General Discussions
General Discussions
Anti-Camp Mechanic Teased!
Upcoming mid-chapter looks good so far.
Also why Jane? :0 Are killah mains enjoying to camp her?
Comments
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Omg please be good and not totally broken.🙏🏻
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Jane is just doing the reporting
edit - btw... when is ptb?
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Jane: This toxic trapper camped me and ignored everything else. Please ban this guy, i am adding this picture as proof.
It should be 19th btw, it's usually 3rd Tuesday after chapter releases.
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😭😭😭
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Yaaaas finally.
… though what if my random teammates leave me on hook when the killer is not even camping me? 🤔
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Just last game I managed to hunt that Gabriel Soma, who was my obsession, down with 7 stacks, one Nea even took a protection hit so I got up to 8. I missed him with about 8 tail attacks, before I got the down, but boi oh boi is it fun and a pure power fantasy, to run around unfettered with 8 stacks of STBFL. I only got this once before with a Pig and a lucky ambush down. The games never last long after you put the lid on the 8 stacks, but its surely is delicious as hell.
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on the other hand... sometimes kindred shows the killer is right there kicking a few pallets and stuff before they leave and they come right away...
solo q sometimes is just beautiful isn't it?
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This will only help with trades agaisnt one shot killers, that are mostly weak anyway. After the hook grabs were removed there is no longer a way to prevent someone from being unhooked. The sooner they are freed, the sooner they will be tunneled back to the hook. No more waiting for bleedout.
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adding to this.
edit
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So if you are roaming on a different floor (Midwich, The Game) you are considered as "camping"?
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I really hope that it's not abusable....
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That is scary to me. Maps like midwich are already awful when it comes to hooks.
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Remember, as long as you are still on the same map after hooking, you are camping :D
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It should take the number of generators done into account.
If killer is trying to secure a kill when there are 3 gens done already and is struggling and going away pretty much means a loss of the match is not the same as doing a face-camp at 5 gens just because it can.
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the conditions are so far unclear
so do we all... well "we all". if you know what I mean
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Nothing we didn't already know about.
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I agree there should be some kind of gradient there.
Camping at four or five gens left should be the intended target of any changes, not reasonable proxying with only one or no gens left to get that kill.
There's a huge difference between the two scenarios. Very much like they need to be careful with looking into everyone slugged. It matters when these things occur in a trial.
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I know what you mean....
Sadly I do.
Cough lockers cough...
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not all of us are as aware as each other.
being disabled on egc was new to me
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I wonder why the endurance effects doesn’t disable after all 5 gens are done or during EGC.
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So the worse the Killer is at the game the more should they benefit from hand-holding?
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You never see this argument raised for survivors. Ever. Hell, a popular thread circulating is full of killer mains saying the last survivor shouldn’t even have hatch available as an escape option. It’s beyond belief.
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Ugh, i can't believe they are actually going through with this.
- Get hooked
- Get camped
- Unhook yourself
- Killer downs you 15 seconds later because they are camping you
- Get hooked
- Why am i on the hook still? This anti camping mechanic was supposed to fix it!?
Meanwhile, SWF abusing the hell out of the mechanic to allow people to unhook themselves.
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The correct play for failing to defend gens is never to forego defending gens entirely and camp someone out. It's always a cheap tactic before endgame, but as soon as those exit gates are powered, anything goes.
So no, I don't think this is something that should scale with generators repaired. If anything, this will make it more profitable to pressure those final gens instead of camping, because survivors may not go for the save right away if they wait to see if the killer is camping first. So they will stick to the gens, meaning you want to go for the gens where you will find them and interrupt them.
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what? what are you even trying to say here?
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It's about punishing a player who is already struggling. Theoretically good survivors don't need immunity after being unhooked at all because they won't get caught and hooked in the first place. Yet no matter how good or bad you are, this system exists so people can't just get camped to death with 0 chance of escaping ( they may still get sandbagged by their team mates by simply being unhooked right in the face of the killer ). This anti-camp mechanic is meant to give survivors a chance to play the game at all if they got caught very early instead of being sacrificed after being downed in first minute or so. However if survivor got caught early and 2 or more gens got popped for whatever reason, should killer be punished even more by giving that survivor a free escape?
