http://dbd.game/killswitch
Why Nemesis M2 still gives survivors 3d health state?
Seriously, from all killers Nemesis M2 the most unrewarding and weak special attack. Deal with infinite 3d health state and speed boost remove all fun from this killer. Its more winnable just doing m1 the entire game and forget about m2 existance (and its not okay if by not using your power you have more chance to win). And if you say pallet shred then its just not worth it. The best pallet shred in the game have Bubba and Demo and their power does not punish them or give advantage for survivors. For dealing survivors on pallet loop Nemesis being outplayed by Xeno or Pyramid Head who can deal with loops a lot easy. This 3d health state mechanic is outdated and should gone when Nemesis being touched again.
Comments
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I don't really have problem with third health state, but it would be definitely good to make it more relevant.
I liked the idea to involve zombies, so they are more likely to detect you and walk faster towards if you, if you are infected.
My main issue with Nemesis are his trash add-ons.
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Unlike Pyramid head Nemesis have at least have a some good addons like Mikhail's Eye / Broken Recovery Coin / Depleted Ink Ribbon / Ne-α Parasite / Shattered S.T.A.R.S. Badge and Marvin's Blood. And no matter how many zombies he has they still dum and stack on everything. And if developers cannot fix knight guards to be not so dum for zombies there is no chance.
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Because his whip can break pallets extremely quick at a distance and still move and look around, he can hit and injure infected survivors over many things (including aforementioned pallets) at a distance, makes you vulnerable to zombies, and can be dragged. All with a relatively short wind up and cd making it less punishing to miss.
Bubba is punished if he hits anything other than a pallet or survivers via tantrum and technically needs to recharge tokens for maximum run distance, which doesn't go past obstacles bar point blank windows. Demo goes in a straight line, depending on where you miss it can be little to heavily punished, and he also doesn't hit over objects. Xeno can be taken out of his power while PH has a decent CD on using his power meaning he can't afford to miss or risks wasting tons of time. None of these ones have help as well.
We feel it's perfectly fine that survivors need infected first before he can hurt them with the whip. Especially since it's not infinite, survivors only have 4/3 vaccines.
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I don't like zombies being a bigger part of his power. Being chased around a gen and painstakingly leading them to a pallet is very tedious. Assuming there is a pallet. If there's not you just have to find another gen to work on.
Maybe if you could disable them for a time without a pallet or item.
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It's because it is pretty damn easy to get a hit with Nemesis once you know what you're doing.
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You must be joking. Its much easier to do a hit with Xeno (cause tail less punishing for succesfull and missing attack cooldown and much bigger and fair hitbox). When nemesis tentacle can strike through survivors and still miss.
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Its a still punish Nemesis for using his power and you can down much faster if forget about m2 exist (and thats not good). When other killer that i mentioned have something more for them. Bubba can instadown with forgiving cooldown (after buff). Demo can teleport and have a good addons. Pyramid Head can snipe through walls and Xeno having map control, more mindgame potential and smaller terror radius with very powerful addons. Nemesis is just weak "i give survivor 3d health state killer" with extremly punishable and unrewarding m2 attack, useless zombie and mediocre addons. Also t-virus do absolute nothing (unlike uroboros)
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Well, but something should be changed about infection in my opinion.
I wouldn't remove it, but right now it is simply third health state, which then only limits your power progress.
It actually doesn't make sense for survivors to go heal/cleanse until they are dead on hook.
I think there is potential to use it way more.
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He simply needs better add-ons which could better change or improve his power to create more versatile gameplay. Alongside that the zombies need a serious overhaul to their Ai, plus being more interactive in general since they could act as a passive slowdown.
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4 vaccines +4 base is 8 extra hits. that's atrocious early game for nemesis.
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It "punishes" temporarily and "rewards" later depending on how often you can hit with your whips. If you can't hit with your whip then yes, being an m1 is faster, if you can then even with a "third health state" (we never liked how thats worded) your gonna gets hits and downs faster and through many obstacles. As we pointed out each of those also have cons that Nemesis doesn't have (technically nemi does have some map control via zombies…or does that count as stall to the masses?). We also pointed out the pros of Nemi that none of the above have. The T-virus makes it so his whip and zombies hurt.
We've gone over how strength is subjective before in a different thread, we're not gonna repeat ourselves.
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Assuming we're understanding what you said correctly, yes its a hard start for a nemi but he also gots help for infecting and for a decent power trade off so we find it fair enough.
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losing 3 gens for 1 chase is terrible. it doesn't matter that you get a power boost. when you have 2 hooks and survivor have 4 gens done because of your power, it is not good.
to put into perceptive, His vaccine is like stacking dead hard in the first chase. in theory, you can have health-state, a vaccine and dead hard in 2nd chase. you almost lose to just shift-w…… for how many stacking exhaustion speed boosts that is.
