I thank you for buffing survivors but what about killers?
Of course I play survivors more than I do killers but when will killers get something sweet? Aren't they getting a fov slider at some point? Give these guys something good too you're leaving them out for no good reason.
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Just because one side receives more changes than the other in a patch, doesn't mean they require an equal attention patch
Killers have also been eating good lately with several perks becoming viable in recent times, several buffs to specific killers, and nerfs to the Survivor meta (mainly DH and medkits)
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So what buffs exactly did survivors get?
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Yeah, I'm not sure why people expect something just cause the other side got something. Survivors and killers are not four year old siblings, and BHVR are not our parents. As far as I know.
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We don't care about killer here.
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The mistake you're making here is assuming that the killer experience matters to BHVR. It doesn't. There's 4 survivors to every one killer and considering survivors play the game in 3rd person and the characters themselves are mostly just skins, they're going to be way more likely to buy cosmetics. That means that BHVR has a pretty vested interest in keeping them as happy as can be. if that means giving them a ton of information, making perks like BT basekit, on top of giving them busted perks that let them extend chases forever, while designing maps such that they have an easy time looping killers forever, all while gutting any killer perks and strats to ensure that survivors have a good time, then yeah, they're going to do all of that.
Killers sell on name brand recognition. There's always someone that'll go "Oh #########, a game that lets me play a freddy krueger and nemesis? I'm in!". There's always going to be new killer players to feed to grinder, so they don't have to bother trying to retain them, so the killer experience is going to get worse and worse and worse, and it won't matter. Killers aren't getting #########.
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both sides have issues. it would be nice if one side isn't solely focused on for fixes and qol improvements. (which I'm not saying it is, just giving a reason as to why it would be expected)
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This is probably one of the best takes I have read. I agree with everything.
To add onto Zenislevs thought. In any business you cater to your majority. The survivors outnumber killers 4 to 1. If the game is easier they will play more, they will buy more, they will bring in friends who will buy.
It just makes business sense.
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The whole issue is this....solo survivor underpowered....SWF or higher level Survivors Killer underpowered. The mistake is that Behavior keeps giving Survivors more and taking away from Killers to help the solos, but the real issue is that it overbuffs the hell out of SWF and solid Survivor groups. They have to separate the two. SWF should give the Killer some benefit. Reduce the amount of hooks needed to 2, survivors can't have more than one tool in the group so one flashlight, one toolbox, etc. Hell even give Killers Shadowborn and Play with Your Food as the base build.
SWF and Solo are two totally different situations and you can't buff one without the other being ridiculously overpowered. When 2 or more players are SWF there needs to be a change in the game to balance it. When its solo que continue to seek balance by helping survivors.
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Frankly I think killers have been eating good since Tools of Torment's midchapter.
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Visual heart beat for hard hearing people, that was a strong buff.
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On ptb, jumping into windows became the same as when updating with Nicolas Cage. Before that, they added a detailed hud, an anti-tunnel to the mechanic. In short, you will lie if you say that there are none at all.
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If BHVR wants to cater to Survivors, why have Survivors received so many Nerfs since 2016?
Why did they not keep Infinites in the game? Or Perks in their base state? No Exhaustion, but Perks on 20 second Cooldown?
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You guys always say "facecamp is a losing strategy" but now anti-facecamp is a nerf ? you need to choose if it's weak or strong, if anything now you can leave the hook and learn to play the game, pressure somewhere else
the truth it was always too strong for how brainless it is, especially with one shot killers and perks like deadlock, zero skill needed and it punish solo teams very hard because they don't know you're camping and they're always altruistic, good riddance
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Well there needs to be killers to play at all
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Friendo, you're the only person talking about anti-facecamp here (and I certainly see no-one in here calling it a nerf). Who are you even responding to?
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Because player experience buffs aren't the same things as the kill rate.
BHVR has stated multiple times that the important thing for killers is the kill rate. (As if it
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I'm not even sure this isn't a parody post. Rewind the clock just over a year ago. Survivors had 5 second decisive strikes that worked the entire match, they had full power dead hard with iframes and distance gained, medkits could heal players multiple times at twice the speed of being healed by a teammate, plus all the little killer buffs with the 6.1 patch. All the recent killers destroy loops, reducing survivors chases to prethrow and press 'w'.
I am sorry this is the golden age for killers, and if you aren't experiencing that maybe you are at the highest possible MMR and facing the absolutely cracked survivors every match. What I think is more likely is that you more likely mid - tier killer that has a skill issue.
