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Something needs to be done about wesker's infection on hooked survivors
It is undeniable how easy prey the survivors becomes after being unhooked and infected if Wesker decides to tunnel.
I just had a match where a teammate got tunneled over and over again and I felt so sorry for him because he was looping the killer very well until the penalty caught him twice and caused his decline.
It's okay for a killer to use his power to tunnel (even if no one likes it) but Wesker can tunnel you passively without using his power. okay he managed to use the power before but after being unhooked he can simply become an m1 killer and he will still be able to catch you faster because of the penalty.
Comments
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Giving Killer Instinct after a survivor cures themselves is a little much, pretty much means you NEED to get healed before using the spray.
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I always thought the infection refresh back to ~50% on hook was a tad too high. I think it should never have been more than 25% upon being hook.
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my theory behind wesker is that dev did not want wesker to be complained about as a killer because his dash power has high potencial to be potent chase power, so they made wesker dash power not that good at loops but gave him a silently oppressive passive. in essence, if wesker want you dead, your going to die. your only real counter to a tunneling wesker is to not get infected.
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I think that 8% debuff should be action speed, not movement speed. Even 15% debuff to force survivors doing spray is still better than movement speed.
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i'd go as far to say it should be like 1%.
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50% is fine.
But it makes zero sense that the infection progresses automatically off hook. It should pause until the survivor performs a conspicuous action.
Without that modification, it won't matter what the off hook infection percentage is, it'll just be a 'tunnel them off hook until they're back to 100' mechanic.
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After survivor unhooked, infection should not progress at all. Maybe until they make any conspicuous action.
Tunnelling is strategy, fine but this does not mean devs should hold Wesker's hand and help him with tunnelling.
Ofcourse i am talking about passive progress, killer player can use his power to progress infection is fine but it should not progress passively if killer never used his power after survivor unhooked.
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{Looks at Pyramid Head, looks at the community, looks back at Pyramid Head and wonders why nobody complains about him}
Seriously, it is kinda funny how many people complain about how "unfair the infection is if Wesker tunnels" but for some reason nobody complains about PH who can do the same as easily.
If you go against Wesker you have all the anti tunnel options you have basekit AND those you bring with you. If PH decides you go to the cage, you get nothing. No BT, no DS/OTR/DH, no Second Wind, no Deli, no We'll make it, nothing.
You just complain about Wesker because he is more popular than PH and therefore the chance of a Wesker who tunnels is higher than having a tunneling PH in that one out of 30 matches you see one.
Also: what do you define as tunneling? Was it reasonable for the killer to tunnel that survivor? How many gens were left? I can't condemn a killer who tunnels when 2 gens are left, but I can understand your frustration if that happened at 5 or 4 gens.
I think that reducing the infection to 1/100 charges after getting hooked is enough. Even with both infection addons you have about 60s until you get slowed down (this includes a M2 hit during endurance), which is the timer for DS, which is an anti tunnel perk. No need to remove it completely or make it stop in chase or what not.
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I think PH should have the stupid animation for two attacks being joined together at the same time removed. You physically have 0.5s to react to it and if you're being hit dead on it's impossible to dodge.
I also don't want to hear the argument for "Oh he's a weak killer" OFCOURSE he ill be weak when no compared to something else but this stupid degen play (because it literally is low quality play) is physically impossible to counter, especially when he walks towards you while forcing you to a wall/pallet loop unless you can fake it and this will only work a limited amount of times.
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Wesker and Pyramid Head are interesting when it comes to this topic. Pyramid Head for example can completely ignore anti tunnel mechanics. While Wesker can make those anti tunnel mechanics do nothing. There is actually something to help with these situations. Like making Wesker infection not progress after hook until a conspic action is performed.
And for Pyramid Head I would remove the bubble notif from cage rescues. And have the cage move close to the nearest survivor after a set amount of time. I would also prevent Pyramid Head from seeing caged persons aura so they don't have info to tunnel with.
