Current Killer meta is unbearable for soloQ
Every. single. game.
-25% Gen, Killer goes to gen ASAP, -30% kick, repeat.
You spawn, you hear Huntress hatched ready sound or even much better, Nurse noise coming to you like a truck.
Someone gets downed neaer you, -8% Gen, -25% Resonance and God forbidd if you had two gens with solid progress someonewhere or someone touched the regressed gen, BUM -30%.
How fun is doing gen of a size with 155%?!!! One unique hook eats 55% of a Gen... what the hell...
Maybe its not crazy on weaker killers, but on anyone in A tier and above its super oppresive.
If you teammates can't last long or someone gets downed at trades, you might as well never touched a gen in the last 100 seconds.
Comments
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There’s not much you can do in soloQ; just do what you can and move on to the next game. It’s frustrating you? Play killer or a different game to chill a bit.
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Pain res works only 4 times per match, and sometimes you just can't reach a scourge hook.
Surge works only for M1 attacks. Most of the time useless on Nurse or Blight, or any other high tier killer, they mostly downs survivors with power. Besides the times, when you keep downing survivors in a completely dead zone.
For pop you have to down and hook a survivor. It also ONLY strong, when you kicking at least 80-90% of the gen progress. I actually thing that Pop is one of the most fair and healthy perks for the game, considering how fast survivors can do gens.
The only thing that MAYBE problematic, is when killer making a combo of these perks.
But hey, survivors also has some strong combos.
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Survs have to complete 7/8 gens every game, PR+POP+JOLT is way too strong. This meta needs to be shaken up.
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Honestly, Pain Res and Pop should not stack. It’s really annoying when you know the Killer has it and when the game is already looking like a GG..
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It's not on picture but Deadlock is also here. And Ultimate Weapon too since you can use it any time, it did not limited with only one time use like Lethal.
I wish they find a way to make it imposible to stack gen perks on strong killers. Blight seriously need to use 3 gen perks? Or Nurse, Spirit, Wesker etc
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You just told this person to play Killer to chill😶
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Yes, but do you realise just by equipicking this perk on any good Killer makes 5 gens ---> 6 gens by default every game and then you are on mercy that the Killer didn't bring any other of the strong regress perks and you also hope your teammates can last in chase longer than 30 seconds.
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what killer meta wasn't miserable for solo q?
or, let me put it better, when solo q was not miserable when you were trying to win?
im sorry, but this isn't killer meta or killer issue. this is solo q issue that cannot really be aided.
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If I'm not mistaken, I think you do understand which side is the power role in this game.
Besides that killer must work hard to achieve value from these perks, they are still doing so little, against a really good stack of survivors.
They are strong only on Nurse and Blight? So should we nerf perks, or these killers?
But they need to be very careful nerfing these 2 killers specifically. It will end up in a very ugly scenario.
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I think if they create a archetype for all regresion/slowdown perks that are focused on gens and just limit the number of them you can equip in your build (lets say max. 2), you could still keep their power level even on strong killers and you could buff the weaker ones to add more build variation.
And for that Pain Ress, of course it doesn't spawn a 6th gen on the map, but the max value (which isn't hard to get on good killers) is a entire regress of a gen which is very big deal just for doing your job passively.
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In theory the current gen regression perks are in a really good spot; they have either decent conditions (PrainRes, Pop), decent limitations (Surge(/Jolt), Eruption) or while being useful without the killer doing much, aren't overly oppressive (Deadlock, DMS, Ruin).
As usual, things become complicated and problematic once you stack two or more of these perks and add certain killer powers and/or add-ons on top.
The sheer amount of times a gen was 80% or 90% and got completely deleted between survs having chase and unhooking as a higher priority is striking. - And I say that both from a surv perspective and a killer perspective; as surv doing essentially 7+ gens per match is extremely frustrating --- and as killer I sometimes come by a gen, that I know was nearly completed, just to see it's back at zero; and that's with one regression perk and keeping in mind that that gen was decently progressed so if I don't currently have a surv to chase I'll probably find one there.
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"If you teammates can't last long or someone gets downed at trades"
there's your problem right there.
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Agree.
They could also make similar (but I think more complex) archetype for example: "Pain res exactly on Nurse or Blight, regress only 10-15% instead of 25%". And for killers like Trapper, Freddy or Myers it's 30-35%.
But it's kinda stupid at the same time, because with these "changes" they will basically admit that their game has a really strong balance issues. It will be one of the reason to scare off new players for sure.
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So you mean killers overall are to powerful in chases? I am confused, please explain.
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You wanna win with a bad, not well coordinated team, huh?
You remember old POP, Pain Res and Surge before it got nerfed?
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While Pop and Pain res got "nerfed". Surge got only buff.
In short: Surge were having a pretty long cooldown before. Now it have no cooldown.
