Do you think Discord SWF unfair?

Do you think devs gonna say something that benefit em is unfair? If is "fair" why not add a voicechat as a feature in game much soloq players would be grateful

Unfair in the sense it absolutely does give a huge advantage for the SWF, good comms does so much for your team.

But should it be banned? Nah, DbD is a more casual party game than anything & a lot of people enjoy playing with friends and friends only. There's a reason this company hasn't put in a ranked mode after 7+ years.

I think its unfortunate, cause I do think there should be a ladder to climb that actually means something, but doubt they'll ever add a 'solo/duo only ranked mode'.

"using discord" is too broad, imo.

There are both extremes and everything in between: people who are in vc and have the game effectively muted because they're chatting away with their friends, not even paying attention to their screen half the time on the one hand, and hyper-focused and perfectly coordinated squads calling out every movement and every resource on the other hand.

Overall, I think comms that are actually used for match-related things are an advantage - but usually not a very big one / to the point where it's unfair.

I don't think so. It's only an advantage if the players are playing super sweaty, but the official numbers state that for the vast majority of swfs it's not the case.

Most people play with friends to hang out and chat, and hanging out and chatting is not unfair.

Also, as someone who works in surveys, the formulation of the question and restricting it to that specific demographic would make the results quite biased.

Does it give an advantage over solo survs and killers? Yes.

Would they ever change it? No.

Why? $$$$, It encourages your friends to either buy the game or cosmetics etc.

Businesses answer to shareholders/investors first, customers second.

They said they always intended SWF but it wasn't quite ready for launch back in 2016. I believe they were working on both that and KYF, and concentrated on KYF first.

I also believe they underestimated the impact of comms on the most efficient of skilled 4-man teams, where their coordination is most felt. Luckily those are the absolute rarest of the SWF, where casual 2-mans vastly outnumber 3's and 4's big time. Unless you're in that mythical high MMR area and matchmaking does its job, you won't go against those squads much if ever.

And how could they do a thing about comms anyway? Removing SWF is suicidal, and those comms are outside programs that they couldn't even know are being used in the first place. Unenforceable.

Ultimately, the game isn't, nor can it ever be, balanced around voice chat. When someone can tell their team mates what perks you're running, where you are exactly and what Killer you're playing before you've even encountered them, that's something almost impossible to balance around. It's inherently advantageous at even the lowest end of the spectrum (e.g. being able to tell your team Franklin's is in play so they all pre-drop items) and only drastically increases in effectiveness as you climb MMR. That's not to say the advantage is insurmountable, but even basic communication necessitates that the Killer be much, much better than the team they're facing in order to win.

There isn't anything Behaviour can or would be willing to do about it. Make it bannable? Good luck proving that in 99.99% of reports (which would no doubt go up one million percent were it made a reportable offence). All it would do is negatively impact streamers and their 100% free advertising of the game, which will never be allowed to happen.

To be honest I people saying how much of an advantage comms grants is quite overblown, the real strength is choosing your teammates. I also think calling out perks doesn't truly offer that much advantage in the large majority of the time, perks are incredibly easy to identify 95% of the time. Or calling out the killer. Most of this information can be quickly acquired from even just a minuscule amount of game sense through out a match.

In the vast majority of cases, a group of 4 really good solo players together will be just as effective as the same group with comms.

"But putting 4 bad survivors on comms won't make them good." QFT

The game was not originally designed with much consideration for voice chat, so in that respect it is a significant advantage.

However, in recent years, the developers have been balancing the game with more consideration for voice comms, so that advantage is shrinking with each update.

All that said, you're asking too broad a question. Voice comms is a two way street.

When I SWF, I play with some pretty competitive gamers who make lots of call-outs. Sometimes the call-outs are live updates, "i'm on gen. terror radius. killer on me. I'm taking him to shack. killer left, he's going main. he's undetectable." etc. Other times, the call-outs come like my friends have spotty reception, "killer on me. I'm embarassing him." ...and then 2 seconds later tombstone Myers is killing me, because I was lead to believe he was chasing someone elsewhere.

Most players are not making call-outs like they're playing Overwatch, because the game seldom demands that from them in order to win. Pubs are such a mixed bag that players can reliably win in SWF without comp-style comms, so they're communication is just as likely to be harmful as it is helpful.

The real advantage SWFs have is knowing their teammates' skill level, tendencies, and perk loadouts. Without saying any word, everyone knows who is the gen jock, how long each player is likely to last in chase, who can and cannot be unsafely unhooked, who is doing archives, etc. ADDITIONALLY, a SWF plays with their teammates' best interest in mind--solo queue's biggest downfall is the prisoner's dilemma.

Well by the devs own statistics it can increase your chances of escape (the win condition) by 15%. Put it this way if your playing a tennis match and your opponent took a steroid and he won 15% more of the time he would be branded a cheat.

You can identify jolt from the hud, even if you are not directly seeing it, as long as a survivor is working on the gen that was jolt'ed. I think I should preface the rest of this comment not every perk needs to be called out either because your strategy for dealing with perks in play should essentially be the same with them existing or not. IE jolt. It's not a real game perk thing and your strategy while jolt is in play should be the same regardless of it's existence in the match or not - being, stop looping near generators, and if you are on a map (such as midwitch, the game, etc) where it's affects are unavoidable, what use does it have to know when it pops across the map and you don't see it? It's regression isn't that great.

