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Survivors kill themselves on hook to skew data
Played a several Huntress matches and survivors keep throwing on hook to try and skew the data. I have several recorded matches of this. 30 and 40 minute matches where survivors refused to play or do gens and would finally do all the gens and die to the entity. Good thing bhvr knows that they died due to the entity and not to the hook. But I have had real and fun matches too! I enjoy playing with people who actually want to test the changes and see how it works!
Context: This post devolved into Huntress change arguments. I have played against PTB Huntress and she is still loopable as she is 10% slower than survivors. All the people I disagree with have not played the PTB and don’t know how strong she is besides videos which like the Twitter one are skewed, ie shiny pin, starting side by side, the survivor looopong super sloppy and the killer looping tight.
Comments
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It's not to skew the data, they just realized how busted Huntress is and there's no denying it. I would do the exact same because I didn't play the PTB to experience huge buffs to an already balanced killer that came from some random void that no one asked for until now apparently.
Try to justify this video.
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If you're playing the PTB then no, they might just want to play against the new killer and not an old one, even if the old one has had some slight tweaks.
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I'm kinda surprised they didn't nerf the addons to compensate for the basekit buffs. This would actually make Shiney pin MORE effective since it's percentage base.
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I'm equally surprised because I don't think they realize the extent of these changes. To not even nerf add-ons to compensate is kinda crazy.
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They remembered to do that for other Killers, so... no clue how this went unnoticed. If this goes live though,I might start using Shiney pin.
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Yep, i tried this out aswell.
If Huntress goes live like this, i will simply uninstall and never come back to the game. Not because of Huntress, but because of the future perspective of the game.
This huntress change is a testament to how incompetent the ballance team apparently is. It is a shame and an absolute insult to the other workers at BHVR who do a fine job (sound design, graphics ect)
Somebody there must have made the decision that this is fair and ballanced, on one of the best, most played and already most well ballanced killer in the entire game.
Its rediculous.
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People who just choose to die easy without devising a countermeasure or relearning the timing of the loop are going to be cheap on Huntless and have no desire to improve, even if Huntless's buffs are reduced.
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I don't think PTB is useful as statistical data when skill rates don't work in the first place and people are working on testing new elements. We have to separate it from the custom matches as a place to check new elements.
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You watch too much conspiracy movie bro
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I'm sorry but this mentality is the real problem.
Claiming it doesn't skew the data, but doing it anyway to inflate the kill rates even more is exactly what skewing the data is. If Huntress, or any killer, was getting massive amounts of kills then it should be reflected by the pure stats. This is why stats are usually taken with a grain of salt because even 5% could be contributed to things like survivors throwing on hook or killers letting all 4 survivors free.
Players spread this stuff like wildfire because they lose a few matches and don't put in the work to test these things heavily, just demand reverts and changes, nerfs, buffs, etc without letting it have a chance. And to clarify, I do think the Huntress changes are a bit much, but throwing games isn't the way to go. You want BHVR to see accurate stats? Then play the matches to your best ability.
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I'm sorry but what is this supposed to prove, I believe Huntress could of done that in the past as well, your point?
The balance in this game is a huge problem and the fact BHVR relies too much on raw data that's skewed by things like that, and the only way BHVR can get effective data is to play a killer at different ranges of skill from survivors and see how they perform.
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Interesting wording, people said basically the exact same thing about MfT.
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Agreed. Throwing on hook doesn't get that information regardless, however.
BHVR clearly keeps track of the kill rates between MMR, but I'm not sure if they do for each killer. At least, they don't show that. Worst case scenario, they do massive changes to appease the survivors throwing on hook or giving up (like they did with Sadako, said as much on a developer stream) or slightly bad, they ignore the criticisms because mid/high tier survivors aren't struggling and SoloQ low MMR is full of players giving up and dragging their teams down.
Either way, feeding kills to the killer doesn't reflect well on what the killer can do to their personal best against survivors at their personal bests. At the very least, Sadako is in a better spot, but I fear if that trend happens every time a mass amount of survivors throw on hook BHVR will end up nerfing a killer worse than they originally were at.
Then again, Skull Merchant still exists so she's a good argument against my own. Only time will tell.
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It feels kinda unfair for killers to be punished just because survivors are giving up, most of the times too easy and for nothing, just because they're in a bad mood and dont feel like playing because of that, but play the game anyway and make the experience bad for the others.