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Slowdown for hooks is the best meta ever was and ever will be. It rewards killers for playing good and it barely do anything if survivors win a lot of time in a chase.
So your title should sound like "Current killer meta is unbearable for bad players", and it's good. Unless you are expecting to win matches with bad teammates.
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Surge and Lethal aren't much of a problem.
It's just Pop and Pain Res. Individually they are fine (albeit boring). But when stacked together they are absurdly strong and that combination needs to go.
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Well when matchmaking actually works and gives me good solo teammates, that if not coordinated, at least have some game sense, killers complain that it's unfair. Soooo what are we to do?
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The strongest killers in the game are super oppressive with the best perks in the game? Is that really such a surprise?
Also, you have conveniently let out, that Pain Res only works on unique hooks and is a Scourge Hook perk on top of it and your example of Nuse and Huntress isn't the best for what you tried to express. At least pick killers that actually use all of these perks. Surge doesn't do anything on Nurse and very little on Huntress.
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Matchmaking problem when you talk about your team mates being complete potatoes.
Also,maybe the killer just like to win,thats why he put that build to begin with. Thtas why people play with meta,they want to win. Dont see any problem with that.
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"One potato teammate that completely throws the game" matchmaking is still happening a bit too often, but it's a bit better since they raised the soft cap. My solo experience has been so much more positive since that change. Teammate quality skyrocketed overall.
Possibly weird take: I think many of these gen regressions would be a lot more bearable if the value was the same but the gen didn't explode and cause a scream. It's really freaking annoying. I would be so much more ok with Surge if it just fizzled for the same 8% instead of the whole explosion+scream combo every time it proc'd.
I will agree that sitting on a gen through multiple Pain Res procs is not engaging to say the least, but chases have to last longer if more than 2 Pain Res's are happening on the same gen. Not so much a Pain Res+PGTW problem at that point.
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Your numerical arguments are wrong, POP works on 30% of the current progress and not the total.
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Well, the two actually don't stack. Pain Res explodes the most progressed gen by a fixed 25% and then starts gen regression. A regression gen can't be kicked by Pop, unless a survivor jumps right back on that gen, and thats on them, if the killer is near. Jumping back on a regressing gen isn't always the best thing to do, just like hooking a downed survivor isn't always the best way of action, like for example when you know that meanwhile two survivors sit on a 90%+ gen nearby. You need to develop a certain game sense to identify this situations, but its not like soloQ players are helpless to the currents of such an event, its just a bit harder to learn how to swim.
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Pain Res + Pop is crazy together but I ain't gonna say nothing cuz I know forum killers are going to choke me...
I can't tell you how many times you have to re-do a single gen... 1 hook and we're almost back to %0 again... Ok.
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“hold your interact button and believe!”
“There’s not much you can do in soloQ… frustrating you? Play killer”
Just 2 of the most amusing comments I’ve read today on the official DBD forums😄
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Pain res and pop both require the killer to get downs to work and one can only work 4 times per match and pop can only work 12 twelve times per match just saying. What would you propose for a viable nerf or rework to both so that they remain healthy gen regess perks.
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I just wanted to agree that 2 combined together can be very strong. Pain res. can erase 1 gen worth of progress remotely and you can use Pop 12~ times. I don't know why you said "only" considering that's a big number in a game like DBD where matches and chases don't last that long. Unfortunately, I don't have any "nerf" suggestions since I'm not a fan of how BHVR handles nerfs.
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i cant disagree with you, this is all true. i am a solo q only player and let me tell you..... this meta is oppressive as hell.
i wish they would completely rework Pain res again but literally REWORK it completely to make it have a different effect.
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MFT rewarded good players for being skilled in chase. Did nothing for bad players. And only stomped bad killers. Yet it was trashed.
Why is BHVR okay with catering to bad killer players, but bad survivors are always told to get good?
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You can't use pop and pain res together unless someone taps the gen and that's still not using them together meaning you can't proc pain and pop the same gen. Kind of like how you can't pop a gen that was just hit with surge. The problem with these perks arent what they do but the lack of game sense the survivors have. If you as a survivor tap a gen that was just hit with pain res and allow the killer to pop that gen then it's a survivor problem not a perk or killer problem. The last thing you want to do is take away a perk that encourages different hooks and chases.
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I understand sunk cost fallacy when it comes to gens. Once you've had a gen at 90% PR'd down to 40%, you still want to finish the gen. The better option in many cases is to stop regression after the PR and find a better gen. I have killed so many Survivors and had so many soloq teammates die when the Survivor tries to finish a regressed gen when they still have at least 2 other gens, and 1 of them is often a safe one to work on.
This is part of the reason I consider the current version of Pop (30% current) stronger than old (25% max), as people are more likely to throw when you get them in a regression loop with new Pop when the gen is more than 50% completed. A 90% gen gets bumped down to ~60% (from the 30% + the basekit 2.5%), and they attempt to finish the gen instead of healing. That causes a down for another pop for another throw of not healing.
