Would it be a good Dev Update?
I got an idea where I would prepare some changes that would fit into Developer Update and I want your opinions about some changes.
Survivor Gameplay Improvements
[NEW] Within 16 meters from the hooked Survivor, all Survivors Auras are revealed for each other.
[NEW] When Survivor drops a Pallet, his Aura is revealed for his Teammates for 4 seconds.
Notes: These features do not apply for Survivors that joined from the same Lobby with 3 or 4 players.
Killer Gameplay Improvements
[NEW] At the start of the Trial, the 3 Generators located farthest from you are blocked for 60 seconds.
Notes: This feature does not apply for Killers such as The Nurse, The Blight and The Hillbilly.
Killer Updates
The Hillbilly | Base Kit Changes
[CHANGE] Decreased the Chainsaw's Sprint intial Turn rate to 0.75 seconds (was 1 second).
The Hillbilly | Add-Ons
Counterweight
- Decreases the Chainsaw's cooldown after successful Chainsaw Hit by 15% while in Overdrive.
Thermal Casing
- Increases movement speed while Revving the Chainsaw by 2.5%.
Discarded Air Filter
- Decreases time required to charge a Chainsaw by 5% while in Overdrive.
Ragged Engine
- Successful Chainsaw Hit extends Overdrive duration by 5 seconds.
High Speed Idler Screw
- When Overdrive activates, The Hillbilly grants Undetectable Status Effect for 8 seconds.
The Nurse | Base Kit Changes
[NEW] Killer Stun applies 12 seconds cooldown on her Power.
The Nemesis | Base Kit Changes
[CHANGE] Increased the duration of Hindered to 2.25 seconds (was 2 seconds).
[CHANGE] Decreased the power of Hindered to 10% (was 20%).
[CHANGE] Increased time required to open Supply Case to 8 seconds (was 4 seconds).
The Nemesis | Add-Ons
NE-A Parasite
- Reveals Survivors auras within 12 meters from the Zombies.
Jill's Sandwich
- Blinding or destroying Zombies by any means applies Exposed Status Effect for 30 seconds.
Adrenaline Injector
- Increases movement speed while Charging Tentacle Strike by 0.1 m/s.
- Decreases Tentacle Strike cancellation cooldown by 0.2 seconds.
Tyrant Gore
- Reaching Mutation II grants 5% Haste Status Effect for the next 30 seconds.
- Reaching Mutation III grants Undetectable Status Effect for the next 45 seconds.
The Cannibal | Base Kit Changes
[CHANGE] Increased Chainsaw's Sweep movement speed to 5.45 m/s (was 5.35 m/s).
[CHANGE] Decreased time required to reach maximum speed during the Chainsaw Sweep to 0.6 seconds.
[CHANGE] Decreased time required to recharge Chainsaw Charge to 3.5 seconds (was 4 seconds).
The Cannibal | Add-Ons
Spark Plug
- Decreases time required to charge a Chainsaw by 12%.
The Beast's Marks
- Increases Chainsaw's Sweep movement speed by 3% (was 2%).
- Increases time required to charge a Chainsaw by 15% (was 12%).
- Changed rarity to Ultra Rare.
Knife Scratches
- Increases movement speed during the first Chainsaw Charge by 2%.
- Decreases time required to reach maximum movement speed by 20%.
Depth Gauge Rake
- Grants 1 additional Chainsaw Charge.
- Increases time required to charge a Chainsaw by 15% (was 18%).
- Decreases Chainsaw's Sweep movement speed by 1.5% (was 2%).
- Changed rarity to Rare.
Carburetor Tuning Guide
- Automatically consumes all Chainsaw Charges while triggering Chainsaw Sweep.
- Increases Chainsaw Sweep duration by 0.5 seconds.
- Removed movement speed penalty.
- After Breaking a Pallet, time required to recharge Chainsaw Charge is decreased by 15% for 6 seconds.
- Changed rarity to Very Rare.
Map Updates
[CHANGE] Changed the shape of Suffocation Pit I & Azarov Resting Place maps to remove 3 gen playstyle.