Same with perks that can be hidden, like mad grit, which should absolutely never be getting in value because 9/10 taking hits while someone is being carried is an awful idea. I also think, with the existence of pentimento, most people shouldn't bother with dull totems, and since NOED now reveals itself, I think that it is insignificant enough to not ever touch a dull totem. Totems were already a waste of time not spent on gens, and part of game sense is/was noting where dull totems were in the first place/potential spots, in case of NOED activating down the line.

So, re: blood warden. On the off chance this is in the match, you can still tell from game sense whether or not the killer is trying to make a play. Such as the gate opening without anyone touching a gate on the hud, or it happening very close to a down, or by who is being chased. The other day I ran into a huntress with blood warden, she opened the gates right before hooking someone and I just stayed away from the exit gates for the duration and then me and my teammate got the third person out. If there is any suspicion you should just go asap. But also, the ONLY way this changes in a swf is if someone has a stack of distortion and loses it stepping into the gates.

That being said, swf or not, stuff like end game builds are usually niche, and you should NOT expect them to work completely. They are very high risk/high reward.

Again, re: bubba, you can tell this from game sense and using the hud a lot of the time. Such as if you notice no one is being chased, or if you see someone get off a generator, in an attempt to rescue, gets chased for a short amount of time, and gets back on a gen. If they try to kobe/intentionally kill themselves on hook, I mean, a swf ain't gonna change that, it's more of a nice thing to do for your team while you are being camped than a rule, and it's definitely something you learn not to do down the line. Shrugs.

How is this first paragraph relevant to what I’m saying or have said, though? I may also be not communicating my thoughts properly too, mind you, I am in the spectrum and really don’t communicate my thoughts into words very well. As long as this game exists, whatever is in the rules is allowed, I have not said otherwise. Part of what you keep saying is explained by game sense, part of what you mentioned there is what you want out of the match yourself. You are never going to be completely coordinated in solo q, but that still doesn’t take away from how your actions or motives effects you team, and the actual goal of the game, being to get gens done. like flashlights and going for saves are incredibly fun, but I am not going to lie, a toolbox is going to be inherently be a better thing to bring. I’ve thrown matches for saves that never worked, and have had it happen to me.

But your average swf is not playing this in a high level, your average swf is hardly going to be able to properly communicate positions properly, your average swf is still going to have their own goals and intentions - whether they are going for challenges, dailies, whatever, nd each with their own strengths and weaknesses.

I feel like we’re also getting into the territory of what’s still missing from solo q. I have stated in multiple times on this forum that I want bond and kindred basekit, among other things, for this reason. I have very radical ideas to fully bridge that gap on what swfs can easily communicate and what solos know immediately. But that’s all wishful thinking and this is still relevant under what I keep saying, in game sense. Meaning where gens are throughout the match, what gens are done, what gens are remaining and where, among loads of other things. It’s not apparent all the time or immediately, you are correct. Game sense is… just the most important thing in this game that you could ever learn. And it comes with time. And having proper game sense is game changing, not just for survivors, but it’s equally, if not more important, as a killer too.

And please do not take my comments as I am defending solo queue as it is right now because it is not OK, largely unfun, and still needs a lot of work, especially for newer players, and your average team, and changes like bond or kindred base kit would still be helpful for the rest. I am not going to lie and say I’m like the best survivor because I’m very much so not, or lie and say I win every single solo q game, because I don’t. But yeah, solo q needs love.

And, again my original point to what you responded with is that four very good solos will play exactly the same as they would with or without coms, perks being called out is irrelevant to whether or not a killer is going to win or lose, and is often used as a crutch statement to excuse their loss, and the strength of swf is choosing your teammates.

This. At the risk of whataboutism, I think it's unfair to expect a solo queue team to fair well against a competent killer with a stacked loadout when one teammate doesn't even know what planet they're on and has a fraction of the hours their teammates have on average. I'd wager almost everyone would agree matchmaking is awful on a good day.

I wouldn't say it's unfair. Because even a SWF can be uncoordinated and just having fun with friends. Get tired of the stigma that every SWF is some esports comp team, I attribute it to the killer just not being as skilled as they think they are. Same with survivors saying killer is OP, the killer you went against was just better than you.

Just how it works in this highly competitive party game.

No, most swfs are just normal players not sweaty comp squads(though I do run into some and it never feels good to get stomped).

Unfair? Yes. Enforceable to stop? No. The devs are essentially forced to balance around SWFs in voice comms because it's going to happen regardless of what they try. Frankly, the best thing they could probably do is add voice comms....but then again...I'd imagine due to how toxic the community can be that it would be a lot of hate speech being thrown to people in solo queue.

Hit the nail on the head. It's getting tiresome.

How many perks does being in a SWF provide for free?

How would the game make the difference between swf with comms, swf without comms, casual/bad swfs (that by the devs' own stats do not have a significantly higher escape rate) and very good swfs ?

Sounds complicated to punish one thing without unbalancing it for two others...

(Not looking to be agressive, just wondering !)

I wasn't saying anyone was suggesting it be banned, or suggesting myself that it should be. I was just musing on why it couldn't be even if we wanted to.