There are two main ways that I can think of 'fixing' this. (1) Make it easier to find another gen after yours has been regressed. (2) Set a max regression per gen of 100%, so that way you never have to do a singular gen more than 'twice'. With a regression limit, you could pop each gen 3 times and never worry about hitting this cap, it is only meant to stop excessive regression on a lone gen. There are some issues that can crop up with both (sending a Survivor to a death hook Surv's gen, or unintentional 3 gen by Killer getting punished, or Survivors failing skillchecks probably shouldn't count towards this limit outside of maybe Overcharge's bonus amount [so the gen regresses 14% but it only counts 4% towards the limit]. heck, regression could even be limited by the 100% per Survivor's progress so that a duo'd gen's max is 200%, and quad gen's max is 400%, but that would require tracking of who progressed the gen by how much.), but it mostly would probably be for the better.
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You can definitely use them together, very effectively too. There's a reason they're the Top most picked perks and most Killers use them together. Just because they don't have the perfect synergy doesn't mean they aren't strong together.
I don't have the will to explain further since I don't feel too strongly about this discussion though but I respect your opinion.👍️
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Hey you know what perk made killer unbearable unless you were playing blight or nurse? You got to see it oh I don't know, ever game in a row? Also apparently your getting lucky killers because pain res spawns are the worst thing in existence. Pop is a pretty fair perk, because in this time and age a gen will pop while your in chase. At least one. Jolt is fine as it's an only M1 thing. Lethal yet again is also fine.
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-> Did nothing for a bad players
Yeah, of course reaching pallet/window for free when you shouldn't is nothing, sure
-> And only stomped bad killers
KEKW. How to say you understand nothing about looping in this game without saying it
-> Why is BHVR okay with catering to bad killer players, but bad survivors are always told to get good?
Bad killer never will have his Pain Res or Pop value, but bad survivor always had his MFT value literally for playing badly, if we're talking about your comparison.
Any other mental gymnastics?
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Imagine kicking a gen.
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This is probably the weakest gen regression meta we ever had. Even the old POP had more impact than all these perks combined.
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catering to bad killer players = not nerfing perks that reward getting downs. make it make sense.
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I think you should be grateful for the state that gen regression perks are atm or did you prefer to have 12 hits of pain res instead of 4 or pop taking away 20% out of gens entire progression bar instead of 20% of it's current progression or corrupt staying up even after first down happened or the 200% regression that old ruin had and S and A tier killers get little to no benefit from Surge. This is the weakest gen regression meta that dbd has ever had and ppl still complain about it amazing.
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Pop is back in the meta?
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Maybe instead of focusing on the symptoms you should take a look at the cause. Just saying.
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Its almost like the current killer meta perks reward skill will regression. Perhaps, maybe, possibly, they get value because you're getting outplayed. This is the best, healthiest meta in a long time. At least now regression needs to be earned.
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MFT crutch spotted.
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I think the issue lies in the fact killers are required to run gen regression at all to have an even foothold on the weaker killers, and make even more of an impact on stronger ones.
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They need to just limit how many slowdown/regression perks you can bring. Maybe two max. At least on higher tier killers. The devs have to know that all killers aren't created equal. If they aren't going to nerf nurse and blight significantly then at least make it so they can't stack four slowdown perks. It's basically a guaranteed loss unless the killer is exceptionally bad. They have to know that S tier killers running four slowdowns isn't fair. I don't think the issue is the perks as much as it is certain killers that Behavior is still stubbornly refusing to nerf. It's the same reason ultimate weapon is a big issue. At some point the devs have to acknowledge what the real problem is and make an actual effort to fix it.
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The problem with limiting perk types opens the door to so many unjustified perk limitations.
Who is to say this would be limited to just gen regression for 'the sake of consistancy'? What if they limit gen progression for survivors? Chase perks? Information on both sides? Would items and addons be effected? Restrictions on perks an entire team of survivors could bring if it meant more than 2 of each type? It would require more balancing BHVR probably doesn't have the time and resources for and create new issues down the line.
A better solution in my opinion is a hard cap on regression/progression %'s for healing and generators entirely. Would have fixed a lot of problems long before a lot of nerfs/buffs as far as I could tell.
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Killers use gen regress perks against gen rushing.
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You've conveniently left out that gens were raised to 90 seconds and toolboxes were nerfed, among other things. The perks themselves might be weaker than they once were on paper, but that doesn't mean they still aren't too strong together today.
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It is hard to balance the triangle if one side cannot be nerfed.
So one side will always have to take the beating to compensate.
In this current iteration, it’s solo queue
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You can put any killer related things in 'current killer meta' in the title.
Even Trapper or Pig. Because solo queue is so garbage.
But I don't think those deserve nerf because of it besides Blight to be honest.
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