ended to survivor lose 2 games. And 1 game they played so well but even this game ended with 2 kills.
Not all Nurses are good like Alf but you will see good Nurses here and there. But you can't have good teammates always. One weak line and Nurse will destroy your solo team.
And you are still trying to prove me Nurse is fine.
Even one of the best teams can't defeat Nurse but you are expecting average players can do this. Sure!
High tier survivors are not dominating, that's not the fact. Even the best survivor streamers are dying most times. Escape is even rare for them. But killer streamers are still doing good. Otz, Tru3, Scott etc. They are still dominating their games as killer.
And kill rates tells nothing. Sadako is the strongest killer in game by this logic???
Plus you guys are keep talking how weak Nurse is but then you are winning most of your games with her. Weird 😫
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I had like multiple people respond to that post, and i misquoted you, but please be more toxic over a mistake. That is definitely going to make this conversation worthwhile.
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You are missing the point. The point is, the same people that complain that nurse is overpowered or that blight is overpowered, think that things that survivors like Hens are able to do is totally fine. The reality is, at the absolute highest levels of competition, this game is HEAVILY survivor sided. And the only killers who actually stand any chance at competing against survivors at that level, are nurse and blight. No other killer can.
So when these people come in and say nurse or blight is OP, they always talk about how god tier nurses can exploit them to insane levels to go on crazy 1k win streaks.
But, when you ask these people a simple question such as. Should this game be balanced around high level players or average level players? The answer they typically give, is that the game should be balanced around average players. So then i simply point out, that if you follow that to its logical conclusion and look at the data. Then the data plain as day shows that, in the hands of the "AVERAGE" player, that nurse is vastly underpowered, and needs massive buffs.
My point is that i think this viewpoint is flawed, and that games should be balanced around what HIGH LEVEL players are capable of doing, while keeping in mind that lower tiers of players exist. For example, in this video:
The relevant part is timestamped, but to explain it a bit. The person in the video talks about a balance change to an item in TF2. The item was heavily nerfed because "players were too hard to hit when using the B.A.S.E. Jumper" and the "average" player in TF2 went "lol wut? that item is useless". Because the reality is the AVERAGE TF2 player was not exploiting that item to its fullest potential. So what they did was, nerf it in a way that the high level players exploiting it were no longer able to exploit it to the level that they were before. But the low level players were almost entirely unaffected by the nerf, because the reality was they weren't using that item that way to begin with.
THAT is my point. They need to be HEAVILY nerfing these crazy loops that survivors can do to waste several MINUTES of non-nurse killer's time so that other killers can actually stand a chance at higher levels. Doing this WILL NOT hurt low level survivor players, because they aren't exploiting those loops to begin with. They are busy pre-dropping the pallet at 5 gens and getting hit anyway. So it isn't going to hurt them if you nerf these type of loops and structures. All it will do is make HIGH LEVEL play better.
And when they do that type of thing, you might be able to start making changes that benefit the low level players without heavily impacting the high level players and vice versa.
And i know what you are going to say. You are going to say "but survivors like hens are rare". To which my reply is, yeah, and nurses like Supaalf are also rare. But besides that point, just because something is rare, doesn't mean it isn't a problem. I'll post this clip from otzdarva's stream:
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Im just responding in the exact same condescending way you were.
Also how was I supposed to know it was a mistake?
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Why did I get a notification for this?
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That's a big cap,dude.
Please,refrain from ever making such a bold yet wrong statement.
Nurse is unarguably the strongest and worst designed killer.
She predates the era of 2016-2017 when everything was AWFUL for killers.
She doesn't deserve to be in the game anymore,damn the thousands of hours of Nurse one has put into their game,if it's bad it's BAD!
And nerfing her is the right thing and that's FINAL!
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I don’t think Nurse needs anymore nerfs, we’re gonna have to accept the fact that it’s okay if we have one killer who could be a tad bit OP but it’s not like every Nurse you play against is gonna be top tier.
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Honestly if their horrible netcode wasn't so bad I imagine she'd not get half the hits she gets currently, her, Wraith, Wesker and Blight are all culprits of odd hit dressing atm
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Worst designed? Are we playing the same game?
