deathslinger harpoon hitbox is too small, solution is to increase harpoon speed
this video shows how easy it is to avoid a spear, by simply for an instance momentarily changing directions causes a miss, even if the shot was properly aligned.
for this reason i run the tin oil can, because missing the shot is heavily punished. but im certain that this shot would be considered a hit with the huntress.
i know survivor hitboxes are out of the question, and so are for the spear, but increasing the harpoon shot, would avoid these situations.
you wouldnt have to lead as much, and less travel time. or if this idea is also rejected, then dont make missing so punishing.
thank you.
Comments
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This is the skillful part of Deathslinger that doesn't really need to be messed with. I think everyone would just be messed up and end up hating a change like this. Compared to Huntresses massive hatchets, Deathslinger has the advantage of hitting shots that she simply can't because of the hitbox. Once you understand how the survivor hitbox works, it becomes less of an issue and becomes an advantage.
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yeah, if anything they need to make huntress' hatchets smaller. Those have insane hitboxes.
The only ranged killer that deserves huge hitbox is unknown for VERY obvious reasons.
Huntress needs to be brought in line with others.
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hello there fellow gamer, im sorry to ask, but did you view the video i provided? i skillfully aimed and lead the shot almost perfectly, but the rain just needed to stop her momentum for a frame or two and caused the shot the miss?
how much more skillful could it get? you cant seriously hold the player accountable to somehow take into account survivors to react that way. and how is proposing a speed increase a negative change?
this would encourage the player to go for more shots, instead of guaranteed shots such as window and pallet vaults. thank you for checking out the post and would like to continue the conversation
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I think she either needs the hitbox reduced or her recent buffs reverted. She didn't need them and something needs to be toned down to compensate. That being said, her hitbox is sometimes the only thing she has going for her at certain tiles, otherwise she's just a worse m1 killer.
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reducing his ads from 0.4 →0.15 would also solve these situations because it would take more skill to side-step his shots. currently, side-step his harpoon gun takes 0 skill because player can react to the gun every single time.
Increase his harpoon gun speed would also improve him but survivor would have less counter-play to his gun. if they were emulating a real gun, his shots should be like 1500 m/s but i assume they choose not to do this to make his gun a more skillful interaction between killer leading shots and survivor predicting harpoon shot fire to side-step.
The only problem is that their nerfs to deathslinger removed skill component of outplaying his gun.
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Watching the video, it honestly doesn't seem right in my opinion. I haven't played Slinger in awhile, but unless survivor hitboxes have changed recently, there isn't much reason this shouldn't have hit. While Slinger has an insanely small hitbox, survivors have a pretty big one themselves. In all honesty you hit it perfectly, and I'm almost inclined to believe something else was at play and not just the hitbox
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no trust me i have 4k hours solely on slinger, i review my matches, this isnt cheating, i have multiple clips of leading the shot correctly, assuming the survivor will continue on the same path, and when the spear is headed toward their way, they the survivor twitch to a different direction, either strategically or by accident and avoid the shot, since the hitbox is too small.
thats why i recommend a harpoon speed increase. less travel time, and prevent these situations.
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i always imagined that dodging the shot isnt the counter play, but rather the chain break mechanic, since every other killer that land their power instantly injures or downs. but the hitbox is so tiny, makes me think that at one point slinger was going to be hitscan, and chain break was counter
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hitbox reduced. devs tried doing that in 2018, but huntress players cried so hard they reverted it instead of finding a middle ground. should go back to it, esp in light of how many killers have similar timings to their abilities as huntress (dracula) but infinitely more fair hitbox.
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Huntress hitbox feels fine if everyone has low ping imo, it's when the huntress has high ping that you get awful looking shots. Even with low ping. If you make her hitbox smaller, getting snipes will be way less consistent and all it would do is make Huntress less approachable for newer players. I think people should play her some against good players, then they'll feel her limitations.
I'm not saying she can't be oppressive in chase, but it's not like the's overpowered or anything with her current hitboxes. She had quite low killrate according to the last official stats, lower than both Deathslinger and Trickster. Yeah, I know these stats are skewed towards the average player, but you don't see many Huntresses in high MMR either as far as I know.
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ive heard the ping excuse in 2018 too and it's a really lazy way of downplaying the issue. It's very clear as of now that her hitbox is unfairly big compared to other ranged point&click killers in the game and somehow they dont have to crutch on a bloated sphere to work.
It's also incredibly disingenuous to justify an issue that affects a lot of people in any games with huntress present by bringing up a very niche trick that's used by a very minor % of players. The game should never sacrifice the quality of experience for the sake of not even preserving, but simply keeping niche tricks easier. Orbitals are a cool flex and they would be an even bigger flex if the hitbox is adjusted and the horrible downside of it would be that huntress doesn't feel like unfair killer that hits air and gets injuries/downs. God forbid.
