Motion sickers rejoice!
Comments
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#LiveLaughLove
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I'll believe it when I see it. It would be a fantastic change though, hopefully they remove the FoV effect from M&A because right now the FoV changing during a game really messes with me.
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Excellent news
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Yay! Finally a dev respond on this and it’s even a positive one!
wait.. but wouldn’t that mean that accessibility settings are not solely for survivor side? (Because colorblind mode hasn’t already deconfirmed that stupid assumption)
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Yeah very pleased to read this.
I hope this also means more granular graphical settings in the future too at some point but this is great to read regardless.
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So I guess this will mean Shadowborn will get a full on rework.
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Is this because of M&A?
I tried that perk only once and decided never to assign it again.
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bout ######### time😃
Post edited by EQWashu on6 -
Having a low FoV can increase the effects of motion sickness. As a killer DBD has an exceptionally tiny FoV of 87 degress. For context a real humans FoV is a bit complicated, but detecting movement can be as high as 270 if you account for the fact that your eyes can move. But on focusing finer details it gets as high as 150, but obviously this varies from person to person.
Most FPS games typically have FoV sliders, but usually its around 100 depending on the console/PC. This is why playing with shadowborn feels so good, because it increases that FoV by 15, putting it at 102, which makes it more like a standard FPS. Long time quake players will often put their FoV much higher though around 110-120 or even 130 depending on their game plan.
Personally speaking, i'm a long time quake player so i was used to having my fov be w/e i want (technically you could set your fov to be 360 in quake, but it'll probably make you sick before its useful). Anything less than 100 gives me eye strain after a while, and once it hits the 80 mark i start to get motion sickness, which is why longer period of time on DbD can give me quite a bit of trouble. This is why having an FoV slider is so important because different people will have different FoVs that they want to play at that is more comfortable for them. Right now DBD basically has a binary, 87 or 102. Although monitor and abuse is a bit different as well its not static and changes, which leads to its own problems i'd imagine.
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I will no longer be shackled by Shadowborn
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Thank you for the explanation. I always thought default FoV was 90.
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Wow. You know it's a good day when BHVR decide to tell you about a planned solution to a long known problem. Thank you, devs!!!!
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we are taking the perks that currently adjust FOV into account
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The only time I ever felt sick from a video game was when I first started getting into VR. If it felt anything like those first few days, I feel for you sufferers, very out of your stomach gross feeling.
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while i do like this upcoming change , this is a massive buff for killers that benefits alot from having LOS on the survivor to use their powers, like nurse / blight/ oni and billy
which technically will make nurse / blight more easier to play , shadowborn on those 2 killers is already pretty good , but now BASEKIT ? , I hope they nerf blight addons before doing that , I really hope soo.
on the other hand the bigger fov is gonna be really sweet on billy ...not complains there.
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Good, finally some good news on this after so many topics.
Not only is it not some massive buff, higher fov ruins any and all muscle memory with said killers, while also making sensitivity feel different and require reacclimation. Also higher FoV makes focused vision worse and peripheral better, making it easier to hit obstacles when using those powers. Its not a buff, its QoL.
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thats the thing "its a fov "SLIDER" people that want that advantage can just set 120*" "
meanwhile people that enjoy the current FOV will not bother to increase the FOV...soo idk how I feel about giving sweatier players even more power on their hands on the already S/A tier killers - higher fov can easily make mindgames on nurse and blight waaay more to their side when mastering their new but bigger FOV.
like I said , not complaining BUT yeah ....I can see this being a problem in the future if those 2 killers do not get changed by that point.
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Hopefully because I'm sick of being forced to run it on every Killer because I have issues with the right fov on Killers. Let's hope it's also something worthwhile too....
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It’s a buff for all killers as it expands their field of vision. It’s surprisingly disingenuous of you to argue that something that allows killers to see more isn’t somehow advantageous. But I guess, in the end, we’ll just need to see how the change plays out. If it’s too much of a buff I’m sure BHVR will adjust it.
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Just like the survivor hud?
More FOV is the most needed change in the game right now. “bUt oUr sNeAkS aNd MiNdGaMeS”
Sneaking is such an outdated play style in this game now. I hardly come across any survivors other than the kind that beg for chase. And I still don’t understand what “mind games” an fov increase would eliminate. FOV techs? Lol
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Best thing I read in a while.
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great change!! behavior been cooking lately.
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They will no longer be able to mess with killers' first-person POV, especially with the console one's, that's a massive buff!
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The 87/102 FOV in DBD is also measured in Horizontal FOV, which means it isn't the average between vertical and horizontal FOV, but just the width itself. Every other game measures it in Average FOV. So the "87" FOV in DBD is more similar to setting your FOV to 70 in other games like Quake, TF2, Overwatch, etc.
Glad they're improving it.
