Killer mains avoid the new Lights out Gamemode
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The last version the gens started at 1% though, which was solely to make it so survivors can find them. 5% means it is actually faster.
The problem with the mode is the game is balanced around killers having gen defense perks and survivors having anti-tunnel perks and this is a mode where the killer doesn't get them but the survivor does. Its super weird.
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if we should not care about balance then why did Devs and the majority of the player base make and want changes
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Nurse on lights out is hard. I like it.
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The had to change something i agree the head start and endurance and anti camp was great changes but the repair speed was overkiller reaction buff
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A limited time game mode doesn't have to be perfectly balanced.
But it has to have enough semblance of balance that people want to play it. Even the devs said they were surprised that people (survivors, largely) stopped playing the first iteration of lights out within a couple days, because the balance was so far off it simply wasn't enjoyable in any sense.
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It's same as regular stomp solos as killer and lose agains't swf. That mode is probably even more one sided in that direction given all information for solo players is almost removed. In swf you can communicate all that so swf are going to be even stronger in the mode.
For OP play other side too survivors got their perks removed as well.
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We will see. Personally, I still think the mode is not fun for either side, so even if they tried to improve one side, it does not matter that much IMO. Both Survivor and Killer is not fun in this mode.
The only reason I am playing it is because of the Tome. And once this is done, I will not play another game of this mode.
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This event is terrible for everyone. Please don't bring it back.
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and now its wildly unbalanced towards Survivors and now Killers will stop playing but i guess as long as its your side thriving right?
im not asking much just the repair speed buff gone so matches can last longer then 3 mins
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Generally speaking if the survival rate is around 40% on average. I think Lights Out has done a good job at keeping closer to that survival rate. The 20% repair boost to gens seems fair. If you take into account Killers technically have abilities. They get to keep their M2 but in exchange for no perks we get a boost to repairs. It's an eye for an eye ya feel meh. We don't get 'Window of Opportunity' but you get Dracula wolf-form and Doc spamming HAHAHAHAHA! AHHHH! lol.
I've gone through the whole Rift and I don't see a single challenge that says 'get four sacrifices in a single trial'. Pretty much all Killer challenges are straight forward and simple and I find it humorous that Killers feel they require a 3-4k average to feel they've won. I get there is no official win condition but I think the reason people care so much about SWF-Gen rushing is because it ruins their "win-condition".
What do you want? Do you as you play Killer believe you are entitled to get a 3-4k every other trial? This is why I find Killer mains to be pampered. How long for insta-blind flashlights(probably well deserved though lmao) or Dead Hard to be nerfed, hmm? In comparison to how long did it take to get an anti-face camping hook mechanic that rarely works cause Killers just proxy-camp now. I just see Killers getting a bit more love on average. Survivors are like the first born. They still get love but also receive more severe punishments. Then Killers are the youngest child that gets a talking to and then after get to have ice cream.
If you just play in accordance to your challenges you'll have way more fun. Stop worrying about 3-4k's/gen-rushing/flashlights… as Killer and just enjoy the trials. If you get one or two sacrifice that's a win in my book. Hence I don't see the issue with coordinated survivors having a higher ratio of escapes on average. It's a video game, we all just gotta turn off that ego and remember we all just wanna have some fun. 😎 Plus, I don't know about you but as a Killer I feel it's my responsibility to make the chases/trial in general fun for Survivors. Although I understand not everyone feels that way.
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I agree, considering killers that get "killer instinct" or have an alternative tracking method (Oni's blood orbs, Legion's KI with frenzie hits, Nemmy's Zombies, Doctor's shock radius) eat well in this mode, its going to be a little bit of a nightmare.
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i think issue is 20% repair bonus. that really wasn't needed.
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We are talking about Light's Out, not the base game right ? I agree that talking about balance in the base game is both interesting and important. As for you message.
Devs makes changes for us to enjoy the game and buy things so they can make dbd live another year and so on. They will not listen to "the community", they will listen to their teams, the "community" is just a decision making tool combined with some stats. Also, the "community" is not the forums, the forums are a tiny fraction of dedicated players. Talking about the forums, if you quickly scroll trough it, you will see that everyone complains all the time and that people are mostly against each others. Person A will say killer's OP, person B will say SWF's OP and so on and again.
I don't think people should care about balancing the game in a modifier, BHVR has been balancing the game for years and the complaining never stopped, we have a pretty balanced game right now and people are still very angry. We even got mmr to "balance" things out, great time.