[CHANGE] Decreased size of Gas Heaven Map
[CHANGE] Changed Main Building on maps like Gas Heaven, Groaning Storehouse, Garden of Joy & Grim Pantry.
[CHANGE] Many changes to buildings on Badham Realm.
[CHANGE] Many changes to Eyrie Of Crows tiles.
Killer Perks Updates
Shadowborn
- Being blinded grants 10% Haste Status Effect for the next 20 seconds (was 10 seconds).
- Survivor that blinded a Killer suffers from Exposed Status Effect for the next 20/25/30 seconds.
Corrupt Intervation for all Killers expect The Nurse, The Blight & The Hillbilly.
- Increases the Generator blockade duration by additional 40/50/60 seconds.
- Downing a Survivor deactivates the perk.
Notes: Base Kit Mechanic does not deactivate after downing a Survivor.
Save The Best For Last
- Hitting Survivor that isn’t Obsession with your Basic Attack grants 1 Token up to maximum 8.
- Each Token decreases cooldown after successful Basic Attack by 3/4/5% (was 2/3/4%).
- Perk deactivates within 12 meters from hooked Survivor.
- Hitting Obsession with your Basic Attack will consume 2 Tokens.
Surge
- Downing a Survivor with Basic or Special Attacks, all Generators within 32 meters lose 8% of total progress.
- Activating a Perk with Special Attack applies 8/10/12 seconds cooldown.
Survivor Perks Updates
Alert
- Increased the duration to 6/7/8 seconds (was 3/4/5 seconds).
Breakdown
- Increased Aura Reading duration to 8/10/12 seconds (was 4/5/6 seconds).
- Increased time required to respawn the Hook to 220 seconds (was 180 seconds).
Calm Spirit
- Removed penalty for Chests & Totems.
Resilence
- Removed the repairing speed bonus.
- Increased the strenght of other bonuses to 10% (was 9%).
Windows Of Opportunity
- Added 30/25/20 seconds cooldown after Vaulting a Window or Pallet in Chase.
- Decreased the Aura Reading range to 28 meters (was 32 meters).
(I would put Myers & Freddy reworks here, but it would be to much)
Give me your thoughts
Comments
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Actually some great thoughs!
I especially like stbfl and the survivor basekit changes. However, I think punishing people for playing in swf is bad. This is the hole BHVR dug themselves.
Add faster crouching for Piggy basekit and you got me. ^🐽^
Edit1:
I dont think adding a basekit mechanic for killer and excluding some is not good design. This leads to the discussion what killers would be good enough to not get this mechanioc and what killers would be bad enough to warrant the mechanic. I dont think this will ever happen, despite the idea being solid.
Edit2:
maps: rework gideon meat plant. This map is awful and should have changed years ago.
Nemesis: adrenaline injector seems like a complete zoning addon to me. I would not encourage that part of the Nemesis´s power. Make the first part 0.2 and leave the cancellation part out and its fine by me.
Bubba: i thought he was in a really good spot after the last update. Therefore the suggestions you make seem like overkill to me. If im wrong there, please correct me.
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Excluding some killers from certain basekit mechanics is a really bad idea.
You won't be able to correctly identify which killers need to be excluded from basekit mechanics because things like Spirit definitely dont need a 5th perk slot for free, yet you've given them a pass.
That just becomes another headache to manage.
also 12s powerless nurse is definitely a funny joke, keep it going.
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They're not going to give killers basekit corrupt. I definitely agree with the other poster that people would never agree on which killers it would be OP on. I'd also point out they just nerfed gen perks because of how strong they were when stacked. The last thing they're going to do is give killers a free slot for another gen perk when kill rates are already high.
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I would also add in a constraint for Windows of Opportunity to highlight all pallets in their initial state (i.e. if it gets dropped or smashed, it will still reveal the aura as if the pallet is still undropped) the biggest problem with windows is that it shields survivors from making any mistakes of running into a dead pallet so removing that while allowing new players to get familiar with the pallet drop locations would be a massive improvement to the health of the game.