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nobody complains about PH because you can hold-w and post-pone his trails by avoiding them. With wesker, his attack is harder to avoid especially point-blank. He also counters hold-w strategies if he uses the bounds at correct places where there is no obstacle to run around.
When your fully infected, He renders all anti-tunnel effects as useless. Like what your going to do? DS Wesker only to get downed 5 second later from hindered? OTR does not work and only makes it easier to go fully infected. that tunnel-off hook is what makes wesker such a potent killer. He is best tunneler in the game.
The only perk that counters his tunneling mechanic is Made for This. It grants you 3% haste. So instead of having -8% hindered, you get -5% hindered. Sure this is still speed differential but it is not as bad as -8%. MFT right now is good in every situation but with deep wound effect, it will be much more situational perk so if you run MFT, it is only for this exact type of wesker-type tunneling gameplay.
removing notification bubbles does nothing because cage always spawns directly on other side of the map. for reference, when PH first came out, you could see hook aura's of people in cages. When i am caging PH, I am directly going to the other side of the map to proxy camp the cage. Those cages are direct setup to tunnel-off hook. it is their main purpose and PH entire gameplay strength. It is similar for wesker, except wesker also has secondary tunnel mechanic where you can use killer instinct as info tool to tunnel when people use sprays. This ensures that you always chase the people with hook-states and ignore people that have 0 hook-states.
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Pyramid Head just had a buff get blocked and reversed because the community complained about him being too good at camping/tunneling. Claiming that the community does not complain about Pyramid Head camping/tunneling is completely disingenuous and an attempt to divert from the discussion that is being had here. It's just a kind of blatant whataboutism.
Yes, Pyramid Head also has a camping/tunneling problem that should be resolved, but he also doesn't have a mobility power, 8% slowdown on infection, an instadown tied to infection, and a bright red heartbeat notification telling him exactly where you are when you cure yourself - he has to keep track of HUD elements to determine which survivor performed the unhook and if it is a survivor he would like to tunnel.
Yes, Wesker gets complained about more because he's more popular. This is because people encounter the problem more regularly. People are going to complain more about things they experience more frequently. This is how complaints work. It does not dismiss the complaint or cast it as lesser in comparison to Pyramid Head just because there is a frequency issue - I would argue that the severity of the experience kind of matters less than the frequency of the experience in terms of player feedback. Yes, someone isn't going to care as much about something they experience 1-in-60 games as something they experience 1-in-15. The thing happening every 15 games is ruining their general play experience more.
Wesker is strong enough that you could remove the slowdown entirely and he'd still be one of the strongest characters in the game. It's not unreasonable to ask for infection to be reduced even more after hook, or for infection development to pause/significantly slow down while you're being chased, even if only after hook. I might be extremist, but I even think curing entirely after hook wouldn't be unfair given how good he already is at proxy camping/tunneling.
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Good idea. Then we could also try again what the Devs tested a while back: inflicting Torment via range attack. The problem now is, that PH can tunnel so easily if the player knows how. I tried it for a while and it felt disgusting, because it's so easy.
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Yeah it's funny cause the two other peops that mentioned me ignored the moving cage part.
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Why do all people say that Wesker is the best tunneler? He is not. Other high tier Killers can do this a lot better like Nurse or Blight (especially with alc ring or adre vial).
Instead of nerfing a single killer we should come up with ideas how we can make tunneling less attractive in general.
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Blight and Nurse are better at chasing then base-kit Wesker. Wesker only better at chasing survivors when they're fully infected. -8% hindered is very significant debuff. Unless you deplete all 12 sprays, your never going to chase anyone that is fully infected. the only way you can chase fully infected people is if you tunnel off-hook so they cannot use the spray. He is better at tunneling off-hook then both of them. your more certain to get the down.
If your going for random chases and hooking people, Blight and Nurse are much easier to stealth from when your on death hook. Wesker's infection forces people to use sprays so your guaranteed to see killer instinct to chase people on death hook.
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