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A bigger FOV is a slight buff. That is definitely right. With a wider FOV a killer can stand still and see things they otherwise wouldn't.
BUT a higher FOV does not allow the killer to see anything they shouldn't see. A killer can always slightly turn their camera and see the same things. Also, the larger the FOV and the more information on the screen, the easier it is to miss details. Have you played one of those games where you need to look for hidden objects in a pile of junk? This follows the same logic. You know what you're looking for but all the information at once is so distracting you just can't find it. That is until you focus on small parts of the picture and search in a limited area at a time.
All mindgames that rely on the killer's FOV shouldn't be considered mindgames anyway. They literally get nullified by a killer turning their camera. I would also argue, that a wider FOV of about 102° for killers would not change much for survivors. If it had made that much of a difference I'm sure we would have noticed by now, considering that there is a portion of killer players that run Shadowborn religiously.
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I personally think the HUD update was a buff for solo queue survivors. Your whataboutism aside, there is a reason nearly every Blight main runs Shadowborn, and it isn’t to deal with motion sickness. I expect a better argument from you, you normally have very balanced takes like Karu. Maybe you’re both off today for some reason.
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Then nerf Blight as well.
Shadowborn works well on fast killers, because moving at that speed with a low FoV is very disorienting. Motion sickness or not, it's not fun. Does it increase Blight kill rates? Possibly, easier to play means easier to kill.
If Shadowborn was truly a powerful perk, it would be reflected in general usage and kill rates. If it's only helping certain killers, then address those certain killers.
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Since this is just a QoL change and not a buff, can survivors have it too? I get motion sickness when looping as survivor, please let me increase the FOV and also move the camera a bit further behind so that I can see the whole tile.
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Higher FOV means easier to hit flashlight saves? Seems fair to me 🙃
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Third person and First person is entirely different things, at least you could have slightly widened horizontal FoV but definitely not the vertical.
or perhaps you are trying to be sarcastic as "can see whole tile" is obviously a problem lol, I don't know.
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Higher FOV has just as many implications in 1st person, as in 3rd person. Most 1st-person games limit FOV to a low value (eg. Overwatch limits it at 107). So if you see why that's "obviously a problem" in 3rd person - quoting you - then you can't argue that it's not a problem in 1st person.
I'm just showing people who make the argument that this is QoL, that it's not. It has gameplay implications. One big implication in particular, is that with a high enough FOV, the killer could hide the red stain in chase, while still seeing the survivor.
As soon as BHVR makes the FOV slider available, literally everyone will put it to the max, there's no downside to it even for people who don't suffer from motion sickness. You might argue that killers need this buff, I'd argue they don't, but in any case treating it as QoL is dishonest.
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I can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve ever fallen for an FOV tech. Calling it a “massive buff is a stretch.”
I do not run shadowborn for motion sickness. I don’t get motion sick. The base FOV is just absolutely terrible. It’s really as simple as that. I don’t run shadowborn on blight because I need it, but rather because moving that fast on base FOV is again, TERRIBLE.
This isn’t about whataboutism. It’s a QOL change that is needed.
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I dislike the idea of nerfing Blight. When you have extremes like Nurse + Blight and, say Trapper on the ‘weaker’ end, it’s easier to find balance. It’ll always be somewhere in between. Plus Blight destroys mediocre survivors but pretty much every killer does; that’s why their kill rates are all 53%+. Blight is only really problematic for top-tier survivors so what would nerfing him really accomplish?
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Higher killer FOV makes it easier for survivors to get flashlight blinds.
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So what are motion sick players to do? I was diagnosed with it and the way i play the game is with a perk. They don't want accessibility in perks (as shown with spine chill to now the visual tr and lullaby indicator) infact the lullaby indicator has single handedly stopped a sadako from getting the jump on me everytime i faced her. Because her lullaby is supposed to test your hearing with how low it is at first but i just move away the moment i see the haze? I understand if increasing fov does help some killers a bit. But im tired of weakening myself to not get sick?
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What you are suggesting is problematic because it would actually allow you to see things you shouldn't be able to see. Much like stretched res before they fixed it. We do not need to relive the time when mindgames wouldn't work because the survivors saw the killer over every object.
The difference between first and third person is the fix point of the camera. In third person the camera has a fix point that is on the outside, allowing you to move the camera on a sphere. Setting back the camera increases that sphere's radius and with it the max height you could possibly level it at. That means you can see over things that should be higher than your camera, which gives you a big advantage because you literally ignore line of sight blockers.
In first person on the other hand the fix point is located right at the camera's centre. As long as that centre is not changed in any way a wider FOV does not allow you to see things you couldn't see by turning your camera. If you want a closer comparison you can consider first person with a sphere that has a radius of exactly 0 units of length.
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Because, you can literally see something that you can't with third person
No, it's not something you can see just by moving mouse around, you can literally see something you are not supposed to see from that exact positions.