And if survivors give up and dont wanna play againts a killer, its not always because they're too strong, but because they are unfun to play againts, so its not nerfs that they need, but making their power more fun for survivors to deal with.
Take away from the unfun parts, but compensate on others that are lacking.
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It sounds infinitely more likely that they were quite simply trolling and trying to waste your time but nah, go for the most tinfoil-maxxed take possible I guess.
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"It's fair bro! Just get good and play at comp level efficiency or something" - forum killers probably
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Try to justify the video and then comment about my mentality because that's not the problem here.
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Try to justify the video.
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She could not have followed survivors with her hatchet up that well. That's my point. Lying that it was like that is crazy. What's the point of lying?
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Who cares. It's the PTB and most people understand these changes are bad.
I do enjoy it when people keep spouting the, "It's a Survivor main conspiracy to get these poor abused killer mains experience ruined!!!"
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Yep. It's just an "extra challenge" for survivors because they couldn't deal with their own challenges! 🤪
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Nullifying counterplay to ranged abilities always causes the same problems. I'd rather she were 4.6 than be able to glue herself to survivors to guarantee a hatchet hit at every loop.
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Yeah, I feel that some people really think there is a council of Survivor Mains who decides wich Killrates get boosted now and this council will relay this info to every Survivor Main out there to get it done.
@Topic:
The thing is... Nobody asked for a Huntress-Buff. A Huntress-Buff was not needed AT ALL. Yet, she got a very significant Buff without any Downside, as one of the stronger and very popular Killers in the game.
But, the main reason why people suicide against a Huntress on the PTB is most likely it is not the new Killer. Survivors have instant queues on PTB and no DC-Penalty. They can just go next and queue up again to hopefully play against the new Killer.
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Oh my bad, I didn't really know what you we're reffering to without context, and I agree, I think that change should be reversed, at a loop survivors should be able to have a chance dodging her hatchet but like this I feel like there's pretty much none if she's just as fast as when she's not holding a hatchet.
Post edited by Adaez on1 -
Exactly.
It is questionable if PTB stats are even relevant. Most dont play it serious, they just want to explore the map, see the new killer, play the new killer and thats about it. Generators or serious chasing/killing gets ignored by the majority of games and i hope BHVR knows this. Survivor want to see the mori and thats why they die on purpose often times.
About the Huntress: Hopefully this wont go live (it would end there for me a 100%) and i strongly believe the DEVS are aware of this.
But the problem is why stuff like this even goes on PTB. They must have tested it in advance, right? How can they believe this is good for the game? Or needed on Huntress? 😂
Huntress needs no change at all. No extra movement, no extra Hatchets, no extra nothing.
She is one of the most played killer and the reason she has no super high winrate (while being very powerful) is that the majority of Huntress mains DONT CARE! They want to get great shots and not sweat for the 4K.
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I'm happy this was just a misunderstanding! :)
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It’s still cheating data no matter and you obviously know that. That’s why merchant has a 70% KR. Notice how the person is using shiny pin too. Skewed for sure
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They wouldn’t stay in the game for 45 minutes if that was the case
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Why aren’t wet crying about Trickster eco is 2% faster than her? Nobody cares about him I guess. Also they are using shiny pin. Which needs to be removed.
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And I just realized I botched that comment like crazy 🤣, fixed the spelling errors.
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Trickster takes 8 knives to damage you, huntress takes 1…
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Dear killer mains.
Not everything that happens in DBD is about you.
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sure, players care about the stats that much :)
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They don't pay attention to kill rates on a PTB. Matchmaking is off and people frequently give up. The data would be useless. The PTB is to generate feedback, not statistics.
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Yep, it doesn't bode well.
I have no issuse with weak killers get quality of life improvements but time and time and time again the community ask for things and instead of the devs listening and implementing it with careful consideration they change something totally different that no one had issues with.
For YEARS people have asked for changes to Blight, Nurse and Skull merchant but they somehow buffed Blight?! Haven't changed Nurses issues, kept Skull Merhcant miserable to play against.
Now I know if you want to see more variety of killers weaker killers have to be more viable but jesus the devs just can't sort it without messing up.
Like Hag, in no way is she s tier but she has annoying gameplay with placing traps at hooks, Which means if you go down in basement good luck and if you run to the hook she's there and if you crouch to the hook she'll come back to the hook before you can save safely.
Twins, I hate that Charlotte can stay at the hook and send Victor out to pressure. I wish she was changed so she is fun to play and play against and where chases are rewarded but going by past patches Victor will get speed increase and be a one hit down, it wouldn't surprise me.