Most of the survivor buffs your complaining about, behavior had to add to counter toxic killer behaviors: Camping & tunnelling,
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Yeah, but according to the person I quoted, those Killer players are drawn to the game with licenses. Their point was that Survivors are kept strong because they generate more money and Killers are drawn to the game (replacing old Killer mains) with new licenses.
And yet, if this would be true, why nerf Survivors at all?
(I mean, the take I quoted was just really bad and everyone should know this)
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They were trying to fix vaults because fast vaults were basically medium vaults and that isn’t how they always were nor how they were meant to be. But they did revert the change so fast vaults once again equal medium vaults (although they do plan on fixing this eventually). The HUD was added to help solo queue survivors who make up the lion’s share of players yet have the worst experiences in the game. And even then it’s not exactly gamebreaking. You could literally do the same thing with a handful of perks. So those are two quality of life changes, one of which was reverted. If by anti-tunnel you mean basekit BT, that wasn’t a buff but another quality of life change so that survivors got a chance to play the game and weren’t deleted within 1 minute of joining a match by being tunneled out.
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heartbeat visual, chasing UI interaction , so solo survivor will very know when other survivor getting chase , they will focus on generator. Very not good advantage for killer
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Dont worry, some Solos dont work on Gens when someone else is chased. The indicator means nothing to them. And the good Survivors already know what to do when they dont get chased.
It is not like the UI turned every Potato into a godlike player.
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Do you honestly think that's not the case? When does dbd get its biggest spike in players? Whenever a new licensed killer is out, and what happens to the BP bonus then? It switches over to survivor and stays there for a long time. No one's coming to the game to play renalto and thalita. Maybe some people want to play as ripley sure, she's cool, but the real star of every licensed content patch is the killer.
Survivors will occasionally get nerfs because these devs aren't complete VHS level hacks. They pretend to care about the game's balance sometimes, but that doesn't change the fact that when they get strong stuff it mostly goes untouched, but the instant killers get something strong, it gets nuked off the face of the earth. Remember old undying ruin? You know, the meta that promoted patrolling gens and getting into chases, that thing that survivors pretend to want? Gone. Remember the gen kick meta? The one that required that you put together 3 perks that were rather mediocre on their own, CoB, overcharge and eruption, most of which could be undone by just tapping a gen, yeah that had to go. Remember pain res and DMS? Too strong apparently, so they removed the synergy and then they nerfed both perks to the ground, then once both perks had been defanged, they reinstated the synergy. Fantastic. What about old pop, a perk no one, and I mean no one thought was too strong, but it got gutted anyways because all regression had to be dumpstered because survivors didn't like it.
How many years did DH go untouched, only for it to be "nerfed" which actually kept it about as strong as it was? What about adrenaline, a perk which continues to be utterly busted. What about made for this? What about buckle up + for the people, a perk combo that they haven't even acknowledged is a problem. The real kicker here is that with killer I talked about perk combos but with survivors I'm talking about single perks. Killers bring 4 perks into the game and they have to work together well to cover the complete spread of everything you need, whether that's info, slowdown, chase power or regression. Survivors collectively bring 16 perks into the game and they can bring one, maybe two completely busted perks and be fine.
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I think this depends on each person who plays, for example I always thought that in my games the killers have much more advantages than the survivors, they almost always get 4 kills and use very strong builds, but for others I know it may seem like more difficult, the MMr can be one of the causes of the problem, no matter how much he tries to match fair matches, he rarely succeeds
about the killers, if you compare, nowadays it's much easier to start a chase, before the killer needed to find stealth survs, put perks like "ruin" and stand in front of a hooked surv when he captured someone, and then when the surv was saved the killer simply tunneled it
Today, killers have the resources to find and capture faster survs, but they need to do more chases and break more generators to win, in other words, the devs want killers to play more and sit around less, which is a good thing for everyone, The biggest problem with survs is that every time a new killer comes, their objective is always the same, to repair generators, so the only thing that changes is the way the surv is tortured by the killer, the devs even try to create resources for the survs to use against these killers, but the objective ends up being the same, if in the future there were simpler objectives against Nurses and more complex ones against a pig, perhaps it would be more interesting to play survivor
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People who ask why would BHVR nerf survivors if they only cared about money must not have been around when data miners proved that at some point the killer/survivor player ratio was completely out of whack as hardly anyone was playing killer. Add in the pre 6.1 kill rates and something had to be done to keep the game actually alive.
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source?