Light's out is not meant to be balanced, it will be gone in 5 days or so, it's not even meant to be played 10 hours straight. It's a funny mode that replace the 4 stealth perks match people will do sometimes. It's not for everyone, but it has it's niche.
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If no one plays, then we probably won't get it back again… you might be onto something here.I think this is pretty accurate. If people don't play the mod after the second go around, when some of their other mods saw extremely positive reception, it would be very strange to waste developer time on it.
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Its region dependent. I find killer matches instantly but survivor matches take much longer for me to find.
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I use DEEPL because I am not good at English
If the Castlevania collaboration has candelabras for the survivors, I wanted a gimmick with bats, etc. on the killer side
*The bats chase wounded survivors for blood, and there are notifications at regular intervals, etc.I have no idea what the fun is in playing this mode on either side
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Same. It's a massacre every match I've played. I have no idea how people are finding this survivor sided.
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In my region (central EU), yesterday evening there was constant survivor bonus between 50% and 100%. So there's definitely enough killer players.
I also played a round as Alien, and had no issue defeating the survivor team.
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It's funny for Sadako specifically because the tape is a limited item and so are the candles so they can't carry both at the same time >:D
I got two condemn kills at zero hooks the first Onryo match I played.
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The US vs them is unnecessary, as are the attacks.
If you read my post again I refer generally to "players", and say that there needs to be a semblance of balance for players to want to play the mode. Which literally applies to survivors and killers.
The only reason I mention survivors at all is to help explain why the devs felt the buffs were needed for this iteration.
I feel like lights out is never going to work because the game doesn't function correctly without any perks at all. It's a failed experiment, and maybe the devs will scrap it after this run.
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just give us chaos shuffle and 2v8
Please BHVR we’re begging you
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And how would you feel if I flipped this on Survivor side?
Because that is what Killers were saying last Lights Out. Was it fair then? No. Is it fair in the other direction? No.
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This is easy mode for Killer, I'm just letting the last survivor go if they pet the dog.
Since it's so easy I figure I should give the survivors a fun, immersion experience by playing a bit of Xenomorph too
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us vs them when your wildly a bias them the gens buffs were unnecessary remove them
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I literally didn't say any of that.
Are you replying to the wrong person maybe?
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I wasn't there during the prior Lights out. Although I have heard people were not happy with it haha.
Still I don't see the issue with a boost to gen repairing. I find the majority of Killers complaining about gen-rushing simply were conditioned by lower mmr/skilled survivors. They were used to an easy 3-4k win. Then all of a sudden BAM! They meet a Survivor competent enough to give them a run for their money. Now they complain because they chased a 'single' Survivor for a 5 minutes and got gen-rushed.
I've never been gen rushed in my entire Killer career. If you don't tunnel/face-proxy camp hook/etc… and apply pressure where it needs to be by playing smart. There is no reason why you can't win against more competent players. edit Mind you I don't play Killer very often nowadays so maybe one day I'll get gen rushed lol.
If I can consistently get back to back 3-4k wins with Skull Merchant(M1-only). Then players have no excuse. Why SM? Cause "Fire Moon CEO" plus mori equals badass. I mean I legit just played a match to for the sake of this. Ash got hatch cause it's Ash lol. Part way through they just gave up and let me mori them. They had 2 gens left. I mori'd Bill in front of Ash while he was still on hook hehe.
POST-EDIT I'm not saying Killers should get 3-4k in higher tier lobbies(this was probably around mid mmr). Although there is no reason why a Killer can't average a 2-3k in higher mmr matches. Unless you are being reckless and chasing too much. You should be able to get at least 2k. Especially if you don't spread hooks out like me.
Perks below but I'll name them for those unfamiliar:
Beast of Prey, Distressing, Sloppy Butcher, Deerstalker. (Sloppy Butcher is meant to add pressure but sometimes I don't run it)
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I don’t get what killers should have against this gamemode. I won most times with dried and doctor. I struggled a bit with nemesis, but there I played really bad. Overall my killer experience was great and very relaxing and as survivor it was one time good one time bad.
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This! Even for Survivors it can be pretty challenging but I think it's more that this mode is not everyone's cup of tea. I can vouch that I am not the biggest fan of this mode; Despite enjoying the theme of it. Although I don't think it means the mode is bad.
Lights Out sorta reminds me of Ruthless mode in PoE for those who know. It's a bit more hardcore but it leans towards those who want to add extra difficulty as Survivor. Maybe those Killers who want to meme around and get into that Myers cosplay, ya know.