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Survivors see auras: I could see the idea if a survivor is within the range showing auras, but the pallet drop doesn't seem right. This is conceptual game dev idea though about whether soloq should have a unique feel or not.
Basekit Corrupt for Certain Killers: So this is somewhat similar to a Jund idea of giving different killers different gen kick speeds as a way of slightly buffing the weaker killers.
The problem is which killers are meta varies based on region and MMR. A basekit corrupt would make many killers incredibly oppressive at lower levels.
Perks
Shadowborn: This is pretty close to 'if a survivor blinds you, the survivor is downed'. I could see a smaller buff to the haste, or a change to an exposed effect, but combined seem way too strong.
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I am not sure that would work.
I think WoO should only work on Windows and another perk should be made that only works on Pallets. After all it's called Windows of Opportunity, not Pallets of Opportunity, and seeing every single possible vault spot is just a touch too strong. Plus it promotes a bad, unfun, "run to yellow" playstyle that doesn't do anything but act as a crutch for weak Loopers, so they never actually learn the game, so they become totally crippled when they ever have to take WoO off.
WoO is just a poorly designed perk that does too much for free. Not even the Killer gets this much info on map resources for free, they're limited to basekit auras on hooks and gens, both resources that are in smaller amount and can be taken out more easily and quickly than a pallet. Vaults can't be taken out at all unless you use certain perks.
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In my opinion Corrupt Intervention is must have for many Killers - from the weakest to B+ Tier and even higher sometimes. Free Corrupt would be overkill for Nurse, Blight and Hillbilly, because The Nurse just breaks the basic rules of looping and she is obviously the strongest Killer in the game. The Blight and The Hillbilly can travel the map in a few seconds, so Corrupt isn't that needed and it would be overkill in that scenario.
Corrupt is like Borrowed Time on Survivor before Patch 6.1.0. If you really want to win a game and don't lose 3 Generators that fast - it's must have.
Maps - Yeah of course more maps need changes, but I just focued on very boring 3 gen problem on certain maps and obvious overpowered maps like Badham & Eyrie.
The Nemesis - I had the whole list of Add-Ons changes here that as I whole it would make sense, but I decided to not post it here. But overall, I don't see a problem in this Add-On.
The Cannibal - Acceleration buff is just a fix for his Power - just a fix of horrible shadownerf he received in 4.4.0 Patch.
Current Leatherface still needs to run The Beast's Marks to compete against better Survivors, so I would add it fully base kit and keep only 1 movement speed Add-On as Ultra Rare rarity. Small buff for recharge rate - Spark Plug base kit, so I added a new effect for this Add-On. A few changes to his Add-Ons that could perform well, but overall they mostly nerf his Power rather than buffing him. Added effect on Carburetor Tuning Guide could in some terms solve the problem with Pallets - With this Add-On breaking a Pallet takes all your Tokens and you are basically useless for the next few seconds. The Beast's Marks - maybe I would nerf speed bonus from 3% to 2.5% or 2%.
"Punishing players to play SWF" - I don't know maybe I wrote it wrong, but I meant that if to the Lobby join Trio or 4man - this feature doesn't work. If game matches 4 soloq players - it does work. If game matches 2x2 - it does work.
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It's not hard to add more Killers that wouldn't use base kit Corrupt feature. I think it needs some work, but it would be a good idea to add some Killers new statistics - faster speed actions, modified stun durations and some features like Corrupt base kit. Many Killer just need to run Corrupt every game if they want compete and win a game. It's like Borrow Time for Survivor before the Patch 6.1.0.
Remember - these are just suggested changes and I thought about more Killers, but I started from S tier Killers to limit them.
The Nurse has her own, weird way to counterplay, but the is on the top since the start of Dead By Daylight. This change would make Pallets actually viable and great play from Survivor would have some impact against the Nurse. Additionally, Decisive Strike would actually help Survivors while playing against a Nurse.
