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Survivor gen rush meta and speed boost meta needs an urgent look at
The devs did an excellent job nerfing gen regression in the game. Playing survivor no longer feels like a gen simulator game. That said, are the devs aware of the new crazy gen rush and speed boost meta they have created with the recent perk changes?
First the gen rush meta. Deja Vu rework was meant to counter the 3 gen strategy. However, it is now used to rush gens with gen rush meta builds. Deja Vu stacks with perks such as resilience and prove thyself. I myself have tested this build and it's ridiculous how fast one person can do a gen let alone 2 or more. With no decent gen regression build available to killers, gens are flying off with this build.
The nerf to self healing is barely doing anything to slow down the gens. Survivors especially at higher levels just don't heal up. If you are not playing a high mobility killer and downing survivors within 30 seconds of a chase, gens are done before you know it.
Then the speed boost meta. It's bad enough gens are going off so fast. To make matters worst, survivors have their looping buffed up too. The devs released the new made for this Gabriel Soma perk without taking into consideration all the feedback given during the PTB. Now the perk is almost on every survivor that knows how to loop.
Typical loops that would have taken only 3 loops before the pallet needs to be dropped now last easily up to 5 or 6 loops before the killer catches up to the survivor and then the pallet gets dropped. While this is happening the other survivors are rushing gens with the gen rush meta.
The worst of it is during end game. Survivors get a crazy 10% speed boost when they combine made for this with hope. If trying to catch these survivors at loop with a 3% was a struggle, a 10% speed boost makes its near impossible or even impossible for killers at 110% speed.
I have personally "looped" more like just hold down W around the Ormond map main building during end game. The trickster player could not physically catch up to me because I was running the same speed as him. He could not even throw knives because the moment he does, I would zoom out of his field of view.
I honestly hope to god the devs will pay attention to this new problem they have created. If you are going to remove gen regression from the game, you should not be buffing gen rush or looping. That's not balance. The reason gen rush was meta for forever was because gen rushing and looping was strong enough as it was. Now it's worse.
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the post is not entirely precise. PTS does nothing in solo and not even fully negates basekit malus of repairing with multiple people - the perk is ideally absolutely never used, but for very last generator. For resi + dejavu = 15% that gives 12s quicker repair speed. That's basically negates +10s we got at 6.1 patch for the cost of 2 perk slots. MfT according to usage rate is not even as good as lithe or sprint burst. I know I stopped using it already. As for stacking with hope, it means again 2 perk slots. Making it 4 occupied perk slots just for a niche and being injured most of the time.
IDK, but I see absolutely 0 problems with it. 4 perk slots for that vs pop+pain res+jolt+eruption for slowdown. Whoever can get downs/prolong chases wins.
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Both sides have an objective rush obsession derivated from extremely competetive mindset. Killers tunnel out survivors as soon as possible and survivors tunnel gens as soon as possible because all people want to do is win (fair enough I guess) no matter what. Both sides have a problem right now.
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Tunnelling is a necessity because of the gen rush meta that never gets addressed. If you play fair and switch survivors, at any given time there will always be 3 survivors on gen. Whereas if you tunnel out 1 person at the start then there will only be 2 survivors on gens at any given time. That slows the game down. Tunnelling is a result or rather response to the lack of action taken against the gen rush meta.
First of all your anecdotal experience does not reflect the overall picture. Secondly, the perk made for this has been barely out for a month and you are going to dictate that the stats show is low? Where did you even get the stats from to begin with? The devs have not released one yet.
Thirdly, it is not whether you are wasting 1 perk slot or 2 perk slots. That is not even a proper arguing point. So, we now balance things based on how many perk slots it takes up? What logical argument is that? Broken mechanics are broken, it is not up to question of how many slots it takes. By your logic then, old unrelenting and STBFL combo in 2017 did not need a nerf. It took 2 slots to lower the attack cooldown. Obviously that combination needed a nerf and it was not up for debate about it taking 2 slots.
Your entire argument summed up is all about how many perk slot a strategy uses. That is absolutely irrelevant to whether a strategy is broken or not. Which in this case of gen rush and movement speed. They absolutely are. The fact that survivors can make a loop last twice as long with made for this alone, let alone with hope means it's busted. As for saying, "it negates the +10s, so its fine." How is that even logical? The reason they increased the time was to quite literally give more time for killers after the complete removal of gen regressions as a strategy in the game.