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With old Iron Will she was pretty okay to face. With all the aura-reading perks currently in the game though, it can be a bit tiresome to go against an all aura-reading Nurse. But even so, overall okay.
Though I'd rather still face her, with her billion blinks through floors and walls than have to face Knight/SM. Who just require you to hold W. Whereas with Nurse you can actually mindgame them, become unpredictable and have fun in loops.
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"[Nurse] isn't any more powerful than any other killer." ~ Garboface
Interesting take. The strongest killer in the game isn't stronger than any other killer in the game. Trapper, Myers, Freddy, Clown, Pig, Sadako, Wraith, Trickster, Doctor etc. would like a word with you.
You're right about the second part though. It's pretty impressive, that it took the Nurse 2-3 minutes to tunnel op out of the game. That is usually the time it takes any hardcore tunneler to do that, other than our beloved S-tier killers and Pyramid Head of course.
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Whether or not you like this or that killer, that's your most legitimate right, of course.
But you have to stop being hypocritical.
Even before the nurse loses her range and recharge addons, she could be in trouble if the opposing team was organized and competent.
From that point on, you have to stop kidding yourself.
Disliking a killer is not automatically linked to the relevance of his presence in DbD.
Strangely enough, the survivors who manage to counter the nurse are never seen complaining about her... it's strange...
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And on top of that, it's worth remembering that even before her nerve, the nurse could be in trouble if the other side was playing organized/competent.
But strangely, the "anti-nurses" suddenly become mute when we talk about this ...
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I think players become allergic to effort and originality.
If they can't loop the killer for 10 minutes around a LT, THEN it means the killer is OP or poorly designed.
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Especially since a nurse who plays full will have reading perks and therefore no defense perks to stop the generators' progress.
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Strangely enough,is that you think she's counterable,she's not.
And it is not strange for good survivors who "counter" to not complain,because they simply don't exist.
Nurse is not counterable,unarguable point made here,stating facts Nurse =/= counterable.
The ability to break LoS and hope she loses you,isn't a counter,a counter would mean complete win of chase,what you do is simply extend the chase by a few seconds.
Maybe it works 1 time or 2,you'll,however,still go down.
If it's impossible to win a chase and hide/lose the killer,then that killer is badly designed.
The reason why she doesn't get properly nerfed,is because she's the scapegoat of BHVR,so the game's not "TRUE P2W",even though it kinda is,with how powerful some license killers have been,meanwhile we get Merchant and Knight..
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What's incredible is that everything you've said is completely wrong.
If you think the nurse can't be countered, which you are, you can choose: 1) a beginner on DbD, 2) a hypocrite, 3) inexperienced on DbD.
I'm not even going to take the time to dismantle your arguments one by one, all you have to do is read up a little on expert nurses VS expert survivors to get an idea.
At worst, if you want to convince us that the nurse is too strong, feel free to record the games you play against her, and we'll see what happens.
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And what would me recording dying to Nurse achieve?
What could I possibly do to stop her,or convince you that she's not good for the game?!
At best,your advise would be for me to "git gud" , it's a waste of time!
You're INFAMOUS for asking "proof" while beign stubborn on every level.
One guy can tell you the banana is yellow,you'd still argue it's a bright green.
And what would I even show my footage of?
Break LoS? Maybe once or twice...
Loop her? Come on..
Or would you like me to urban evasion all the map?
While calling it countering..
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The last round of nerfs made her more reliant on tunneling to secure a win. I'm really not a fan of nurse, players are either totally useless with her or good enough to be guarenteed to tear a surv team to shreds. There aren't many in betweens. I personally suck with her, perhaps because I'm on xbox. And counterplaying her is quite hit and miss. I won't nope out of game against her, not immediately anyway. But if we're one dead and a couple other hookstates at 4 gens i either throw myself on hook or play for hatch.
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Before the nurse was deprived of her range and recharge addons, she could already be countered.
There's nothing more to say.
You have the right to be incompetent against her, or to play in a team made up of incompetent players against her, or to play soloQ ... but that's your problem; it's not something inherent to this killer.
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