Just an example - when Cannibal gets a Pallet Stun during his Chainsaw Sweep - he has stun and he lost probably like a few Chainsaw Charges and Survivor have a distance. Survivor played very well, he got an reward. Why wouldn't it a thing with the Nurse. Okay you can say, that if you perfectly read her movements and don't let her see you - you can counter play that, but I thought about adding new counterplays such as Pallets.
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Do not use Kill Rates as a method to balance the game. I know BHVR kinda do that, but it's not a good solution and as I mentioned in previous response - it's not hard to add more Killers that wouldn't have this feature base kit. They added base kit Borrowed Time that was must have back in the days - the same is with Corrupt nowadays - in my opinion. Even Escape Rates were much higher like X years ago, Borrowed Time was a must have perk. So Kill Rates don't matter in my opinion.
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Yes, but that bass kit information on where the generators are gives the killer plenty of information as to where the survivors are going to be going. And they don’t need to equip a perk to have that information. WoO requires a perks slot. So, killers base kit starting the match knowing exactly where to go on the map to find survivors is fine, but survivors having to use a perk that tells them where to go when they are being chased is not fine?
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Some Killers without strong perks can be too opressive on "low levels". I wouldn't take it as an argument that some Killers would be too strong with 50% Corrupt Base Kit. At low levels they won't even do much at the start of the Trial. Balancing a game around the beginners is horrible idea. It's good to add some features that would help them learning the game, but do not balance the whole thing around them.
Survivor Gameplay Improvements - these changes would make SWF-s even more powerful and it would eliminate skill such as good communication. If you get SoloQ closer to SWF (not close, but at least closer) it will make game much easier to balance. My suggested changes are simply like that : In SoloQ you see which Pallets are dropped by your Teamamtes, so you know where are deadzones and added Kindred base kit to make Unhooks plays easier due to lack of communication.
Shadowborn - what's a point of using Shadowborn now though? My suggest would give a choice for Killers. Do I want to use Shadowborn and try to make Flashlight as my own weapon or I just want to counter the Flashlight with Lightborn. Survivors nowadays have many resources to counter 30 seconds Exposed, trust. Additonally, not every Killer would make a huge value from Exposed Status, because it simply better to use special attacks sometimes.
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There is a generator on Killer Shack and there is not Survivor… Ups… Your theory already doesn't make sense. If you would bring argument with Lethal Pressure - let's make Windows Of Opportunity also work for first 10 seconds 😘
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Balancing a game around the beginners is horrible idea. It's good to add some features that would help them learning the game, but do not balance the whole thing around them.Didn't say balance game around them, but you also can't ignore them. Designing the game around any single bracket of players is a bad idea.
If you get SoloQ closer to SWF (not close, but at least closer) it will make game much easier to balance.True, but what are you willing to give up from a design perspective? I like the way the soloq game is designed. I don't want to know where the other survivors are, I want some mystery about what is going on. I think the devs believe that also makes for an overall more enjoyable game experience. Balance isn't everything.
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Why do you believe Survivors need that much information on where to loop basekit?
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Most of these changes I find to either be unhealthy or just bad in general.
The survivor gameplay changes, as BHVR said, wouldn't ever be a thing since survivors are supposed to get as little info as possible plus they'd make 2 perks completely useless.
The killer gameplay changes are primarily just needed for killers like Trapper and Myers and that's it.
The changes to Billy are essentially all bad and one of the add-on changes would even encourage back-revving survivors which is unhealthy.
Nurse physically can't be nerfed that hard at all since major nerfs to her would mean EVERY paid killer would also need nerfs since they can't have paid killers being stronger than any free killers otherwise the game would, officially, receive the Pay2Win tag.
Nemesis base-kit changes don't justify each other, but the longer crate opening would be good. Adrenaline Injector would be the only actually good change for add-ons since one of them is redundant, one of them encourages using M1 which is more boring than M2, and the other one is just pointless since it just gives one-time-use effects.
Bubba doesn't really need those buffs exactly since he just received some amazing buffs to his kit and, just like with Nemesis, only one of the add-ons would be good and the others would either just be hard nerfs and unbalanced(especially with Spark Plug).