If anything I feel Lights Out is the closest DBD has gotten to 'Movie-isk' level of horror. Survivors are tripping over things(running into everything) just like the movies. The Killer has no terror radius and just appears out of nowhere… like the movies. Everything feels dark and shrouded like the… Although not everyone wants the movie experience cause we don't get the same "plot-armour" level.
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Respectfully, you're playing Skurchent in Lights Out. A Killer with easy basekit tracking, mobility, stealth… gosh, everything. I'm not sure you get to say the genrush buff is okay, you're playing the 3Gen and info queen. Of course it doesn't matter to you and you've "never been genrushed in your entire Killer career". You're playing as the Skull Merchant. If people can't do the gens to start with, then they just give up because you are the Skull Merchant.
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I definitely still enjoy the mode, liked it both sides the first time. I just think that the 20% wasn't really needed, just like halve it. Or give Killers a bit more info because some Killers have none and they functionally can't really play this mode.
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Ya 10% boost wouldn't be bad. You'd basically be giving Survivors the Resilience perk; I think that's fair. Add the fact that many Survivors opt to do gens together it'd be well utilised.
My only concern with giving more intel so 'some' Killers can do better. Is that would immediately be abused by the Killers that accel in this mode.
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I don't know how you got me playing SM equalled 3 genning and DRONES. When I specifically specified M1-only with NO-DRONE-USE. I don't know what to tell ya. I made it abundantly clear I use M1 only. I don't know how you misread me playing SM for that other stuff lol.
Also I wasn't playing SM in Lights Out. I've only played Dracula in Lights Out and I refuse to use wolf form because I don't like the sense of being able to track Survivors. I personally find it cheap and ruins the theme of Lights Out. Those images were just from a normal trial.
Simply was making a point on how playing smart even with M1 can easily net you a 3-4k win. That Killers complain way to much about gen-rushing. Plus my Killer main when I played Killer more exclusively was Huntress/Nurse. I've only recently been playing SM; Solely because I love her Mori. Although I understand how much her drones are hated, so I strictly use M1. I've never used Drones for anti-looping, gen holding nor for basic gameplay. So, I don't know where you got me abusing her power from.
Also, sometimes Survivors give up regardless of me only playing M1 on SM. I mean you saw my perks right. I am at a massive disadvantage here lol. No gen regress or perma-exposed kind of stuff. Just my M1 and me.
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Killer main here, and this mode is quite in favor of the killer save except for maybe comp teams. No terror radius and muffled sounds, I played as a survivor and didn't hear Nemesis boot stomps until he was in range of a tentacle strike. This mode gives all killers a free cheeky hit from the shadows. Survivors who for whatever reason still carrying a Candelabra = free tracking through walls. Hell when you jump upon a survivor, they literally pick a direction and pray to the tile gods that there's a window or pallet in the direction they're going. In fact the most frustrating thing about this game mode for killers is when survivors hide at the perimeter of the map and don't touch gens, it's much harder to find them within all that darkness AND screw all Claudette players who wear all her darkest outfits. Also probably the most beneficial part of the game mode, NO PERKS, no exhaustion perks, no supped up healing combos (referring to when Buckle for the People was a thing). At the end of the trial no one can complain about crutch perks carrying anyone.
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Just curious cause I love reading over the devs comments on all the new things they are trying, where did they say that about lights out?
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Also, made a seperate post about this, but the hooks are WAY more spread out than usual.
Makes it difficult to hook. I guess the strategy is to slug and 3 gen, you don't have agency otherwise in this.
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IIRC it was an interview Mathieu Cote did a few months back. He said they were surprised by how fast most players went back to regular mode after trying Lights Out the first time
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Only played for the tome rewards. Tried both sides. Being a killer main I instantly found it pretty bad and boring so I did the survivor tome side only (begrudgingly). Tome rewards done, won't be doing lights out again as either side.
It's a good idea in principle, definitely adds more suspense as survivor, sitting on a gen not knowing where, when, or if the killer is going to sneak up on you. But I found it too repetitive always going Vs Dracula or ghost face and gens just fly if people actually work them.
Shame really because I was looking forward to that horror aspect of dbd back the way it used to be before killers became a joke for survivors to literally run circles around.
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I agree the Survivor Rift is a bit more chill to do.