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How you intend to pressure those remaining gens without a solid triangle and good gen defense perks ( unless you are slugger Nurse / Blight with top addons and perks ) when there are 4 survivors alive out there, running away from you far before you get anywhere near? You will end up running around trying to catch someone and by the time you get one, survivors will pop the remaining gens so you still get the same scenario.
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I mean, seriously, play better then if you struggle. Or just take the loss, because it is completely fine to lose in a videogame. This would be compareable to getting an Action Speed-Buff as Survivor when one of your mates is dead. The Survivor-Team did not play well, why should they be rewarded?
The system deactivates in Endgame, which is fine (even tho, I think this is just a pity kill at this point when the only way you get a Kill is when almost all Survivor-Defenses are deactivated), but it should not do more than that.
Yes, it makes more sense to camp at 2 Gens left compared to 5 Gens left. I get it. But it does not really make sense to reward the Killer for playing badly.
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The same could be said about survivors. Got caught early and caught again after being unhooked? Play better. Got caught and camped to death? Play better. For some reason it's ok to tell killers to take loss or get good but it's not fine to do for survivors.
Again it's not about rewarding killer for playing badly. It's about not robbing killer the chance for comeback when it's clear that it's not about defending all gens but getting one player out so there's a room for contest afterwards rather than just let captured player go no matter what and make killer play the role of entertainer who must keep moving from one gen to another no matter what.
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Ironic thing to say given that good survivors can already counter camping just fine without this feature. This is meant to help or rather "hand hold" the more casual/average side of the survivor player base.
You are being very dismissive of this.
Even assuming its just 15 seconds as you say and the survivor can't reach a pallet or tile and has no perks to help them like SB, DS, DH or off the record ( forces them to hit you and grant you a speed boost instead of just waiting 10 seconds) that's still 15 seconds that each of your team mates can use to do generators or try to help.
As for the SWF abuse comment: survivors near the hooked person will slow or outright stop this feature.
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They tried it before, and did the exact same thing, where survivors "near the hook" would deactivate it, yet it was never implemented because SWF abused it. Why would this be any different?
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So survivors will be happy that is how camping is dealt with? That they get facee camped and then hard tunneled back onto the hook? That will make the game more fun for them?
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Also i'll draw a diagram showing exactly how SWF will abuse this on several maps, and very easily too.
The blue is the big 16 meter "you are camping" cone.
The map is midwich. All a survivor has to do, is run the chase underneath the survivor on the hook and the killer will be deemed "camping" meaning that eventually the person can unhook themselves. You can slow it down, or do w/e you want, the point is, SWF will abuse this, they'll be able to pop back in and out of the radius to make the killer "camp" while communicating the current status of this mechanic.
Coms allow survivors to abuse the hell out of it.
Solo queue won't change, because the killer still facecamps, and leatherface still saws you twice in one sweep right after you unhook yourself, and right back to the hook you go.
Camping itself, is a BAD strategy, you will LOSE the game by just flat out camping. The problem is it is BORING, so the fix here, is to discourage the BORING gameplay. But will survivors have any more fun unhooking themselves, then getting hard tunneled right back onto the hook? I sincerely doubt it.
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This doesn't make any sense.
If the killer is chasing a survivor on a different floor, they're not camping... so you can go for the rescue...
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That's the point, but the mechanic will deem the killer is camping, because everything that is radius based in this game is a big cylinder that goes through everything, not a sphere. So the mechanic will say "oh look, killer nearby, guess they are camping, let me fill the bar" meanwhile the survivor is actually being chased. So now you can have 2 survivors working on gens, while the one on hook just unhooks themselves thanks to the "camping" killer
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all I care about is this and I hope they don't chicken out after PTB because of all the crying, camping basement has been overpowered for a long time, it ruins so many games just because someone was caught in the wrong spot
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As always, every time this discussion occurs, depending on the variables used to fill the gauge, it may not fill at all, in time for the survivor to use it, if there's any survivors in the zone along with the killer being in it intermittently.