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And same can be said of survivors just rushing gens because if there is somebody getting tunneled out or even camped there is nothing else they can do about it. It's become a vicious cicle and both strategies have become the comfort playstyle by default for many players that only. Killers don't want survivors to sit on gens but they also don't want to be the kind of survivors that just mess around going for flashlight saves and such things that actually require interaction. There is such displeasment in the community that is truly hard to satisfy so I don't even blame the devs for not knowing what to do at this point, because this community is complicated to satisfy due to the asymetrical nature of the game. If the community knew how to enjoy the quirky, silly and casual nature of the game, it would be another story.
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1, sure it doesn't. Same as yours. I am just stating my experience and stats
2, there are unofficial stats from nightlight. They are not as accurate, but it's the best thing available.
3, if we are talking really OP things, then I absolutely agree. But we are talking about hope+mft (so get to endgame and don't be exhausted). As you stated yourself - the more perks you "kill" for endgame, the less genrush perks you can take. Meaning you actively lower your chance to get to endgame at all - so if we are not talking old eruption or one of first versions of DS, then perk count actually counts (same as spirit fury+enduring is OK, because it requires 2 perks to work).
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Made for this + Hope is bad.
The way this game is now 2k is an epic win for me.
BTW I'm playing in bronze tier and I don't want to imagine what goes in in my usual purple tier.
Post edited by EQWashu on1 -
1) You can take a look at how many are agreeing on what I said vs how many are not. If you want to argue it was just me saying this and no one else. Then yes my experience is just as anecdotal as yours. However, with more people agreeing this combination needs fixing then I would say my anecdotal experience is more in line with the overall player experience. Sure, you can argue there only a few replies to this post. Unless you could make a survey post to get a larger sample size, this post and the replies are all there is to reflect the overall experience by players. Which is many do experience this combination giving an unfair advantage.
2) You say it is unofficial and then say it is the best thing? If it is unofficial then it is susceptible to bias and errors. Which makes it unreliable.
3) This again comes down to your personal opinion rather than the overall experience. Which I have already explained to you in point 1.
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Well, this is a different topic to what my post is about. However, the direction the developers are taking the game is towards competitive e sports. I agree this game is just a party game and should have remained that way. Regardless, the direction the company has decided to move towards is competitive play. That means balance has to be on point. If you make changes to one side, you must look at the other side in its entirety and see if they get too strong in anyway.
Also this might be a personal bias. I am not sure. I find that changes made to killers are much faster than to survivors. If something is too strong on the killer side, they are more quick to fix that than if there is something too strong on the survivor side. For example, gen regression meta did not last long. They were quick to hit that hard. It took a long time before CoH was changed for good. Same for DH, it took a long time before it was made less oppressive to killers.
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I personally don’t think this game is being taken to a competitive scene, let alone an esports one, which hopefully never will be the case because this game is not built for that. The game is just now more balanced than ever because people have complained a lot and want to go polishing the “impossible to do nothing against” situations.
Also please, always keep in mind that killer role will forever have the shortest side of the stick balancewise because the gap between killers abilities and powers is just too big, which in my opinion is amazing for the sake of variety. This also makes perks to get nerfed for how insanely they perform on certain killers (most recent case I remember was Awakened Awareness because of how it worked on Nurse), so we have to admit that the game will forever be complicated to get balanced because of that + the asymmetrical nature of the game.
But going back to the topic of gens, the game lacks any other objective for survivors, and in most games there is nothing else they can do if the killer does not want to interact with them for whatever reason. The 3 gen kicking meta playing with one’s self in an area of the map has hurt a lot the mindset of a lot of survivor players too, because they don’t want to get stuck in a game that last for +30 minutes, so they tend to want to rush gens. Also toolboxes are incredibly popular nowadays because of this + the other items getting nerfed, so it’s the most reliable options for a lot of survivors since it’s the safest and most efficient option right now.
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"Tunnelling is a necessity" - that is just NOT true and i annoys me so much that people keep repeating this dum statement over and over again. Nobody expects you to get 8 hooks before the first sacrifice, but hard tunneling from start to finish will give 3 Survs time to do gens for free.
So "If you play fair and switch survivors, at any given time there will always be 3 survivors on gen" is complete BS and is way more likely to happen when you Tunnel on one surv, not the other way around. You down one, hook him, he cant do gens. One person has to unhook and heal, cant do gens. One person gets chased, cant do gens. If it takes you multiple minutes every time to get a down that might be on YOU.
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Well. There are survivor topics, that are not fixed as of this date even though survivors complain about those from the inception of the game. Like facecamping - it's still not properly fixed - but at least there's supposed to be anti-facecamp mechanics being developed right now (thankfully - they are finally addressing it). Reassurance was bandaid for that that also took them like 6 years to do. So IDK, the speed feels terrible on both sides
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