Can yall buff ruin back to 200%?
It can keep the "disappears when someone dies" thing if you want. But 100% is just too little for it being a hex.
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I'd go as far as revert half of all meta perk nerfs done in 6.1.0. They already did it with Pop (and buffed it on top of that with 25->30), so just bring back the healthy perks to be usable again.
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If anything the base regression speed should be slightly increased (emphasis on "slightly" - we don't need another 3 gen meta) which would indirectly make Ruin better.
I don't think it should go all the way back to 200% though. 200% Ruin I think was previously ok given the state the game was in before Ruin got nerfed (where several other perks were also much stronger and gens were faster to complete), but I think it would be a little too much now, even for a hex.
(Though sidenote - pls buff the lower tiers of Ruin so it's 90/95/100% instead of 50/75/100%, there's literally zero point in the lower tiers right now)
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I mean pop isn't better, it's current not total regression. Most changes in 6.1.0. were fine, ruin was done a bit dirty though.
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I said revert half the nerfs. Pop was nerfed on percentage 25->20 and category total->current. Then it was buffed on the percentage 20->30. So half the nerf was reverted, and buffed on top of the revert for that part. Maybe I was unclear.
Ruin was double nerfed: Death and Percent. (I'd delete Percent's nerf)
DS was double nerfed: Endgame and Stun Duration. (I'd delete Duration's nerf)
Iron Will was double nerfed: Exhaustion and Percent. (I'd delete Percent's nerf)
Self-Care was double nerfed: Efficiency and Percent. (I'd bump Percent back up to 45%, so altruism is still better)
Thana was hard deleted (in 6.1.2/6.1.3): Percent tanked unless all 4 are injured. The old 1 was essentially now the current 3.
Each of these should have half of the nerfs reverted, or in Thana's case hard reverted to the pre-6.1.0 version, maybe even 4.5% per Surv instead of 5%, so that the 80s 5% would be roughly equal slowdown to 90s 4.5%.
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Do we really want a ruin-pentimento meta that's the question ? Even at 200% i'm not a fan it's still countered by holding m1 on gen or breaking totem, I can run reliable perks like corrupt-deadlock-pain res
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Why not have a ruin pentimento meta? I personally miss seeing hex perks myself
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Ruin + pentimento is no that good, as soon as ruin goes down, pentimento goes up and the survivors KNOW where that totem is because they cleansed it and all get the notification for it. Penti is really only good with plaything because you can use it to stall so much.
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Ruin percent nerf is fine to revert
DS duration is fine to revert
IW nerf is actually perfectly fine as is, 100% was broken in more ways than one and the exhaustion fits it into the mft, resilience, dh, windows, ect.. build. 75% is also way better than 95% of people make it out to be.
Self care idc tbh
Thana really wasn't 6.1.0, the devs buffed it to be hard meta without realizing the consequences then hard nerfed it to only work with the killers that synergize with it most. I agree it should go back to what it was before 6.1.0.
The biggest reason the changes were fine is that change is good in live service games. Bhvr updates dbd at the pace of a snail compared to any other game. I was so bored of playing the game in the couple months leading up to 6.1.0. I was going to implode. Survivors where all the same and played the same. I didn't play survivor until after 6.1.0 very much but I am sure survivors were over playing against ruin/undying/pain res every game.
I could go grab the link to a comment I made about this if you wanted me to but OW is a prime example of what happens to a game with a 3 week patch cycle that transitions to a 1.5 month patch cycle. League is so large because of it's two patch cycle(roughly 85% of the time though out a year) even if changes are bad which some are it keeps the game ever changing.
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I still disagree that change for the sake of it is good, especially when we have to break things that didn't need fixing. I would agree change for the sake of it would be good if they buffed the bottom 90% of trash perks that some are downright unusable, but they didn't take that path sadly. Don't get me wrong, the CA change for DS was probably one of the better base mechanic changes (even if I think self-healing should only count on completion), but they didn't have to butcher everything in their path for 1 good change.
As far as patch frequency, I think they might be too small of a company to burn money on console patches all willy nilly. But I would like more minor perk changes in these updates like 7.3.0. I even jokingly, but also completely seriously, suggested similar 4->5 buffs to mirror the Furtive/Background buffs, by including Fire Up and Counterforce to that list. I just wanted something, anything, more than 2 minor perks getting touched. Now to be fair, I personally really like the Furtive change, but I just wanted more perks tweaked in general.