This scenario doesn't have the killer permanently in the zone, they have to leave it to change level. And with the other survivor slowing down the progress, it might not even get to 100% before the 60s hook state has finished.
If there's a risk of that happening, then survivors still need to go for the save.
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IIRC having a survivor in the radius negates the unhook timer, not 100% on that though. If so, it should account for those situations.
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Reward killers who actually leave the ''camping'' area on top of punishing aggressive 5 gen face camp and you might find a sweet spot. If all you do is try to make it harder, then expect nothing but counterforce being applied to it. People will still find a way to camp or will simply tunnel even more aggressively.
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Every single radius in the game works this way, i doubt they will change it.
Secondly, you can say "another survivor in the radius blocks it" but it is not hard for the guy on hook to use coms to say "bar going up" or "bar going down get back a bit" to try and trick the killer into the radius. Again, it is a complex mechanic that SWF will abuse while not actually solving the problem of the person being hard camped and tunneled out of the game.
You still have yet to answer the question, will you have more fun getting facecamped with this mechanic? Will it actually solve your problem? Or will you still rage and DC anyway?
Lastly, there are so many better ways they can do this that are far simpler to implement, understand and actually address the problem.
Why not just make it work like PH cage? If killer is close to the hook, they teleport to a different one?
Or my always proposed favorite, tackle tunneling and camping in 1 go, make survivors share the 1st hook state. Now in order to tunnel or camp someone out, you need 6 hooks before you can kill someone.
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This post also confirms that they are making it work through multiple floors. So again ,this is gonna get hella abuse by SWF.
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"Ironic thing to say given that good survivors can already counter camping just fine without this feature. This is meant to help or rather "hand hold" the more casual/average side of the survivor player base."
The thing is not that camping can be countered. It can be countered - somewhat - even tho it might not even be effective. But if the Killer is camping they will at least get a trade out of this, because even with Hook Grabs removed, a Killer will manage to down the Unhooker and will at least have a Trade.
To amke a safe Unhook which does not result in a trade, you will need two Survivors who go for the Unhook. And at this point you can ask, if standing in front of the Hook should be so powerful that you can occupy 50% of the team with Unhooks and keep 75% of the team off Gens by...Just standing there.
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I find it's kinda silly to be so certain of it until we know the actual rules by which it operates.
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You already occupy 75% of the team by not camping too. 1 on the hook, 1 being chased, 1 going for the save, 1 on gens. So camping doesn't really change this idea at all which is why it is bad, because the team has 60 seconds to go for the save, meanwhile they can have 2 survivors working gens, 1 going for the save, and then realizing that they are camping, then they can wait it out a bit longer, and have a 3rd come, giving more total time on gens. This is why camping is actually an inefficient and bad strategy. The only reason it works is because survivors let it, by usually standing around pointing at the killer or in general doing nothing instead of countering the camping because it is "unfair" or "boring"
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They already told us before and if you read the twitter thread they are already confirming details.
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I mean, you cannot really compare them, when you even write that one person is being chased. This is more input than standing in front of the Hook.
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you mean the quotes I posted?
nothing that warrants such doom posting.
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I think you are all misunderstanding me.
I do not disagree that camping should be fixed, but not through a mechanic like this that is abusable by SWF. It needs to be dealt with at a systemic level that the game is balanced around that SWF can't "abuse"
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Fair point on the multiple floor argument. But camping against this kind of efficient sweaty Swf is throwing the game regardless of whether or not they abuse this mechanic. However this anti-face camp will still plenty helpful for average survivors playing solo.
I know you want to balance around the high levels but this feature won't really matter at the higher levels all that much while being very helpful for the average survivor.
Furthermore any feature that discourages and weakens camping will reduce how often it is used and thus lower the frustration and boredom factor.
"Or my always proposed favorite, tackle tunneling and camping in 1 go, make survivors share the 1st hook state. Now in order to tunnel or camp someone out, you need 6 hooks before you can kill someone"
That will shrink the amount of viable killers by a lot. And that is not something the game can afford right now.
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Being able to fight back and actually get chased again is definitely better than just waiting on the hook with the killer. Not ideal but a big improvement.
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