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dodging the shot is not the counterplay.
predicting the killer takes a shot and making a move is the counterplay.
in your particular example you were aiming a bit ahead of the survivor and failed to predict their movement pattern and therefore missed. when you slowed the video down, it's very clear the survivor isn't reacting, but rather just moving in a random pattern trying to move away from the possible trajectory, expecting to eventually commit to running forward while you lose the opportunity by waiting.
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It wouldn't affect just orbitals if they reduced the hitbox size, it will affect everything about her,
Do you really feel like Huntress is unfair? I feel she's fine to play against. I think part of why people hate her so much is because she's the most popular killer in the entire game, so of course people will grow tired of her.
Huntress has two hitboxes, the small one is for the environment, the big one is for survivors. You may think that the obvious solution is to just make the two hitboxes the exact same, why not? But the outrage from Huntress players when they actually "fixed" her survivor hitbox probably wasn't for no reason, they probably noticed that regular shots that looked good on their screen and would hit before, weren't hitting at all now.
If there were to experiment with reducing the hitbox for survivors, they could at the very least add an ingame crosshair so console players and beginner huntresses could get a little help with aiming their shots.
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man do I miss quick scope slinger
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breaking his chain is very hard if not near impossible with new movement speed changes for deathslinger. like i have broken some 16 meter range shots on slinger by carefully wiggling into an object just as your being pulled but i highly doubt the chain break is meant to be counter-play other than restrict deathslinger from taking certain shots.
I am certain that his gameplay is centered around flick dodging at last second for survivor and fast-fire shooting at correct time when the survivor poorly predicts him quick-scoping for the shot. It is just that their balance changed killed deathslinger's gameplay for the killer player and made too easy for survivor to have counter-play.
BVHR will eventually have to admit that their for slinger were poor changes and revert him but they're stubborn and have attempt multiple buffs that have accomplished exactly nothing. till than, you'll just be waiting endlessly until a patch for slinger shows up.
The problem is that BVHR keeps getting posts like @Toystory3Monkey that say that dodging isn't skillful, dodging is not counter-play and quickscoping unfair/imbalanced. As a result, deathslinger will probably stay the same because balanced around casuals.
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I completely agree, anyone who doesnt hasnt played deathslinger. Some shots i SHOULD hit wont register even if you have clear Line of sight on survivior. In comparison to huntress his power;
+takes longer/even to reload
-longer penalties for missed/succeeded attacks
-more limited
-less range
-less hitbox
-less meaningful addons
Ever since quickscoping got removed, the only reason to play deathslinger over huntress is looks.
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Old quick scoping and m2 faking was so skilless the community was in an uproar about how unfun he was in chase as he started a lot of similar designs around that time. It's like how people say skull merchant isn't the worst because there are stronger killers that do what she does, when the problem is all of the designs and how free in chase they are, but hers is just most egregious.
If his "intended design" you keep referencing is too killer-sided and not balanced, and he truly is too easy to counterplay on the survivor side, then he needs to be reworked, not buffed or reverted.
@toystory3monkey is based0 -
BVHR will not rework the killer. the killer will either be weak because survivor complains about said killer or the killer will be strong playable choice for the killer player to select.
there was nothing wrong with old deathslinger counter-play. it was fair and balanced interaction between survivors predicting shots and extending chase or survivor failing to predict shots and losing distance resulting in an m1. survivor that understood gameplay were fine playing against him and survivor didn't struggled and lost.
It is same for skull merchant really. there is nothing wrong with her current gameplay either. BVHR has habit of spoon feeding survivors that fail to play against a killer. Why bother learning to play against slinger or skull merchant if you can just wait for BVHR to nerf the killer for you. you don't need learn anything that way.
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In a game with killer powers constantly getting buffed, and the most number of S tiers in history, and maps getting nerfed so chase is the weakest it has ever been you are saying this.
I see what's going on now.
If the game goes your way there will be no survivors left.0 -
The most number of S tiers in history???
I don't think you've been playing DBD for that long.
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There are 4 now with Billy Nurse Blight and Spirit. Before at most before there have been 3(nurse spirit billy OR nurse spirit blight) or 2 before that with nurse and spirit. I have been playing for over 4 and a half years, which is a fact I don't think is relevant to the discussion but does mean that I have been playing for quite some time.