Shadowborn would quickly become an unhealthy perk for the game real fast.
Corrupt Intervention shouldn't be made unavailable to ANY killers since that is the ENTIRE purpose of teachables and wouldn't make sense.
Save The Best For Last should be buffed back up by the 1% they took from it, but the deactivation for the perk isn't needed due to it just being a major redundancy since you can't face-camp within 12 meters anyways and being past 16 meters would likely result in the unhook happening before the hit with STBFL can even land meaning the survivors can still get away regardless if they get hit.
Surge would be nice to work with an M2, but the cool down, just like with several other of your suggestions, would primarily just be a redundancy since the only killers who'll typically be able to do this would mainly be Bubba and Oni.
Alert buff would be nice. That's all I have to say for it.
Breakdown is already a frustrating enough perk as is so it 100% doesn't need the respawn timer increased.
Calm Spirit, even though many people don't like the debuff, I actually like it just for the fact that it makes sense with the fact that you're not rushing your chest opening actions and such which is what makes it quiet. Plus the perk does need some kind of downside with how many positive effects it gives.
Resilience I'd actually prefer that change.
And, finally, for Windows Of Opportunity this change would be HORRENDOUS. If I remember correctly, BHVR attempted to test how people would feel if it had a cool down at all and they were hit so hard with so much backlash that they got rid of the cool down immediately. I don't even use the perk all that often whenever I do play survivor(mostly because it doesn't help me that much), but even I know that it having a cool down would be aweful.
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Either all killers get it or none. Otherwise you're excluding people from QoL features simply for existing and it feels bad. Not all nurse players are gods wiping survivors with 4k5.
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Nemesis: zoning is not something i would promote. From what i read, this addon heavily rewards zoning. Therefore im against it.
If you give solos or duos a mechanic that makes the game nicer but leave it out for 3 or 4 - groups, your punishing them for playing in groups. Is what it is sadly.
Bubba: thx for clarifying. Im not too invested into him, therefore this was really helpful.
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Actually, fair point. Yeah i agree. They should cut out the pallet aura reading and leave it to just windows. The current state really makes chases braindead easy for survivors.
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I never said they need it basekit. I was pointing out the killers get a lot of information early as basekit. Survivors need to use a perk. Not anywhere was I suggesting that it should be made basekit.
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"The killer gameplay changes are primarily just needed for killers like Trapper and Myers and that's it"
I disagree with that. For example Killers like Demogrogon or Bubba also need Corrupt - basically if you face Survivors that are just good - not insane, but good, having Corrupt Intervention is must have at current Dead By Daylight and many Killers lose a slot for that. Basically I can say that most of the Killers need that perk if they want to play for win otherwise they gonna lose 2 or 3 Generators fast if Survivors won't make serious mistakes. List of Killers that usually bring Corrupt in my opinion.
Trapper - Myers - Hag - Cannibal - Freddy - Pig - Plague - Ghostface - Demogrogon - Oni - Nemesis - Sadako - Singularity - Chucky
I would add even more Killers for this list to be fair. It doesn't matter that for example Oni is a strong Killer, but without Corrupt gameplay starts at 2 Generators left or even more.
Changes to Billy : I would nerf only one thing that makes him that strong, that really really strong - the intial Turn rate and you gonna say it's a bad change. This nerf would bring back more Skill on Hillbilly where he is very strong now, but if you say so… About the Add-On that would increase charge speed by 5% - there are much better Add-Ons on him and this Add-On wouldn't be unhealthy. Stop overrate Add-Ons that modify charge speed - it's not 30% or even more that Billy could reach in 2016-2020. He already has Add-On that increase charge speed by 20% in both states and it's not a problem at all.
What are you talking about the Nurse? I just don't understand. If it's a joke - not funny at all. My suggested change would award Survivors for great play against her and that's all. I wouldn't add 200 years cooldown on her Power after missed attack or something like that. She still would be S++++ Tier Killer as she is now. Dead By Daylight isn't even in 1% close to be P2W game. The strongest Killers as The Hillbilly, The Nurse, The Spirit, The Blight are aviable for free or Iridescent Shards. With your logic they shouldn't buff Licensed Killers and they shouldn't nerf Oryginal Killers. That's weird statement.