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It would be nice if they did the 6.1.0 type of patches more often
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Yeah, Ruin does feel rather underwhelming for a Hex at the moment.
However, I think putting it back to 200% without any other changes would be a bit much. The pressure Ruin would generate from a Hook was absolutely insane and would lead to "gens before friends" play out of necessity.
If it were to go back to 200%, it should temporarily deactivate when a Survivor is hooked, and block the totem for the duration of the deactivation. This would keep it a very potent perk for gaining pressure when the Killer needs it, but wouldn't make having to save a Survivor delete half of your generator progress.
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I think Ruin is fine. Time to move on and let it stay in its niche form.
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before they nerfed ruin, i used to run undying+ruin+devour hope+hex pentimento. that was really strong build for slowdown at one point. you get consistent -30% repair bonus or 200% passive regression. I think after playing COB/OC/Eruption, I don't really see over-time regressions effects showing up any time soon.
I'd probably use hex:ruin if hex:ruin worked like hex:plaything where every time you hook a survivor, 1 totem is spawned in the map. as long as 1 totem remains standing, all generators on the map regress for 100%. that would make hex:ruin really strong while being healthy non-tunnel incentive. you could run jolt+pain res+hex:ruin+hex:pentimento and gain a lot of gen delay.
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No thanks. Keep free, passive regression as far away from the meta as possible.
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30% of current is never going to be better than 25% of total unless the gen is at like 90% complete.
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It wasn't free, you have to force survivors off gens to get use out of it. It is actually more skillful than pain res or pop ever was.
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30% of current with 90s gens vs 25% of max with 80s gens has a much smaller breakpoint. The 25% max 80s does a flat 20s of gen progress. Reverse engineering the math puts 30% current tied at 20s at 66.66 gen seconds, and when the 4th piston is active at 67.5s, that basically means it is always better than before when the 4th piston is active.
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Walking up to a gen is more skillful than downing and hooking people?
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I will only comment on the snails pace part, but yeah, that's a big problem. Survivors meta basically was unchanged for years and even now things only change one baby step at a time.
I don't know why BHVR is so afraid to step up the pace and do something like LOL. Just take the 5 most played perks on both sides and nerf them numerical, buff the 5 least played options in a similar way and exempt the buffed/debuffed perks from the next round. Do this every 2 weeks, rinse, repeat and have he meta moving!
This wouldn't be a perfect system, but at least peeps would try our he recently buffed perks, while putting others on the back-burner for a while, and things can always be tweaked.
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It encouraged you to pressure multiple survivors instead of hard tunneling people. Yeah.
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Making balance decisions based solely on pick rate is bad, they should do it based on win rate, but first they need to not make the win condition stupid like it is now.
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You can do it already but without ruin, replace it with any hex perks it works fine depending on the map
I do full hex builds like undying-devour hope-plaything-pentimento it's viable, even better with passive slowdowns on sadako/pinhead, hex blood favor on pig or hex lullaby on doctor/freddy, risky builds but when it works it's gg
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keyword there, plaything.
Pentimento is not good unless you are running plaything because all you have to do is pay attention to where the bubbles are, and you can immediately know where to go to cleanse it. And it's only good with plaything because you are going to get a lot more wasted time out of it.
Additionally, the original complaint of ruin + undying + pentimento.
Yeah ok, so you cleanse 4 totems (2 of which you will know the exact location of). Then the killer has 1 perk left. So what exactly is the problem there?
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I meant like I personally miss seeing hex perks as survivor….can’t remember the last time I had soul guard proc due to a hex totem….except that one time an artist main had pentimento and noticed my soul guard charm and straight up drops the survivors she was carrying after downing me just to ensure I don’t escape 😭
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It rewarded the killer for leaving hooks and chasing different survivors.
It was healthy for the game.
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Exactly, i think ruin + undying was the healthiest this game has ever been in terms of "Fun gameplay" it required the killer to actively not camp and tunnel in order to get value out of it, and encouraged pressuring multiple survivors.
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and soul guard’s second effect….value right there ehehehe
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Just buff it to 150% for now, see if it's okay.
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yeah when it was 200% it did promote healthier game play it can be pretty much ignored now it takes 5:57 for a 99 gen to regress to 0 with current ruin.
i think hex perks have fallen quite a lot over the years often they get cleansed very early into the game
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