Some people put some of the A+ killers into S but I do not do that. Anyway this is a bit of hair-splitting don't you think? The point was more about killer strength overall and especially in chase being at its highest now than at any other point in the games' history, which I would think still holds true even if you could convince me about the S tier thing.0 -
they're constantly getting buffed because many of killer are under-tuned. the maps that are getting nerfed are maps that are completely over-tuned for survivor
Like what maps did they touch?
Eyrie of crows → previously a huge map with many safe loops, (Still survivor sided)
Borgo[Shattered Square] → Another huge map with many safe loops(Still arguably survivor sided)
Ormond → A huge map that spawned like 4 jungle gym point in its first iteration(Still arguably survivor sided)
Farm maps, One of the most survivor sided realm in the game. Both Fracture cowshed and Racid abattoir had safe pallet and god pallets everywhere.
Bloodlodge, A map that spawn like 25+ pallets, nicknamed by the player-base to be pallet lodge.
Haddonfield → A map that had so many god windows and infinity loops that made every chase nearly unplayable for m1 killers.
Mother dwelling → A huge map with a god window in the middle(They only shrinked the map but map is still arguably survivor sided due to infinity windows)
Garden of joy → Another terrible map with a god window in the main building followed by a map that links every single tile(Reworked version barely changed anything about this map).
The next map they're reworking is badham preschool which surprise surprise is ultra survivor sided.
Something to note is that they have also buffed some survivor maps that were under-performing. the most notable ones were
-Shelter woods which way more windows and more pallets
-Autohaven Wrecker, a another map where they increased pallet density.
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And when they buff killers they often overdo it or make them uninteresting to vs. Overtuning in the case of billy or twins, unfun in the case of nemesis.
I agree that many of the maps changed were too strong for survivor. However, they have gone too far in the other direction now. You cannot tell me modern Rancid or Haddonfield for example are in a healthy state for the game.
Some of these examples are pretty funny though. Saying borgo which has fairly weak pallets and often JGs with no window as a map with "lots of safe loops" is an interesting take.
Fixing shelter woods while nerfing lots of other maps is hardly a balanced take in this discussion. It is undeniable they are making maps far better for killers, and in this way compared to og maps this is of course very good. Many of the og maps had infinites. Today there are no infinites or pallet lodge or whatever else. Let's talk about today. Today there aren't that many maps which are busted for survivor, and maps often needlessly being buffed for killer, or reworks which go too far in favor of killer. That is what I am referring to.
I would be okay with them taking away all of the extra busted survivor maps if there were no S or A+ tier killers, but if those maps go there will be far less protection against S tiers with no restrictions. So of course I wish for the maps to not be unbalanced towards survivor, but I also wish for there to not be BS on the killers' end either.0 -
the maps are worse than what they were before but what they were before were so poorly balanced for all A- & lower killers. I am not sure how to describe it because a good 70% of the killer just did not work on these old maps iteration. their ability was far too weak for the map they were playing on.
when they buff killers they often overdo it or make them uninteresting to vs. Overtuning in the case of billy or twins, unfun in the case of nemesis.
I do not agree. most killer that they buff don't really move needle. The ones that they buff that move needle end up being good because their original kit is good but had poor numbers. Billy is great example of that. He is good killer but his number were poor tuned. They buffed up his numbers and that made him a better killer. Dredge is same. good killer, bad numbers. they buffed his number and now he is much stronger. Huntress also falls in the same boat as billy and dredge. Clown, Trickster, chucky were some of the killer that received positive changes in my opinion but they also received some associated negative changes which can be argue to make them overall worse.
The rest killer just don't make difference. doctor, ghostface, nemesis, knight, singularity, twins, pig, demogorgon and legion. these killer were mediocre before and they're mediocre after. they didn't suddenly jump up to S-tier or A-tier, they're still just ineffective as before.
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I guess it's fair to say that not all reworks change the killers that much, but I just consider those tweaks. Anyway I see how you view things now. Have a good one.
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The S tiers of old were an entirely different beast. If you think killer strength is at the highest it's ever been, then I doubt you remember the days of no-audio Spirit or instasaw Billy, or even double range Nurse very well.
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Yes of course those old S tiers were stronger in a vacuum than their current-day iterations, but you also have to consider that they existed in the context of the old maps and old survivor perks and old gen times, etc.
When I say killer strength, I am speaking across the board for every killer. Nurse can still reliably 2 tap you(as can any S tier, as well as many other killers in the game now), and we have had at least some increases in effectiveness of the weaker killers. This was done either directly through power buffs, or indirectly through map nerfs and overall game changes(gen kick regression increased, gen timer increase, distance gained through hit by survivor lessened, etc). That's not to mention that overall there are far less oppressive survivor perks too than before(old object seeing people the whole game, old DH for distance vs stuff like old bubba, etc).0
