Ultimate solution for balance SWF
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Nobody plays with their friends any game ever to get punished for doing so. Stop thinking about punishing SWFs, and start thinking about how solo q could get closer and closer to the level of SWF, and then balance from there.
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They do that because they are not 4v1 asymmetrical games. You can't do that in a 4v1 and expect it to succeed, it just will not succeed. It's a solo person against a team, the soloi can't have a team therefore it would be a feature against the team, and the solo would get conditioned by it. I understand that you all like this feature on TCM (3v4, so it makes sense, both multi player teams), but it'll never work on DBD and it's about time you all accept it.
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I've had a convo on here with a killer player who said they dodge 7-10 lobbies each time they queue up in search of "a fair match" to them. Imagine what that does to the matchmaking system, and they stated they cared not what it did to other players.
When asked what they dodge, they rattled off their list:
Any p100; more than one toolbox; any private profile on Steam; any matching cosmetics; any already readied-up lobby; more than one flashlight; every Mickela (boons were still a thing then); every Ace; no CrossPlay survs present; and so on.
So I said, that only leaves guaranteed CrossPlay solos. And they said exactly.
Lobby shopping
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Voting up is not enough, I need to retweet this!
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any already readied-up lobby;
This one is actually fair. It indicates you have been backfilled. So you're avoiding a genuinely unfair match, and you're not creating a new backfill opening, simply shifting it sideways.
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And maybe that's fair, but it indicated that lobby was already dodged a few times. This is the primary source of newish killers being thrown to the wolves, and coming on here rightfully complaining. The new player experience is pretty rough without those imbalances thrown in too.
What I'd like to see tested is no lobbies at all, just load straight into a match. See what that does to match quality. And as a bonus, it would eliminate that last second swapping bs survs can do. 😎
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Would be a decent thing to test. Personally if I'm playing survivor and I see the killer keeps dodging, I'll leave the survivor lobby and requeue as well, even if it takes a bit longer. Any player leaving should reset the lobby, or at least reset the matchmaking system rather than doing away with it entirely.
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You cannot punish the killer by pitting them against players who can very easily coordinate by simply playing with their friends.
I mean, the devs can, I guess, and that's why things are the way they are...
Oh well. Killers only make up 20% of the game's population anyway.
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I don't think it does away with the matchmaking until the lobby has been waiting for too long, then it just grabs someone. But we have no idea how long or really any details about the system. More transparency here would be much appreciated.
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Oh it has to be more than 20%, as I believe most do play both roles even if they "main" a side they favor.
I do wish all players played both at least to a competent level. It would cut down on the bias's massively, and generate some much needed empathy all around. Plus playing surv makes you a better killer, just as playing killer makes you a better surv.
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dumb plan-killer/ like why nerf swf its fine by the peple that take their time and try to get good at the game like its just a matter of skill
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How about there should just not be any multiplayer games let's go that far and you should only play agains't bots. That sounds ridicious right but as ridicious is to deny people playing multiplayer with friends. I would just deny it with ramdoms too then.
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I have the best solution to balance
-Remove the survivors and the killers
-Remove all perks
-Remove all maps
-When entering a match, a video about the zoo plays
No need to thank me😌
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No it doesn’t. If I quit or DC for whatever reason in the lobby as killer after the survivors have readied up their next killer will just see them all readied. And they could be a lobby full of newbie or lower-skilled players (and would be because my killer MMR is low).
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Yes that's literally a backfill. I'm not sure what your point is.
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Backfill doesn’t mean you’re avoiding an “unfair match”. That is my point.
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I'm just glad you don't run this game because it would sink on launch day. If you ever develop a game, I wish you all the luck in the world, because you will definitely need it.
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The killer isn't being punished. There are no limitations being placed on them. Show me evidence that they are being punished. You can't point to SWF as that is an intended and expected part of the game. External comms are also an intended and expected part of the game. You getting outplayed is not a punishment.