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At that point thats a player problem…we're nowhere near the best (especially since we've become rusty) but we can still get hits in via whip and fist (if your going for whip only there might be the problem) fast enough that we've gotten more than that for 3 gens in normal matches. Someone whos better than us will be flaying survivors (or enough pallets to fill the meat plant) with his whip.
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i am saying vs equally skilled survivor that seldom gets hit by m1 and only gets hit by whip, 3 hits for first chase is 3 gens done. subsequent uses of vaccine means that you can lose all 5 gens by the time vaccines are depleted vs efficient team.
When i play soloq, most of my games vs nemesis is nemesis lose 3 gens before vaccines are depleted at min. sometimes it is 4 gens. it depends on how good my soloq team is. the amount of extra exhaustion effect and distance these vaccines give is literally stronger then any anti-tunnel perk that survivors have. it beats decisive strike and beats dead hard. only old dead hard that could be used infinity amount of times was superior.
To this day, I still question whether his Vaccines or Xeno turret is worse drawback. from what I see, Xeno turrets are better for weaker survivor players because their repetitive and consistent value holds more average weight. Nemesis Vaccines scale with survivor skill-level. at low-level to medium levels, a second chance is not as valuable because player make so many mistakes in chase that killer can punch through all second chances with minimal generator loss. At higher levels of play, nemesis vaccine is complete crushing blow because each second chance is min-maxed so well with time efficiency on generators that little no hope to coming back as nemesis when it is used properly.
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I hate the mechanic but I understand why it's there. It'd be nice however if they slightly nerfed the speed boost given to a newly infected healthy survivor.
When infected by a zombie, there shouldn't be any speed boost, just i-frames. That ######### is so unfair.
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We're not sure whether to be jealous or not as most of our nemis are either good or [insert basic insult] doing the usual 4 gen stall and tunnel build. We're still in disagreement here as equally skilled would mean you'd get as often a chance to m1 as whip assuming nemi has working programming. And even that would still be 3 hits to 2 gens done at worst which is typical for most killers. Not taking into account of what happens during the chase either such as whip hit and leave, whip chase into others whip others back on first, etc. Admittedly maps also factor into times and we've realized we've neglected that as we're typing but thats a side tangent of our sleep addled brains.
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i think opposite. equally skilled means that your m1 is nearly useless and you only get power hits because survivor makes little to no mistakes at loops/have strong map knowledge. when your getting m1 hits a lot, it is because your opponent is significantly worse than you as killer in the chase. when this is not the case, it is because loop is unsafe/fair for killer to mindgame or the map is giant dead-zone where everything is already broken. At that point, you don't really need your ability….
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If aimed and timed correctly nemisis whip is one of the hardest powers to loop against. the zombies are there because of this third health state as a (passive backup). He is a very strong chaser but could still use some touch ups.
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Shrug to each their own experience.
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T-Virus should work like Pig trap gain timer when fully infected you die or like Uroboros gain hindered and instadown
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While thematically we'd agree, game wise that'd be a no for us. We ask why? He's not in any sort of desperate need for change in a balance sense and unlike Freddy, he's more enjoyable to play as (atleast our opinion)
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What i dont understand is why he still doesnt injure and gives speed boost while level 3.
Before that? I still kinda dont get it but hey, at least you know you are getting something in return: you are leveling up your power, making it stronger.
But at level 3? Just why? Its just straight up worse. You are giving the survivors free health states and you are getting absolutely nothing in return. Nothing.
I would be completely fine to rework Marvins Blood addon into something else completely different, and hell if they want to nerf the basekit mutation rate gain when hitting with the tentacle, go ahead. Make it to reach level 3 harder, but once you reach it, it should be the "oh shi-" moment for survivors and you should not give them a free 3rd health state as you already got what you wanted while giving it to them before.
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Well, this topic aged like fine wine.
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Well no another huge nerfs for killers at all (buff only survivors perks/buff to hook stages and the most annoying blast mine perk getting buffed) and micro scopic buff for 2 killers and no adjustment to useless zombie
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Oh and forgot to mention no prestige in lobby (another buff for bully squad)
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Huge nerfs for killers? Literally Nemesis, Doctor and Dredge got buffed? What?
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Survivvor perk buff/camping nerf/prestige hiding a.k.a buff for cheaters and bully squads
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Well, so some survivor buffs and some killer buffs. You should not see only one side of the coin.
Also, i did write this focusing only on Nemesis, as it is the reason for this topic. I just found it funny that we did talk on this matter not so long ago and right now he seems to be buffed. He will styll give 3rd health state but it should be much more bearable now.
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