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Am I going crazy or does Xenomorph feel way worse to play?

Kingjaffad
Kingjaffad Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 62

Xeno started off feeling great (And no, I don't mean because of the bugged cooldown), but then one Xeno got patched using the tail felt very...floaty? There was an awkward delay between missing and the tail actually hitting the environment so the missing cooldown felt WAY too punishing. And for the entire buildup to the midchapter it was just...stuck like that (Thanks, fixed update schedule). There was a bit of hope in the PTB, alot of people tried Xeno and said it felt better.

So I'd been anticipating the midchapter purely because I'd FINALLY be able to enjoy Xeno again, I load up a match and I find that the tail somehow feels even WORSE. Not for the same reasons, mind you. It's really difficult to describe it feels like it's harder to actually aim the tail, It definitely doesn't have the issue where the hit/miss isn't registering as fast, you're just flatout not hitting as much. I could be wrong though, but it definitely feels worse.

I've asked a few people and they seem to feel like it's off aswell, what do you folk think?

Comments

  • Coffeecrashing
    Coffeecrashing Member Posts: 5,672

    Survivors are just dodging left or right when they hear the tail's audio attack warning (or when they see the visual tail warning), and Xeno is forbidden from adjusting the attack to follow the survivor.

    Nemesis being able to adjust the whip by strafing left/right is far more useful than Xeno being able to adjust the tail up/down.

  • Devil_hit11
    Devil_hit11 Member Posts: 9,513
    edited October 2023

    xeno is suppose to be able to strafe right & left and up to down. if it does not work that way then it is still bugged. I agree turret drawback is terrible but killer have to play against that silly mechanic.

    -edit; I played a game of xeno. I was able to strafe hits. xeno feel really good to play. I am happy they the bug. now I can enjoy playing some Xeno.

    Post edited by Devil_hit11 on
  • scrunkly
    scrunkly Member Posts: 90

    for whatever reason, using directional keys to strafe with the tail attack doesnt work like it did before this patch. i actually had an easier time strafing when the tail was bugged, ironically. can still move the camera to adjust the attack mid launch, but the tail definitely isnt back to what it was on release. im also having difficulty consistently hitting over things now as well. its a shame this killer hasnt been in a non bugged state since its release, because id really like to enjoy xeno without adjusting to three different versions of its attack power.

  • Coffeecrashing
    Coffeecrashing Member Posts: 5,672

    There's something about Xeno's attack that just makes it very unreliable...

    1) I'm discovering that Xeno's "tail charge + tail attack are glued together" is actually a really bad thing. The tail charge has a visual and audio warning, and if a survivor has good reaction time, they can dodge really far before the actual attack happens. And the survivor can be so far away that trying to strafe the tail attack doesn't help.

    2) On the other hand, Nemesis having a separate charge animation and attack animation might sound like it should be worse... but even though the charge animation makes it easier for the survivor to start dodging, when Nemesis finally does hit the attack button, it feels like the attack happens so quickly that the survivor can't dodge far away. And if the survivor does end up dodging, they'll still be close enough for Nemesis to strafe the whip to hit the survivor.

    3) Strafing the tail attack appears to work on survivors that aren't moving at all, but it still doesn't seem to be reliable when the survivors are moving. Maybe it's just that the Nemesis whip is a 100% reliable attack, where it's 100% crystal clear when the attack is happening, and when I can strafe... and the tail attack isn't any of those things.

  • NewPlayer100102
    NewPlayer100102 Member Posts: 638

    Its been difficult to test the changes, because the only two options are survivors I can control by asking them to do or not do things, or public matches.

    Controlled matches give a biased experience so it feels just fine under those conditions. It also strips away time pressure.

    But in public, so many matches have a cheater or 4 now, its hard to separate what's intended from what's a manufactured outcome.

    In an actual match all things considered I find no reason to drag the tail, and very little reason to use the tail between tiles. The drag weather over an object or to hit aside a survivor and drag through via strafe just doesn't hit often enough to make it worth the risk of the cool down. Added to that, in the open, its max range is extremely poor, its better to wait the fractions of a second and M1.

    What it does do very well is hit animation locked survivors, survivors that check look the killer at a downed pallet or vault, and denies use of most clean short walled tiles(of which there aren't all that many) either via threat of an accurate tail hit over the object or simply because the survivor passes on the loop and feels forced to push toward a more traditionally strong looping structure.

    It feels broken around window vaults when approached from a non-12 o'clock angle(so anything beyond about 10 degree deflection), these hits always seem to be rejected by the window tile.

    If the tail had its range increased a touch, and it favored a strike on the survivor over object collision, I think it'd be a much improved experience.

    That's just the tail concerns. The tunnels often spawn in messed up places when generator location is considered, it'd improve the mobility aspect of his kit if that was fixed. The tunnels are outright silly on maps with two floors, generator spawn dependent, I often just stop using them, its too slow on those maps. Maybe this could be fixed by letting the player control his orientation on exit of a tunnel, increasing speed in the tunnels or if nothing else increasing killer instinct duration on exit.

    There are still places where you can see a survivor 100% in view and be unable OR be forced to take some wonky angle to hit the survivor. I think this is just the nature of DBD map objects.

    I really like the turrets, they are powerful, they open up a lot of loops that were denied but they require either communication to use OR thoughtful consideration of their location AND the survivors predetermined path to an escape loop. I'm not sure if the time invested in placing them well, is worth it match timing considered from the survivor side(Its very hard to find a Xeno to match against in public games.).

  • Devil_hit11
    Devil_hit11 Member Posts: 9,513
    edited October 2023

    i think i know what your talking about. it is strafing movement speed. let me showcase this using wiki information. When nemesis charges his whip, it takes 0.35 seconds then 0.25 second for whip to explode. after whip explodes, you can move to hit the survivor.

    image.png

    The qurk is that Nemesis can entirely miss the survivor completely with his initial whip but because he moves at 109.94% m/s, he is moving as fast as the survivor. you can slide his hitbox like an over arcing laser attack. After the 0.33 finishes, then he goes cooldown for 28.75% m/s for 2.5 seconds.

    --

    With xeno, tail strike has 0.2 second cast time and your linger effect begins after you miss which lasts for 0.4 seconds but when you miss, your movement speed is NOT 109.94% m/s.

    image.png

    It is instead 1.2 m/s. for reference, 1.2 m/s is 30% movement speed. this means that Xeno is not as good at lingering his attack from left to right because he moves slower. nemesis linger from left to right is like 3x bigger. This means that you need to already close to hitting the survivor as xeno to get the hit. As a result, Xeno has much higher skill-floor compare to nemesis because xeno is less forgiving to play. You cannot miss Xeno's initial attack and correct it after-wards. you can correct it a little bit but not very much. As you may have noticed, the cooldown of xeno is 3 seconds while Nemesis cooldown is 2.5 seconds.

    When xeno has 2.0 m/s, he could do a lot better strafing attacks that were really cool to utilize but survivor said he was too oppressive so he was reverted. Turrets are more annoying as a result as well.

    Maybe it's just that the Nemesis whip is a 100% reliable attack, where it's 100% crystal clear when the attack is happening, and when I can strafe... and the tail attack isn't any of those things.

    your intuition feeling is not wrong. there is a lot more counter-play to xeno. with nemesis, if nemesis is missing attacks out in the open, your playing against very bad nemesis player.