If you place limitations or restrictions on friends who play together, you are punishing them for playing together. Killers are not being punished by the existence of SWF.
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I'm not talking about "mains." I'm talking about every match of DbD needs 4 survivors and 1 killer.
I would argue less than 20% since the survivor queues times are longer on average.
But it's fine if the killer role is miserable. The game needs 4 survivors for every killer. Matchmaking wouldn't work if the game were equally fun for both roles and the split was 50/50.
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Are you trying to gaslight me? You know I've played the game as the killer role, right?
Maybe you're trying to say that the difficulty versing SWF is the norm/standard, and that versing SoloQ is just an easy reward/break from the norm? If you're trying to say that there is no discernible difference between SWF and Solo, that's... a reach.
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Games that let you know you are going against a premade are team vs team games, where it’s fair since both sides are multi player and not solo vs team games. You can’t implement that feature in a 4v1 game and expect it to succeed. Horrible, terrible and naive idea to think that it would do more good than harm to DbD.
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Gaslight you? Hardly. You insist that killers are punished due to the nature of how swfs can coordinate. I said nothing on the difficulty of versing swfs instead of solos.
What I did say is that SWF is an intended part of the game. Versing Solo Q isn't a reward or a break from the norm, nor is versing SWF a punishment for playing killer. Both are merely a natural part of the game.
The killer isn't being forced to play with one hand tied behind their back, nor are they being forced to play like it's a world championship and there's a prize on the line for the winner.
Placing limitations on survivors who play with friends, on the other hand, is punishing them for playing with their friends. It's a punishment because their only choices are to accept that they have to play with restrictions if they want to play together, or they have to play solo queue.
In exchange, the killer gets to have all the tools at their disposal and is not limited nor restricted. That hardly sounds fair.
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On the second 30 of the lobby timer, an SWF indicator should appear above the corresponding survivors, leaving the lobby at that point would incur a DC penalty.
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And it's a punishment for killers because their only choices are to accept that they have to play against team coordination if the survivors choose to play together, or they have to play the survivor role (or another game entirely).
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Exactly what constitutes "fun" for killers? From what I've seen, it isn't fun unless you ("You" used in the general sense, not you specifically) win every match. Flashlights are unfun. Toolboxes are unfun. Medkits are unfun. Looping is unfun. Pallets are unfun. Vaults are unfun. Perks are unfun. Swf is unfun.
The game could be equally fun for both roles if both roles could focus more on just playing the game instead of expecting to win every match. I play for fun, and for me that means I get to do a little bit of everything and if I die then so be it. I'm significantly less happy if all I've done is touch a gen for a second, and then be chased for an eternity and subsequently camped to death. I derive zero enjoyment from seeing other people get to play while I sit there and watch a meter drain.
If all people want is to win, then they're just setting themselves up for disappointment.
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Is it really that serious? 😭
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You can't even point to a single shred of evidence that suggests killers are being punished. Your whole argument is just one big complaint about SWF being able to coordinate.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but it is intended and expected that survivors will play with their friends, and it is intended and expected that they will coordinate. That isn't a punishment for the killer. That's just how the game's designed. You aren't being forced to play the game. You could just move on to another game. But I assure you that even in other games, people play with their friends and coordinate. Overwatch has it. League has it. Apex has it. Valorant has it. Call of Duty has it. Texas Chainsaw has it.
You'd be hard pressed to find a multiplayer pvp game that doesn't allow players to play with their friends and coordinate.
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It's not a reach, it's reality.
Official stats (from last year) were that at the extreme ends of the bell curve, the difference in escape rates between solo and SWF are as much as 15%. Which is to say the majority are less than 15% apart. If you want to be generous you could presume 10% on average.
That's not that much. That's less than the difference between one extra kill per game. For survivors that's one extra escape every 10 games.
Also, only 4% of survivors are a 4-man SWF.
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