Bubba - How in the world 10% faster charge speed would make Leatherface unbalanced? Other Add-Ons changes would make these Add-Ons worth to play with. I explained why I would change specific Add-On - for example Carburetor Tuning Guide. Additionally, some of my suggested changes are just a fixes to his Shadow - undocumented nerf in 4.4.0 Patch. Increased movement speed would eliminate obligatory to run The Beast's Marks Add-On in every Trial and other changes to Add-Ons would make better Add-Ons variety on Bubba. He still needs some final Buffs that are easy to implement - not a total huge Update.
Shadowborn - how in the world this perk would be very unhealthy. Killer lose 1 Perk Slot to get MAYBE 1 down on Exposed Status. After that, the Survivor gives information about this perk and it's completely useless. Nobody would run this perk as meta.
Save The Best For Last - This perk do not allow Survivor to do a Trade if Killer has many stacks. Did you think about it at all? I would bring back to 5% and it would be nice - also wouldn't lose stacks from M2 Attacks, but I would eliminate only one unfun aspect of this Perk - Camping. Killer can just go back to the hook - he doesn't need to camp. Let's say they have 20 seconds left to unhook - they can't do that, because STBFL will just completely destroy them for that.
Nemesis - Base Kit Changes I would make are very close to current version. Currently the Hindered Power isn't correct and it doesn't work at all. But if they would fix that - The Nemesis would become problematic topic, because 20% it's a massive slowdown and it would create two taps. So I would decrease it from 20% to 10% and slightly increase the duration or even don't touch it. About the Add-Ons - when I thought about it I think zoning Add-Ons isn't a good idea, but you said it's good idea, kinda weird haha. Other add-ons to be fair… I like. You get Mutation - you get very nice effect for some time.
About Corrupt - I made a change for Corrupt for Killers that have base kit part of Corrupt. The Nurse, The Hillbilly and The Blight would be able to use current, not changed Corrupted Intervention.
Surge - cooldown is just additional minor thing. Wouldn't make a huge impact. We can just remove it to be fair.
Windows - this perk totally turn off Survivor brains, so I would make it perk healthy for learning the game, but many people just can't play without it. Survivors should have knowledge where Pallets are or specific renders and one perk shouldn't completely fixing that in my opinion. Chasing weak Survivors with this Perk and Lithe is just the most boring chase ever…
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I wouldn't ignore these players, but I wouldn't balance the game around them and that's all.
Soloq : Topic problem at current Dead By Daylight - SOLO Q and you gonna say Solo Q has very interesting and good gameplay. Maybe you do, but 90% of people don't. And that's why I would help Solo Q a little bit and in the same time wouldn't overkill SWF-s.
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Weird mindset to be fair. Quick example - they added specific Anti Camp Feature only for Leatherface - so it also would be hurting Bubba Mains for existing? I just know that adding base kit Corrupt also for Killers like Nurse would detroy the idea of adding this feature.
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It's not a punishment, because 3-4 groups do not lose anything. They can do that using a few words on Voice Call.
Solo Q would be able to acutally cooperate a little bit more and it would help them. I do not steal something from SWF-s and give it to Solo Q - I just would make cheap copy from SWF and add it for Solo Q.
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Overall nice changes, but I definitely wouldn't go path excluding specific killers, or SWF from any changes.
Why exclude those killers from Corrupt change for example? They are going to end it by downing survivor way before time limit anyway.
I like aura reading around hook (I would change it you simply see anyone outside of your lobby).
I am not really fan of dropping pallet display, it's going to make protection hits so much easier...
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But what about the swf that are not on voice comms?
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"I am not really fan of dropping pallet display, it's going to make protection hits so much easier..."
That's why it would be aviable only for Solo Q - they don't have communaction and they usually can't take hits.
"Why exclude those killers from Corrupt change for example? They are going to end it by downing survivor way before time limit anyway."