I think a lot of survivors are leaving dbd or chosing to only play with a swf and I can't blame them.
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Because it's not about who is the faster killer. It's about how effective being faster is in terms of ability which Trickster struggles with.
^^ That basically explains it lmao.
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I wouldn't doubt in the least that is happening. I saw a ghostface main on tiktok awhile back that specifically said he farms every few matches and will frequently give the last survivor the hatch because he doesn't want the data to make it look like ghostface needs to be nerfed. If there are killers doing things in an effort to intentionally skew the data there is no doubt in my mind there are survivors doing the same thing.
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You gotta have a slight ego problem if you think that your sole performances with a killer that's played by thousands of people worldwide are going to be the reason they get nerfed...
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That video is unbelievable. And we asking why survivors are not wanting to play?
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I thought pretty much the same thing when I was watching this guy, but I wouldn't doubt in the least that there are a lot of both survivors and killers that think they are doing something when they do these things
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Hahaha yeah that I don't doubt, there's most definitely people out there that would try to do that
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I don't think it's to skew data, or because they hate Huntress. Typically when a PTB is released with a new killer, even if it comes with other things... ppl wanna focus on the new killer. This unfortunately means the other stuff doesn't get much testing in the PTB and you'll hear complaints later saying "how did this ever make it to live?"
I remember seeing a vid of a guy trying to test the 3 gen system in the LAST PTB with a 3 gen Hag build. He purposefully 3 genned from the start to test its effectiveness... and ppl DCed or suicided because he wasn't Onryo, Billy, or Blight. The focus was on the killer changes and nothing else. If you wanna test if Nurse functions correctly on a new map (which tends to have lots of nurse problems with maps) ppl will insist you're trying to be sweaty on the PTB.
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To be very clear, PTB data is pretty much a non-factor. PTB data is incredibly unreliable since ranked matchmaking is disabled and everyone is still getting a feel for the changes/new content. We do not use PTB data to make decisions, we prefer to use feedback.
It's also incredibly difficult to pinpoint why someone let themselves die on the PTB. It's equally likely that they just wanted to face the new Killer and wanted to move on to the next match.
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Quoting this to hopefully get more exposure, because this is a great response. I don't understand who is making these decisions or why, but these changes aren't it. I already go against enough obnoxious & annoying huntress players that take it as a personal attack that you dare touch a gen, I don't need more. The only changes she needs is her absolutely horrendous hit boxes fixed, nothing more.
This game is 100% going the wrong way, and quickly. I'm getting sick and tired of loading in to games with more counter play options disappearing everytime.
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Kill rates do not matter much. Even you contradicted yourself by bringing Skull Merchant up. She's not getting any changes despite the 'cheating'.
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Skill expressions are disappearing at a rapid rate and it's a pain to see. Just becoming more low risk whilst the rewards stay the same.
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I'm so happy I stumbled upon it and that it exists. I would never want to face that in my games and it's hard to explain just how crazy the speed is without a video and yet there's people defending it! Truly bizarre.
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They are and it's really unfortunate. I don't know what their endgame is here. With every killer release/buff, trying to run them is becoming increasingly more difficult, via powers or perks, especially with all the exposed & aura reading ones available. It's basically a game of connect the dots via aura-reading with one hit downs more easily accessible to killers than ever before, and it takes little to no skill with quite a few of the rostered killers available to do so.
This is just another example of taking away yet another form of counter-play from one of the stronger/better balanced killers available, and makes the skill ceiling even lower on said killer.
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The problem I see is this will bleed into live post-patch unless BHVR gives off the idea the changes were nerfed/toned down.
I remember post-PTB's of both Skull Merchant and Sadako's 2.0 and current live. Skull Merchant, regardless of how anyone feels about her, still has people giving up on hook and inflating the killrates. We almost all agree on that much. And my experience with Sadako, I still have players give up on hook regardless of how I play. And I am positive it's from mindsets like I pointed out, where a decent margin of players against x killer just give up immediately.
Heck, even if these changes were done without the PTB we'd see this mentality immediately and it spreads pretty quickly.
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Is it some sort of closely guarded arcane secret that people always have and always will DC/hook suicide on the ptb if the new patch includes a new killer and they end up not going against the killer they want to try playing against? Say what you want about that as I personally do find it a bit silly when other killers/content get changes in the same PTB myself. But jumping straight ot the most tinfoil hat tier theory available is also pretty silly.
Post edited by oxygen on0
