Xeno & Turrets
So turrets job is to try to knock off Xeno from his power. Let's face it, unless the Xeno is clueless and don't pay much attention to the game, you will almost never get him out of his power unless two turrets are used in same area. There is also add-on that heavily makes turrets kinda useless and some other add-ons that reduce their power level as well.
The thing is, I don't think Xeno's power atm is that powerfull to require a counterplay to consisently knock him out of power. So as Xeno is atm I think turrets should stay weak.
However if you would want to make them powerfull, you would increase the frustraition for the Killer first of all (since being M1 without power knocked from Survivors is not really fun mind you) but you would have to buff his chase power, like removing almost entirely the cooldown from missing or increasing a range, etc.
So when Survivors complain the turrets are kinda weak, his power isn't at the moment that strong to ask for stronger turrets. His chase power is very similiar to Nemi and he has his power at all times, no cooldowns required (yes he needs to hit you extra but in later stage of the game its usualy quite stronger than Xenos + you break pallets fast).
So either turrest stay weak as is or buff turrets but also buff his chase power. Or maybe rather don't change him at all.
Comments
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Turrets are fine as they are. He does not need big buffs either.
But his tail feels clunky and many times hit is not happening even you hit survivor. Animation is happening but it's not ending with health state.
So fix his bugs.
And his missing cooldown maybe too much. So maybe reduce it a bit as well, between current version and his first week.
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Absolutely agree.
Not sure why Xeno is ragged on as much as it is. Xeno was the killer that actually made me start learning how to actually loop, and start using fakes and baits.
I really enjoy using the turrets, getting crafty about how you place them is a lot of fun.
I realised after a while that placing turrets is kinda the same mindset as playing Trapper. You can place them in standard areas, but you dont get much value feom those traps. What you want is turrets to be hard to spot and more importantly a surprise that forces the killer to take a suboptimal choice to give you the advantage.
- Placing them close to the tunnel/next to you on gen is the basic low value usage. Whichever way the killer approaches from, they will spot you and the turret together and be prepared to break it easily as you run, then stick to you in chase.
- Placing them off the side a little away from you is mid tier. It gives you early warning from that direction to pre run (if you know the killer is coming from that direction), and if the Xeno comes from tunnels you can run to safety in the direction of the turret, knowing certain paths are blocked for the Xeno with it stopping to break, so the Xeno will have to go through the turret of take a longer route.
- The strongest turrets are the ones you place in unexpected locations with a specific idea in mind. If you place it along the path where you intend to run, but especially predict where the killer will approach from and use small trees/bushes/obstacles or place it out of view from a particular direction behind junctions in walls or rocks to obscure it as you run past, you can really make it hard on the killer. Locations where the killer will specifically have to look away from you when the turrets activates forces the killer to either ignore and get brokwn out of power, or to try and turn away from you to to break it. If they try and succeed to break it you'll have made quite a lot more difference... but if they missed the turret, and fail to break it in time, you juat got insane value.
Turrets are good enough for what they need to be, and Xeno is solid as a killer. I'd argue one of the fairest and better balanced killers in the roster.
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Agree, imo, Xenomorph is the perfect killer.
As for the turrets, their job isn't really to take you out of power, they threaten you by being able to pull you out of crawler so you must take care of them. They are sort of placable bodyblocks, the Xenomorph has to hit the turret because if they don't, they are back to bipedal form. If the turrets were stronger, it would make life for the Alien miserable. The only thing that could change imo is the tail strike CD, not speed, CD. 3s with 1.2m/s is the biggest CD of all the ranged killers + the shortest range. It would be nice to have 2.5s ofor the CD instead of 3, like Nemesis.
Like you said, i don't understand the Xeno rage but people post a lot about it, so i guess, it is popular in a sense.
Post edited by Heliosse on4 -
If Xeno has to stop chasing you to hit the turret, and then go after you again, the turret is already doing its job, whether it breaks him out of his power or not.
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Unpopular opinion: turrets are very good, people just don't want to be good with anything in this game. Complaining is easier.
