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Onryo is so over tuned at the moment
They need to at bare minimum put her cooldown on teleports to 17 seconds or leave the cooldown and rework the healing add on to do something else. I think that would balance her out a bit where as surv i dont feel like im just a tape delivery guy!
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or you could grab a tape
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Tell that to my solo queue teammates. 👍️
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soloq bad =/= sadako brokery
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you get free stacks if you get hit on top of that she can leave you instantly to give you more condemn stacks by teleporting.
which just makes the gameplay , go to side A to side B , repeat over and over while doing your main objective.
which leads to 20+ minutes matches where the Onrio isnt chasing , just slugging over and over, just delaying the game in a boring way ; against a solid team she is gonna lose the game anyway but making everyone bored during the match.
meanwhile a solo Q literally gets stomp due to the lack of communication and how 70% of them are either new players and bad players , basically you get a free win against those teams by just putting a low skill input while playing onryo which is bad , u just abuse how weaker solo Q is to secure the win by using the condemmed strat which was way more harder to do back in the past.
Now is just , 90% on the Onryo games are a 20 minutes matches of slug fest. 😴
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2 stacks of condemn on hit would take over 40s to build by tp. As long as you are spending at least 40s with that tape then you are fine. Plus cleansing gets rid of 5 entire stacks of condemn... so just only cleanse if you need to.
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she isnt that strong imo. she is B tier at best, most people just dont know how to play against her, at the end of the day she is m1 killer who has very weak power at chase.
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According to who?
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Anyone who's played a solo q match against her. Srsly even my SWF games are struggling against her. You have to balance tapes extremely carefully, and if you don't do that? Insta mori'd at 3 gens.
Her power is easy to abuse atm. God tier swfs are having an easy time because they can loop her for days. But very few players are that good at chase. She is rofl stomping solo q games consistently.
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If the main counterplay is to hold a tape and deny the surv use of an item, thats broken immediatly. Items help counter act the strength the the killers power.
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If that were true franklins would be the most broken perk in the game. You dont NEED an item. grab a tape.
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The person I replied to said that solo queue being bad DOESN'T equal Sadako being broken. I'm on your side.
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She is a bit of a noob stomper. I don't think I've had a single Sadako game where I haven't mori'd (or been able to mori) at least one survivor, and typically 2-3 of them.
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Let us compare her to a similar teleporting killer - Freddy.
Freddy:
1) Can teleport to unfinished generators, fewer as the match goes on. reasonable cooldown.
2) Has in chase slowdown.
Sadako:
1) Can teleport to any TV that has not been used recently. Short cooldown.
2) Can control terror radius.
3) Continuos corruption buildup and she can destroy carried tapes to build up corruption faster. This acts as a passive slowdown.
4) Buiit in Mori!
To balance these killers either we need to remove some of Ring Girls' abilities and buff Freddy considerably.
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The rework is just badly designed. Building up condemn is braindead as you can just press a button every 10 seconds or slug people with tapes. The counterplay is simple to just hold a tape at all times but if you're whole team isn't on board someone will just die very early and the game is ruined.
The rework just punishes newer and inexperienced players while the nerfs to accommodate global condemn punish Onryo against experienced players. They nerfed her mobility, as well as her chase by nerfing her ability to do manifestation mindgames. She is a weaker killer than before but this all is reliant upon survivors not knowing the exact correct counterplay. This is simply bad game design and frustrating for everyone all around.
Global condemn is a huge issue because it is a nightmare to balance since it has high potential to be oppressive as we can see. Because of this potential, everything else about her kit has to be balanced around it which is why there are nerfs to her mobility which was the fun part of her kit. Condemn is now the focus of her character as a killer instead of mobility, and at the expense of mobility. This means Onryo players are incentivized to go even harder into condemn strategies. These changes they have made just make her less fun to play with more traditional playstyles and instead encourage and incentivize less fun condemn playstyles.
They need to just drop the whole rework and either start over and try again, or make small changes to the old Onryo like the changes to Ring Drawing and TV cooldowns.
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I agree that people will start to catch on but once everyone gives her the Plague treatment and does the one counterplay, then she will start to struggle due to the nerfs to her kit to try and make global condemn not oppressive.
Also survivors had to interact with her power before the rework. If you wanted to do a gen in peace, take a tape. If you wanted to get a unhook without her coming out of the TV 3 meters away, take a tape. Not to mention anytime she teleported near a survivor, that was also an interaction with her power. Good Onryos could build up condemn with Iri-tape and create the need for interactions as well.
