The second iteration of 2v8 is now LIVE - find out more information here: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/480-2v8-developer-update

Another cool survivor perk concept released way too weak.....

Phasmamain
Phasmamain Member Posts: 11,531
edited March 13 in Feedback and Suggestions

So in the past 2 years or so we've had 3 new types of survivor perks released. 'Boon' perks, 'Teamwork' perks and 'Invocation' perks. All 3 of these new perks types add an interesting dynamic to the trial but man they are all just kinda terrible tbh

Boon are without question the strongest. Circle of healing and shadowstep are both solid enough but exponential, Dark theory and Illumination are all pretty awful. Illumination doesn.t provide enough info to be worth setting up and the other 2 have too much risk as they have to be set up close to the action to get value. Boons are a decent addition but like most hexes at the moment they don't provide enough value to be worth the set up. Also the teamwide aspect makes them difficult to balance properly. Boons could bring totems back into play with survivor having a secondary objective to improve their chances but currently they are a bit too weak for the set up

Next is teamwork perks. Activated after healing these perks offer bonuses to sticking close to your teammates. One provides haste and the other scratch mark removal. These perks have 2 issues. Firstly they have a 2 MINUTE cooldown at the least which is ridiculous for a perk with a fairly weak effect. Secondly grouping up as survivor in general isn't an amazing idea so the benefits have to be strong to consider doing that consistently in a match. If teamwork perks were strong it would encourage suvivors to group up leading to more dynamic gameplay with killers with group aoe powers being able to use their power on survivors trying to capitalise on the bonus.

Lastly and most recently is 'Invocation' perks with only one being 'weaving spiders'. After channeling in the basement for 120 whole seconds all gens have 10 charges removed. Sounds like a decent deal for spending 2 minutes loitering in the basement not helping on gens or anything else. But after the invocation is placed you are Broken FOR THE REST OF THE TRIAL! That's an insane downside for a bonus which ends up being a negative time investment. If invocations were strong imagine the gameplay it could create fighting over the most dangerous part of the map to try and get a huge bonus that could change the pace of the trial while the killer could easily snowball a basement hook into a 4k.

I love that the devs are trying new survivor perk ideas as they help keep the gameplay loop fresh but it really sucks that they launch these perks so weak for fear of changing the meta and making people upset. I feel like circle of healing made them very afraid to push these new ideas to their full potential in fear of backlash. To me there's no point adding these new perks ideas if they aren't intended to change the meta as otherwise they just become a very occasional spanner in the works which can be easily dealt with due to their weak numbers. Keeping a game like DBD fresh is very important and strong new survivor gameplay elements is an amazing way to do this

Comments

  • Phasmamain
    Phasmamain Member Posts: 11,531

    I absolutely love the concept but god being broken for the whole trial is a ridiculous downside to give. It's just not worth the hassle in any situation especially now that 3 genning has been heavily nerfed

  • fulltonon
    fulltonon Member Posts: 5,762

    I feel the fact other survivors can help with invocation is unhealthy and should be removed, and then effect can be fairly stronger.

  • Phasmamain
    Phasmamain Member Posts: 11,531

    Maybe but that also leads to more risk for the survivors especially against certain killers like bubba. It adds to the teamwork element of the survivor role which is severely lacking imo

  • anarchy753
    anarchy753 Member Posts: 4,212
    edited March 13

    The problem is that when you add a strong survivor perk, it has to be balanced by there being 4 of it in every game. If Invocations weren't super punishing, every single gen would lose 40 max charges (presumably BEFORE a bunch of brand new parts too.)

    Boons can't be too strong, because it takes 1/16th of the survivors perks, but gives all 4 survivors the same buff. We saw it with circle of healing, how oppressive that was when all survivors had infinite better self care, and in SWF it took one perk slot to do so.

    Teamwork is just weird, they aren't that great, but it's also not a new mechanic, as staying near each other was already on Cheryl's perks years before.

  • fulltonon
    fulltonon Member Posts: 5,762

    Honestly? survivors shouldn't really favor "teamwork" that much, as it doesn't help solo que for 99% of time while immensely increasing SWF power.

    I think invocation as itself is meant to be extreme risk extreme reward perk, I feel there shouldn't really be a way to negate the "risk" part so "reward" can be almost instawin too.

    40 seconds while killer is chasing a survivor is too short for a big bonus.

  • Archol123
    Archol123 Member Posts: 4,634

    They should just make it so Invocations have several shorter rituals instead of one big one, therefore not leaving you behind vulnerable in the basement... You could even make it so you need to go the basement twice for the ritual to finish. Make it even take a bit longer but remove the broken status effect.

  • Paternalpark
    Paternalpark Member Posts: 663

    I'd only use it if it prevented any gen regression there after. Even then no one will sacrifice themselves for strangers.

    It's going to be like Bloodrush. Not worth the risk so no one will use it.

    I just know the game will be thrown once I see invocation on hub.

  • I_CAME
    I_CAME Member Posts: 1,302
    edited March 13

    It will 100% get buffed. Just wait for the patch. Right now it's completely useless for anything other than meme purposes. Playing a 3v1 while someone sits in the basement will never be good unless the perk has an enormous reward attached to it. The current effect is not enough to justify using it.

  • Rickprado
    Rickprado Member Posts: 564
    edited March 13

    The current Invocation perk has a quite strong effect - removing charges from the gens - without being outright broken. Specially since most of the killers won't be patrolling the basement. The thing is: it should be used at very specific times of the match; using it at the start is a waste, but it can be gamechanging when there is 3 to 2 gens left.

    Its not MFT levels of broken - i hope that doesn't ever comeback again - but its a good perk.

    I wish the new invocation perks could help with some of the current survivor gameplay issues, like information or tunneling, becoming more meaningfull without making the match unfair. Like, one invocation could extend the protection time after being unhooked by 100%. Could be a nice perk and would have a strong effect without breaking the game.