Imagine, half of the year past, almost all people still put them in front of exits. And watch they do nothing like in 1000th time.
Logic about turrets placement should work like: when I will run this loop, killer should leave it to break a turret or just lose his power instead.
Believe me, when you will face good swf which understands this pattern, playing Alien will be nothing but agony.
Onryo was nerfed because of people just refuse to take tapes. Turrets should never be buffed only because most people in this game hate to use their brain.
If Alien will ever receive a buff, I hope they will depart from "power controlled by survivors" logic.
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Nah turrets are ok even if those turrets dont insta remove xenos power,xenos (if well deployed) should go to destroy it, giving survivors time to run.
To me the only thing that would change for xeno are addons, a little hitbox and slowdown on miss a little less (i mean look at billy now and its an instadown).
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Agreed.
Turrets are mostly fine. Maybe survivors could move slightly faster while carrying them (it feels a bit slow for my taste) but it shouldn't be a guarantee that they break him out of his power.
I would like to see the 1.2 seconds cooldown. We never even got to test it because they overcompensated for a bug.
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It's crazy that in the forums I see all these "it's fine as is" players but when I play the game solo que I never get these survivors that can loop for days against Xeno and use turrets effectively because the turret "is fine."
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It is definitely a player issue. Most turrets I see are placed out in the open or next to a generator.
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Smart turret placement will give any Xeno a really hard time. Many Xenos also try to destroy them all the time with it's tail because they might think it's more skillfull and fun. Sadly it's not very efficient as the tail recovery time (both miss and hit) on turrets is a bit longer. Using the tail on survs is different as it works like a lil inbuild StbfL (how many stacks do you think it equals?). Apply that on turrets would be a nice change.
Also it would be interesting to see a good team which totally ignores turrets and put that time in gens.
Overall i miss Xenos release version but i adepted, so... leave it be.
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Been playing Xeno by majority since its release in August (now 50/50 with Billy since my "old main" is back).
For the most part, I feel that the turrets and his overall power is pretty good. Any form of improvements would better come off as adjustments to tail collision and interactions. 2 things that stand out in my experience:
1) Tail collision often prioritizes debris or walls behind the survivor if they are close to them, resulting in hits that seemingly "go through" the survivor's model.
2) M2s destroying turrets seem to count as obstructed hits (correct me if I'm wrong, it feels so).
While the (average?) movement speed for every M2 cooldown is listed as 1.2 m/s over a duration of 3s, I think successful M2s have an acceleration curve that feels better. I think destroying turrets with M2s should behave the same.
Beyond that, turrets do their job well. They not only function as a warning to pre-run from a gen, but also essentially bodyblock a hit for you mid chase with proper placement (towards the tile that you want to run to), wasting time for Xeno and extending the chase.
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The flame turrets are fine as the are. They're meant to delay Xeno not shut em down so hard like EMPs do against the robot killer. They also act as motion sensor to give you an idea where she is and when she pops out of a tunnel. Buffing the turrets further will make them too strong for what they provide.
I'm probably one of the few Xeno players that likes getting burned and knocked out of power. With the 2 add ons cat carrier and Ripley watch auto destroys the turrent and give Xeno undetectable for 30 seconds. 2 things I've also noticed survivors always run around a wall when it happens so you just vanish or left Ave is always bad for them when they don't have sight on a stealthy killer. She also surprisingly quiet when she is undetectable.
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Turrets are pretty much fine. You just need to be creative with them and not mindlessly place them around the middle of an area where its super expected.
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A query I would have... should survivors be consistently able to loop the killer for days?
I would hope that would be something I almost never see because it means either the skill gap of the players is absolutely massive, or the Xeno as a killer is pretty damned weak. 45-60 seconds before going down is pretty good, and I can usually get to that kind of time frame if I've been free to set up my turrets where I actually want them.
SoloQ tends to get smashed by Pinhead, Sadako, Freddy and Pig because players can't be bothered to learn how to engage with their power. Not every killer should be beatable with purely mechanics. Strategy and management of killer slowdown systems is an equally valid skill to test.
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