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Because then there would be no killers left by now.
What does this point to? That BHVR can't cater exclusively to one group, or the game would be left with a lopsided player base, as they need both.
As much as I am a killer main (but I am also a survivor 30-40% of my time), both sides get their buffs and debuffs, ups and downs, and both sides have big camps claiming that "BHVR only caters to the other side, leaving us in the dirt. I demand big nerfs to them NAOW!!11"
That being said, please buff killers, suevivors are so stronk right now ;D
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Yeah I mean, it's not like they added 10 seconds to every gen, sped up pallet break times, sped up attack cooldowns, buffed the crap out killer slowdowns and left them busted for 7 months, nerfed BNPs, nerfed instaheals, nerfed medkits, nerfed CoH, etc. They really only care about survivors. You're right.
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Those weren't player experience changes. Those were survivor nerfs designed to move the kill rate. And that's the issue. Survivors get player experience buffs, and killers just get kill rate adjustments.
The worst part is BHVR talks about kill rate adjustments as if it's their special gift to killers, when it's literally a mandatory thing they need to do.
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I wish BHVR added soon the Finisher Mori system. It would be a nice to end matches quickly.
Another thing the could add - this FAR MORE controverse - its a 30s basekit Corrupt Intervention. This way, killer could have a better start of match and be less reliant on mobility powers and RNG
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I remember how elated I was and how awesome it felt to get some real, legit, corporeal buffs and gameplay experience changes with 6.1 It felt like magic. It was soon after to be eaten up by gen speed buffs and the meta shift to gen rushing, but for a very short time in history, the killer experience didn't feel like a long slog through the mud.
Now,MFT is dragging it down again, but if they leave us with Ultimate Weapon and Rapid Brutality, I'll manage.
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i would absolutely adore this as an M1 killer main
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Useless opinion of a killer main here, but this is what they buffed and my views on them.
Mostly Quality of Life changes that does give a slight better advantage to survivors.
- The new HUD that shows what survivors are doing give soloq survivors more information than before, so it is a slight buff, but nothing that will affect SFW cause it gives info that they already know.
- The new Anti Camping Mechanic is also kinda a survivor buff, but a killer is borderline throwing if he face camps you to the degree that it triggers the self unhook because by that time, the 3 other survivors should already have 1 or 2 generators done.
- They fixed vaulting animations to make survivors be able to dodge hits more consistently when fast vaulting. I would say this is the most substantial one but it was bugged and had to be fixed. So it was only a matter of time till that was done so I'm not all that bothered.
With these 3 small QOL changes to the survivors back to back, with nothing for killers, I assume one can understand why some people say that survivors are getting constant buffs while killer is getting none.
As for my opinion, while these changes do buff survivors, it is not really anything that directly makes it horrible to play killer. It just improves the match quality for the survivors, which is fine.
But to be fair, I would like the same kind of quality of life fixes for the killer, but to be honest, I can't even think of any. ~~Actually, perhaps make it that survivors that T-Bag in front of the exit gate are instantly sacrifice.~~
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They have to at least keep Killers playing.
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- Why does garden of joy window still exist?
- Why hasn't badham been nerfed?
- Why is MFT still not nerfed?
- Why is buckle up + FTP still a thing
- Why are they gutting skull merchant to be completely useless despite the fact that 3gen is beatable, and they could have simply fixed it by taking the "while working a gen drones don't affect you" part and just made that as part of the currently live kit?
- Why did they nerf alien tail attack even though alien is objectively weaker than blight and nurse and neither of them have been touched?
- Why do they STILL not have something in place to deal with the fact that SWF using discord get literally, and i mean literally i counted, 90+ perks for free, and many other things that aren't perks?
- Why are tournaments such a joke that only 2 killers are viable in them?
- Why are tournament such a joke that the only way they become playable is by:
- Creating some kind of "point system" that isn't about escapes vs kills so that killers stand a chance
- Hindering survivors in some way by preventing them from bringing duplicate perks or items, or locking down addons to a certain level?
- Why is it this community for some reason thinks that this is the only multiplayer game in existence where you can't balance around the top level
- Why is it that the game, despite being in its "most balanced state ever" is still extremely survivor sided at the top level
- Why is it that the devs continue to ignore killers like trapper because "won't someone think of the new players"
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Man, I dont answer to over 10 strawmans just for you not accepting my answer. But nice try.
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"equal attention patch" lmao
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i like where the game balance is now except a few issues that buffing killers wouldn't solve, namely mft, ftp+buckle up combo and majority of maps. basekit shadowborn is coming soon too, better late than never.