These Killers are just too strong and it would be overkill I think and if people would hear that Nurse can get free Corrupt - this change would never come through… And these Killers just do not Corrupt as other Killers. Blight and Billy has moblity and Nurse is… a Nurse…
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To be fair it's a good point, but usually 4 Man without VC happens very rare. It usually happens on Streams from DBD where Streamer play with his viewers. Still 4 MAN without VC - they at least know their perks, they know how others play and they can adjust their gameplay.
We can remove the limits, but it would make real SWF-s less skillfull and more powerfull…
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Dont get me wronog, I think your idea is great, however, you see how hard this is to implement. Again, this is the hole BHVR dug themselbes. I dont think there is a real solution to the swf / soloq imbalance. Your idea is flawed as well, but the best ive seen in propably years.
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You say that Nurse, Hillbilly and Blight don't get to have corrupt intervention because they can traverse the map in seconds. I do not like this, because it is a slippery slope that would call into question on why certain killers are restricted and others are not.
I assume you posted those 3 killers because of their mobility. What about Dredge? He can travel across the map faster than all 3 of these killers, so much so that Lethal Pursuer means he can be in a chase within the first 20 seconds of the match.
Perks and game mechanics should be as generic and non specific as possible. They already removed old Tinkerer and added the special attack requirement, that is as far they should go. Singling out killers will just make people that play those killers feel like they have less options. Corrupt already deactivates if someone gets downed, that's as good to reducing the imbalance between killers as it can get.
Also the hinder change on infection for Nemesis feels a bit odd. We have not gotten to experience what the 20% hinder will feel like, since the Devs confirmed it is bugged and will be fixed in an upcoming patch. Might as well wait for that patch to come out before making changes to it.Post edited by ExcelSword on0 -
Dredge starts the Trial with cooldown on his Power 😂
Dredge can't down Survivors that quickly as Blight, Nurse or Billy. Nonsense Argument from your side.0 -
The cooldown is only 10 seconds, basically none at all. After that Dredge is the fastest killer in the game at traversing the map.
I assumed you wanted to have a civil conversation or discussion about this, but sure go ahead and laugh.
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Bubba didnt get any specific interactions with the system itself, only a tweak to his power.
Similar changes could be made to Nurse/Blight/etc like making their power start on cooldown.
And, obviously, if some design feature is bottlenecked by certain killers, you either dont add it or tweak those killers till they no longer bottleneck it. Or you just ignore them as exceptions - trickster/huntress/bubba with anticamp system who can proxy and guarantee downs just as easily.
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In my opinion your mindset was wrong and I just gave an example.
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I don't really ever see any Freddy's, Pigs, or Ghostfaces using Corrupt very often even more so with Onryo players. And I don't really see as many Singularities using it now with his new rework.
The Billy add-on I mentioned wasn't his charge speed add-on, it was his Thermal Casing add-on that you suggested to be changed so that it increases his movement speed while charging the chainsaw by 2.5% which, by nature, encourages back-revving.
Nurse is the strongest free killer in the game. She is slower than the survivors when it comes to her "running" speed meaning it is physically impossible to run after a survivor and you're suggesting a 12 second cool down to her power for missing which would force her to run after survivors. This would significantly lower her power level which would give other DLC killers the ability to pass her on power level. Also, no, Blight isn't a free killer because he's a DLC killer. There's base-game DLC and Licensed DLC and the only free killers are the ones that you start with upon playing the game for the first time which are Trapper, Wraith, Billy, and Nurse.
Spark Plug giving +12% charge speed would make the downside of Beast's Marks essentially non-existent and would make how fast his normal charge speed annoying for a lot of players.
The reason that Shadowborn change would be very unhealthy is because +10% Haste for 20 seconds means that the Haste would last significantly longer than any blind the survivors do to you and that much Haste on a killer is already strong enough to, essentially, guarantee a hit which would be fine on its on for the most part until you realize that there'd be a 30 second Exposed effect stacked on top of it meaning that it'd be, essentially, a guaranteed down for blinding the killer which would be making so many people upset.