Furthermore the changes to tapes are just silly. They are "cursed" tapes. You write, "Originally, you countered her by….doing nothing". This was actually how she was supposed to be. She curses people who watch her tape. As a result, most of the time you only used to be in danger from condemn when you grabbed "watched" her tape (ignore bad slug strategy that got rightfully nerfed). You are supposed to fear them and not interact with them. Having a tape on you was when a survivor would be in the most danger during a match because Onryo could find they TV point and make their life very hard.
Now survivors holding a tape functions to protect them. There is no curse or danger. The rework just goes completely against the spirit of the character unlike the original design which nailed it. The rework also is just bad for balance and creates incentives for players to play the game in ways which make it less fun for everyone.
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If you flat out nerf her, her problems won't be solved.
We would only have another Freddy situation where the killer becomes so weak that nobody wants to play them. A ungodly mixture of boring and weak.
Her rework is flawed by design. Thats it.
The correct desicion would be to revert the changes and change her in the right way.
#bringbackSadako
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The rework just punishes newer and inexperienced players while the nerfs to accommodate global condemn punish Onryo against experienced players.
This is literally the same argument that was used to nerf old Freddy (and I mean the original one) and look where he is now, Sadako shouldn't just be made into another M2 andy just to help newer players.
They nerfed her mobility
???
You can teleport more consistently now. Or do you think that getting punished for 100 seconds just for using your power was better? I really don't get this argument you are making, her mobility is infinitely better than before.
as well as her chase by nerfing her ability to do manifestation mindgames.
Manifestation """mindgames""" were always useless, you had to work for a thing that spirit literally gets for free without getting slowed down. It doesn't work at most loops and the ones where it does work can be dealt with by basically any other 115% killer with zero issues. I got them to work mostly against survivors who were clearly bad at chases but each time I tried the same against more experienced loopers they didn't even bother.
She is a weaker killer than before but this all is reliant upon survivors not knowing the exact correct counterplay.
She really isn't. This is an overall upgrade to her old gameplay that makes her condemnation more consistent, you still have to guess where survivors are going to go to build condemned and try to bottleneck them, that was and still is the correct way to build condemnation. Just teleporting to random TVs every 10 seconds does not work against good survivors, they will grab the tape, do gens, and move on to the next ones. You are supposed to read their movements and cut them off at every possible moment just like before but with the tapes becoming a much more prominent which gives her much needed slowdown. I do agree this may be to much for solo q and newer players, that's why I have been saying her counterplay needs to be made clearer, but her gameplay should stay the same.
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Survivors can hold a normal item and a killer item at the same time. That was changed a bit ago. Survivors don't have to make strategic decisions about them anymore.
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I agree. i was about to write something similar to this.
Manifestation """mindgames""" were always useless, you had to work for a thing that spirit literally gets for free without getting slowed down. It doesn't work at most loops and the ones where it does work can be dealt with by basically any other 115% killer with zero issues. I got them to work mostly against survivors who were clearly bad at chases but each time I tried the same against more experienced loopers they didn't even bother.
they would have rework the invisibility where you get invisibility for like 2 seconds passively and when you decloak, you can extend it by 1..25 that goes on and off for 2-3 times. this in addition to making that you do not lose movement speed when decloaking because i think you move at like 96% or something like that for 1 second. that is close to original spirit mindgames. that how it would work if you wanted it to work against experienced loopers. that would surely catch me off guard for sure. She would have anti-loop but posts like these already show struggles of playing vs condemn mechanic. this would make like A-S tier but one can argue that not every character needs to be that. some of them can just be their own special charm.
This is an overall upgrade to her old gameplay that makes her condemnation more consistent, you still have to guess where survivors are going to go to build condemned and try to bottleneck them, that was and still is the correct way to build condemnation.
it is upgrade to her gameplay without any emphasis on slugging. I personally feel that sadako would have greater reception as chapter if she was like this from the start. to me, the character feels like brand new experience.
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ah so survivor can actually choose to use regular item when holding special item? No they can't. If the only counter to killer is to hold the tape whole game, then you effectively included built-in franklins into the killer
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I went against two Onryos in a row this morning. The first time I accidentally screwed over a teammate by grabbing a tape from a TV while she was coming towards me, and she had more condemned stacks than I did. She got downed shortly after, DC'd, and then her bot got the death stare. I felt bad.
The second Onryo played the slugging game, so my condemned stacks built up too fast and I was unable to get tapes due to being slugged for half the match, and I got the death stare like three minutes into the match.
So yeah, she's feeling a bit oppressive to play against atm. I told myself I would DC if I got another Onryo in a row, but thankfully I didn't.
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