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They'll let the game get to pre 6.1 where survivor queue times took forever, because no one wanted to play killer and then give killers some very minor adjustments as they continue to give survivor more tools.
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This was something I was wary of back when 6.1.0 was announced. While there have been some detours and bumps along the way, it does feel like the game is steering back to this direction.
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Hopefully that is a joke. Survivors have been nerfed since forever and still getting nerfed.
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Feels like 95% of the complaints are 'why don't killers get any QoL!?' and the remaining 5% mention an FoV slider.
You can't just cry about deserving something every tire the devs plug another blatant hole in survivor gameplay without bringing at least some suggestions for what it is you'd like to see.
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Hook state indicator per Survivor, bonus points if the UI tells me which Survivors I need to hook for hook token perks like NWO and Pain Resonance.
Allowing aura color customization for Gens and Survivors.
Mini directionable bubble for the closest hook so that Killers don’t spend time walking around carrying a survivor before realizing there was a hook behind them all along.
Different button for activating perks or powers like Coup and Myers Tier 3
Allowing for chase music volume to be adjustable.
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THANK YOU!
Folks so caught up in 'us vs. them' this is the first I've seen of most of these suggestions.
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The same reason why 0(!)/1 hook Mori's, 5omega blink nurse, instasaw billy, machine gun builds, burger king Myers, og wraith/spirit, forever Freddy/legion, old ruin, etc aren't a thing anymore.
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I am confused because your post is sort of split.
When are killer's getting something sweet?
What exactly are you talking about? Technically killer's get something sweet every patch... an entire killer. Survivors really only usually get a skin and 3 perks.. maybe 6 if the devs are spicy but the killer's get a whole new killer to play around with. The last major thing you could say that killer's got was Xenomorph. Most killer's are very strong and the majority could use a small nerf addon wise, but other then that sit in a good 50-60% kill rate. This is not prefect but is a good indication of something close to balance.
But then you also go on about FOV and that is a good question? But considering how long it took for the devs to introduce a colour blind option, will likely be a while.
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From my understanding they and others with similar threads mean something sweet as in not balance but QoL related.
Like FoV slider, individual hook counter or base kit early gen slowdown.
In response to base kit BT, new HUD, basekit antifacecamp and so on.
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The last general killer buff was 6.1.0 so I expect the next general killer buff to be roughly around patch 12.1. something.
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So the FOV slider is a more serous issue because certain FOV can affect people's motion, and is something that should be addressed but again took how many years for colour blind feature, so.. sit back because it might be awhile.
I don't know why killer's would need induvial hook counters. It doesn't really offer much of a benefit and even it does, you can just keep track. It's a good way of separating experienced players form the inexperienced.
Basekit early gen slowdown is bad. Killer's are in a good spot, they don't need anything to strengthen them. I support the idea of an optional second objective for survivors. This may help slow down matches by rewarding survivors for not focusing on gens completely. Things like glyphs ect.
basekit bt and the anti camp were less quality of life improvements and more gameplay changes made to discourage certain strategies. I can't blame the killer base for this honestly the devs have flip flopped hard on their stance. First it was ok, then it was bad, then it was ok again. They have now decided it is not ok and are now trying to end this strategy. It's different then simple quality of life when actual gameplay is being affected.
As for the HUD.. I mean do you want a new killer Hud? I think the current killer Hud is perfect and personally prefer the old survivor Hud. The new Hud was an attempt to try to create more of a balance between swf and solo q.
Which is again why this post confuses me, killers got an entire new killer roughly a month ago and is also a good one.
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Not sure I’m allowed to share it due to how the data was found but you can google “DBD Player Populations And Network Traffic Are Worse Than We Thought” and see one article in particular that covered the issue around the time.
This was a few months prior to 6.1 (when BHVR formally addressed kill rates being lower than they liked) and matchmaking incentives were also revealed to be on the horizon. So yes, people weren’t playing killer because it was stressful and it sucked.
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Exactly. Because both sides receive Nerfs and Buffs and people who focus only on one side getting Buffs or Nerfs are simply ignoring a lot of stuff.
I just think that it is a bad take to think that Survivors never get Nerfs, since they got a lot of Nerfs over time. And so did Killers. And both sides got buffs as well.
But saying that Survivors are kept strong so that more people spend money and Killers are drawn to the game via licenses and BHVR does not care about Killer players who play a long time is just made-up nonsense.
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