Even at max stacks you can still get a save against a killer with STBFL because of the AFC system. I know this because I tested it when the new system first came out. By time the killer reaches them they've already filled up the unhook bar so hitting them won't even stop the unhook from happening meaning that both survivors will just run away. Plus, even if BHVR did this, they wouldn't have that part working during endgame where most of the face camping happens now because BHVR essentially made it clear that face camping is actually encouraged during end-game to "secure that final kill" as they said which is also why AFC disables during that time.
The Hindered on Nemesis was shown to not be problematic since everyone who played the PTB pretty much all agreed that it wasn't all that bad since you 1) took no damage for getting infected, 2) got a major speed boost for getting infected meaning that all the Hindered really did was reduce that speed boost's effectiveness, and 3) since there's only 4 vaccines(one for each person) that means that you're more than likely only ever gonna get this Hindered 1 maybe 2 times in the match.
With your changes you said that Nurse, Billy, and Blight wouldn't get the base-kit version of it nor the perk version of it. Also, regardless, you physically CAN NOT EXEMPT killers from using any teachable perk no matter how you feel about it as this goes against the fundamentals of "teachable perks."
As I said before, THEY ALREADY TRIED THAT with Windows and nobody liked that. The perk originally had a 60/50/40 second cool down and absolutely everybody hated it, then BHVR dropped it down to a 30/25/20 second cool down and everybody still hated it, then they removed the cool down altogether so everyone would stop complaining about it. The ONLY way I would change the perk is make it so that WoO only shows the auras of windows and the pallet aura part should, honestly, be transfered onto maps so people would actually have a reason to use maps.
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I'm not gonna respond once more - mostly I disagree. Spark Plug thing was very funny to read though 😅
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The problem is, everyone I have ever seen who supports WoO in its current state almost always also wants it basekit. Or some form of extra Survivor info basekit. The problem is, Survs are as he Devs said before never intended to have that much information basekit, it's designed to all be tradeoffs for running a perk in one of your four slots, or running an item such as a map or key. The rest is intended to be made up by teamwork and your own skill. So in other words, Survivor is supposed to be kinda hard, and all the decisions in the game thus far have basically made it that way. Survivors are simply not intended to have as much as Killers have, and not intended to have anything tilted in their favor except for numbers and perk/item synergy. That's why SWF is seen as stronger, especially with comms and especially if the players are good.
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To comment briefly on your statement @Azulra, you don't see Ghosties and Pigs use Corrupt because it a) betrays where they are, b) can be a liability to their stealth because it promotes people running right into them, a disaster for Ghostface in particular. I'm of the opinion it's overrated for all but a few Killers and on top of that it's just not a very good perk for Stealth Killers. I would rather run Lethal Pursuer to set up the first hit instead.
Post edited by GonnaBlameTheMovies on0 -
Oh, I completely understand this. I just wanted it to be clear that I was never suggesting that windows of opportunity be base kit because I do not believe that it should. I was just pointing out that the complaints about it are unfounded as it is meant to be a tool used with a perk slot. That’s all.
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That's fair, no hard feelings here. I agree a lot of the complaints about it hold little water, it's inoffensive when used the proper way, the problem is people use it to autopilot loops instead of to learn loops.
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survivors can clearly see the next pallet or vault they can get to if they simply pay attention. But for some reason they dont and instead choose Autopilot: The Perk. if the killer had to run around looking for gens the same way survivors do, the game would be unplayable on a lot of maps. especially leri's.
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There's a lot of obvious clues yes. The pallets are red and blue so are walls. The vaults have yellow cloth, like WoO's aura. Gens have a visual and sound tell, so do exit gate switches. Even the hook tells you how long you have been on it by Entity summoning progression AND progressively smaller skill checks. And you can tell where even Stealth Killers are by the crows, same as they can tell from you - Killers always set off crows even in Undetectable, and move grass and corn the same as Survs. There's so, so so so many tells in the game and yet, Survivors choose to ignore all of it in favor of Autopilot: The Perk.
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