So now that every viable regression/slowdown perk has been nerfed for Killers...

Toolboxes aren't the problem. The problem is that against teams that just do generators, you WILL lose 3 gens in the first chase. A SINGLE dropped God pallet in the first chase will add 20 seconds to that chase. All you have to do is, run to the furthest god pallet you can make, predrop it, then shift + w to the opposite corner of the map. By the time the killer catches up hits you twice and hooks you? 90 seconds will have passed, and 3 gens are done. At that point no amount of "playing nice" will ever be able to come back from that.

nobody does anyway, nor can they be expected to.

The others I could see even if I disagree, but how on earth is Deadline detrimental?

Surely the downside to that perk is that it's just not reliable?

it causes skill checks to appear in random places instead of in the center of the screen. not sure if i agree that it's strictly worse than an empty perk slot, but that is a distinct downside

it’s not going anywhere, if killers wanna tunnel someone out let them do it. The word “tunnel” was made up by survivor mains and it’s lost it’s meaning.

there’s a fundamental problem when trying to “fix” tunneling, and that is… no matter what you add, the idea is always one of the 3…

• Exploitable by Survivors/Rewards being bad as a survivor

• Heavily Punishes killers who don’t tunnel effecting the average game

•Too Clunky, and difficult to code, and usually falls in tandem with the other 2

I have seen countless ideas for anti tunneling, and each of them always has one of these 3 issues. To be fair, and not to by a hypocrite I don’t really HAVE any ideas to solve tunneling, I don’t really have good ideas in general, but tunneling is something baked into the game.

And what about pallets? will they be able to use them?
Or how will it work with lockers? will slowly going inside it remove this? or they won't be able to enter at all?
Will they be able to interact with some killer powers and will it remove effect? (turrets/EMPs/hag traps/etc)
And how long does this effect last, if survivor does none of the things you listed?

I'm gonna say no to pallets.

They can get into lockers, but they can get grabbed out of them. Obviously, like you said, fast entering would be a rushed action.

Killer powers is a bit trickier. I'll say that they can't interact with powers, BUT that powers like Pig's Traps for example will still be activated, they'll just take effect when the Survivor loses that status. So if a gen pops, the Trap will be active when the Survivor gets healed for example.

At first I was thinking to have it last forever, but I think that opens up too many hostage situations. So I think giving it a 90 second hard-cap outside of chase (PLENTY of time to get to safety/heal/do whatever else) BUT I would make it so that the timer does not go down if you are in a chase.

90 Seconds but paused in chase does sound like a nice solution. I think the idea actually has grounds to be feasible in game with those heavy restrictions but some things need to be taken into account

1. It requires ironing out especially when it comes to killer powers, Pig being a major hassle to balance with, as it either makes RBT’s completely worthless, or it makes pig into a tunneling nightmare.
2. This power deactivates during EGC it’s when the killer is at their strongest, all formalities and guidelines get thrown out the window (side note, Void Kissed sounds perfect, however it doesn’t really thematically make sense? Maybe Entity kissed?)
3. Total Rework of all current Anti tunnel perks, Decisive Strike, Off the Record, Borrowed time, and Babysitter all need to be completely reworked, I feel like the idea above would be easy to do, but completely reworking 4 perks (2 of which are meta) would be the most difficult part of implementing this idea

Yes, it is hard to theory-craft for certain Killer powers and obviously very difficult to see it play out without actually being able to see it in-game. Another one is Pinhead. Ultimately, I do feel like RBT's and the Box are still enough of a threat to be able to function. It's not like you won't be affected by these objects, it's just delayed.

Yes, it should deactivate during EGC.

I think, and keep in mind I'm recalling lore that I read YEARS ago, that when Survivors are put on hooks, the Entity feeds on their hope and emotions. When they are, eventually, turned into emotionless husks via endless Trials, they are cast into the Void, which is essentially Limbo. Void-Kissed makes sense in the idea that the Entity would overlook those Survivors and perhaps discourage the Killer from hunting a Survivor losing hope. It also makes sense in the idea that the player often loses hope when they are being tunneled, and the Entity stepping in to prevent one of it's favorite toys from being drained completely is neat.

DS, OTR or BT could extend the time or add additional effects. For example, OTR could passively heal you throughout the duration of Void-Kissed. DS could extend it's duration. BT could go back to applying a short (and I do mean short, like maybe 4-5 seconds) Endurance effect for the unhooker. Just spitballing here really.

I'm just going to jump in to mention that a hook donation system would avoid all of these issues.

Let's say that survivors can choose to donate their first hook stage to a shared pool, and any hooks come out of that pool first, before individual hash marks. (Perk or core mechanic, to be decided) You can still only use deliverance/Kobe attempts on your first hook, and we could even go so far as to say that if you attempt to Kobe at all, it doesn't use the shared hook pool to prevent soh griefing.

It's not exploitable by survivors (or by killers). It also doesn't affect killers who don't tunnel... In fact, spreading hooks becomes the most efficient way to make sure the shared hook pool is empty and you aren't wasting time waiting for the first person you found to be unhooked. If you're already playing so that your first 4 hooks are different survivors, this is exactly the same as live.

There's no 'clunkiness', just a simple coding of the mechanic, and a ui element to show how many shared hooks exist. This isn't some convoluted system where the game has to decide if the gameplay meets some arbitrary criteria.

This is one potential way to make tunneling (and camping as well) completely obsolete. The only way to do that is to make tunneling less efficient, and this does that. Sure, the killer could choose to chase one survivor for 5 hook stages, but leaving the rest of the team alone for that is going to be a losing game. It basically forces killers to spread map pressure, which is a form of slow down.

If other changes are necessary, then so be it. The devs have had no issues with buffing killers individually or more generally with perks other than slowdown lately. Forcing killers to be involved in more chases should be healthy for the game, and might start to wean people off of reliance on quad slowdown perks.

I never run 4 slowdown. At most I run two slowdown, one info, and a flex perk(depending on the killer in playing) I would love more fun perks other than slowdown but there really isn't. The fun perks we have see so little value from that it's almost handicapping yourself of you decide to run them. Plz devs buff the weaker non slowdown perks so killers have more options for builds.

Now you know that's not true. It cannot be that 100% of killers don't play nice.

To be honest, if ANYTHING ELSE besides doing gens would not be considered trolling these days - then maybe gen rushing wouldn't be such an issue. But with the current meta of the game it's all a survivor can do. Guess it's the price y'all have to pay for wanting a gen kick meta and longer gen repair times.

It's not actually that hard if you know what you're doing, ftr.

There are a lot of good and viable perks out there that can absolutely bring you comparable value to slowdown perks, you just have to have an understanding of how to use them and how to play DBD's macro game. The state of killer perk variety in terms of what's viable is honestly pretty good right now.

I gotta say I did see a little less tunneling during the original Ruin + Undying meta. That could have been luck though, I know the experience wasn't the same for everyone.

"the original Ruin era too"

Ah, good times!

Yes, the game becoming more and more competitive (even though we don't have an actual competitive mode, thankfully) is definitely a factor here.

I think you missed the problem. With the route they’re taking right now, they are actually balancing the game around tunnelling, and promote more Killers to tunnel.

Just ask yourself. How are your games usually go if Killer decides to play nice, especially without slowdowns? I’ll tell you mine, I won most of it as Solo.