"saves you from moving screen extremely quickly just to see people" and "allows you to see something you can't" is entirely different things, former is what shadowborn does and latter is what square resolution did (aka survivor FoV does).
And in the end it doesn't matter if it's qol or not, kill rates will not even move in slightest even with all those "advantage" I'm pretty sure.
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So then don't nerf Blight? because a higher FoV isn't a problem?
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We are aware that this has an effect on gameplay but we have all this information from Shadowborn being in the game anyway so we know the effect that it can have on gameplay. All that is considered by our Design team
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Not to me personally, but it’s dishonest to pretend it isn’t a buff as it produces an advantage. For //all// killers. I believe killers should be buffed though because what that is going to do is increase kill rates. This’ll lead to subsequent nerfs, for killers, and buffs for survivors. Just like we’re seeing now. 🤷♀️ It’s like shooting your (plural) own self in the foot. The only one hurt in the end is you (plural).
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That's not how it works.
IF it has a substantial effect on game balance, that will be reflected in the kill rates.
IF the kill rates go up, THEN killers will get nerfed, and rightly so.
They didn't immediately nerf survivors after the HUD actions update, they left it to see how much of an effect it had on game balance.
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Kill rates will definitely increase as the result of this change. According to Nightlight, shadowborn is used by 7.2% of killer players, giving it for free will allow these players to equip one new perk. Say, this new perk improves their killrate by +10%, then the overall killrate will increase by 0.7%. That's just mathematical, and ONLY considering current shadowborn users.
But in reality, EVERYONE will use the new FOV, not just those who equip Shadowborn. We're already seeing everyone use the visual terror radius and that thing barely even gives any advantage. Now imagine what will happen for increased FOV, which unlike visual terror radius, gives an advantage that players DON'T already have. Everyone will equip it, motion sick or not. As a result, experienced killers can use it hide the red stain a bit more, they will be less affected by FOV techs so the survivor gameplay will change. Killer streamers will use it so the viewer experience will be different. Etc.
I'm all for accessibility features, but they must have a trade-off, otherwise they will be used by everybody including those who don't need them. In the latter case, they shouldn't be considered accessibility features but an actual gameplay change. The current shadowborn, gives an advantage to everybody, including people without motion sickness, but abuses are prevented by the fact that you need a perk for it, so mostly the people with real motion sickness use it. I'd argue the visual terror radius thing, should have come at some expense as well, eg. reduced radius for the sound-based one.
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no wonder i get headaches from playing killer...
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And this is any different than the visual terror radius indicator that has basically made sadako useless?
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Bro really said using the FOV increase is abuse if you don’t need it for motion sickness.
GODDDD FORBIDDDDD killers get a QOL change. 😂
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I don't have motion sickness but my pheripherical vision is basically non-existent, so i'm very excited about being able to see more.
In any case whatever the reasons why people wanted or even needed the FoV slider, I'm glad I wasn't delusional when I assumed (and claimed) it was probably in the works and I'm really excited for it to be implemented :))
The day it gets implemented will be a win for accessibility (and hopefully it will stop the oh so useless arguments making accessibility about us v them)
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me: “Killers getting buffed increases kill rates. Then the devs will nerf them to rebalance kill rates.”
you: “that isn’t how it works. Killers getting buffed increases kill rates. Then killers get nerfed.”
You said the same thing I did, just with a few unnecessary conjunctions. There’s no reason why a buff wouldn’t help whatever it’s strengthening. If it isn’t helping, it isn’t really a buff; it’s at best a lateral move. I feel like you were so eager to “ackhually” me you didn’t even comprehend what I wrote. Maybe you didn’t even read it at all.
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What you said reads more like "this is a buff, so it has to come with a nerf, at the same time".
We won't know if it's a buff until it's at the very least, tested on the PTB, if not waiting for data from live kill rates. THEN we will know if it's a buff.
Until then, it's all conjecture.
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I just want to respectfully ask what you want the motion sick players to do? (The other keeps dodging) not play? They have a perk that partially or completly solves their problems in this game? Or always run 1 perk down (which goes against bhvrs want for accessibility to not be exclusive to perks. Thats why spinechill was changed and put half into the basekit). Hell like you said the visual tr and lullaby helps against a few instances for free. (Sadako being a big one since shes supposed to test you with light lullaby) but since they said that didnt make a major change to the gamestate. (Same as the hud) why not help killers out with a problem they have had for years? (Like i can keep running 3 perk if ya want) just relieved my situation won't hold me back from playing the same game as everyone else?
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Ok, let's remember to keep the discussion civil, please. As stated in the AMA, it is being worked on at the moment, and as always, more information will be released when there is more information to give regarding it, including a likely PTB to get feedback on it from the community. Issues like motion sickness affect a lot of people, and it shouldn't stop people from enjoying things if it can be helped, hence the AMA answer given.
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