Although, I don't know what matches you are playing. Majority of my trials end at 2-3 gens on average. Killers have become so aggressive and run the dirtiest/sweatiest builds. I came across an Oni with this build that made every skill check the tiniest thing. The speed at which skill checks went was fast! He didn't even do hit and run. This man was getting his power in a couple minutes, maybe faster. This man was using the 180 spins and abusing every mechanic he could in the game. Easily someone with many hours in the game but it genuinely was the most toxic build I've ever faced against a Killer. That's saying something cause every other match I face are pretty much perma exposed and gen regression builds lol.
Us Survivors barely had a chance to loop. Yet you are saying Killers are jokes that easily get looped. Majority of the Survivor community are not that good. If you are facing competent Survivors then you have been winning your Killer matches with flying colours and now you are facing a genuine challenge. My advice, adapt cause they did and that's why they are better. You are probably stubbornly playing how you want to play expecting a win or not to get countered. You have to be willing to adapt to the Survivors or else you will be slamming your head into a brick wall.
My recommendation is check out the mmr system and what is constituted as a win. Then create your own 'win-condition' around that. If you don't want to climb the proverbial sweat ladder. Then I believe a 2k is considered a draw and 0-1 lowers mmr, and 3-4k increases mmr. If you are facing tougher opponents but are not enjoying it. Make a meme/fun build that is more of a handicap to you. Then go in and have fun without expecting to win. Over time you'll lower your mmr to a point where you'll have more fun regardless of builds.
POST-EDIT: I was in a similar head space as you on both sides. I still sometimes get frustrated but after checking out what the win conditions are I've found it much easier to enjoy my matches. It's easy to get frustrated when Survivors are looping you constantly and then when you finally get the down… the other blinds you and gets the save; I get it. Although, you either love it or hate it. I've grown to love the flashlight saves as Killer. It gets me going and gets the adrenaline going like, "OH hehe! You want to play like that come here you little…" but I'm laughing and having a good time during these moments. Gotta respect Survivors that care enough to save their teammates. When you play enough Survivor you begin to appreciate the others that put themselves in the line of fire to make sure you get to enjoy the match for as long as possible. Cause I've had teammates who just crouch walk around the map while I die on hook lol. So I respect good survivors because they generally are playing as a team. It's actually really cool to see people take protection hits because they actually care enough to help out another 'random' survivor they don't know.
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Just to clarify I have adapted, I get 3/4k very regularly by going anti loopers and tombstone Myers. I counter and tunnel out the loopers asap and usually win (usually followed by angry rants of survivors post game). When I say killers became a joke I refer to the concept in general that survivors don't feel threatened, they feel safe to the point they confidently try to loop all the time. Lights out does bring that feeling of dread and gives killers that threatening edge they have been missing imo. To me, killers should be a threat and something survivors avoid but as time has gone on people just don't have the same level of dread for the killer as they used to.
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This is because the Devs believe the game is a fun intense horror chase experience but the community has decided it's a comp sweat fest.The Devs and anyone who likes to play casually is correct, but the community definitely believes they are more correct than the vast majority who play casually including the Devs. It's 100% an entitlement thing, because the community as a whole has an entitlement issue AND a sportsmanship issue. A bad one.
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I get what you mean now. My personal take is you become desensitised after awhile. When I first played DBD it was straight up a horror game but now I don't get that same adrenaline rush. Although, I blame Killers a bit for this as well. With how prevalent and effective tunnelling can be early on. I think Survivors have become numb or tired. There are moments where call it bad RNG but I've had Myers follow me from one side of the map back over to the other side a couple times in a row. Simply because he is thirsty for the hook. When you hear that high pitched DA DA DA DA DA! for long periods of time. It loses it's charm.
Please understand that I've blocked the Killer number of times and in some cases the Killer doesn't even hit me. They just finally go around me so that they can continue chasing that one Survivor. Sometimes I try and take chase for someone on death hook early into the match but rarely does that work. The Killer is so focused on optimising their chance of winning, they have to tunnel one out early to secure the 4k.
BUT I get the looping part. Yet that's one of the few things that is fun in DBD. A good chase with looping mixed with alternating loops. What am I supposed to do? Hold 'w'. I still go down after a bit, rarely do I escape. I don't even run DS, OTR, DH… I legit don't even own DS and OTR(I know Killers don't find them fun). As for DH it's not even unlocked for other Survivors and I don't play David. Part of the fun for me is making quirky builds. I made a flashlight build that basically upgraded my flashlight every time I stunned the Killer with Exultation. Although I stopped that despite it being fun cause umm well I deserved getting hooked in those trials lmao. It's fun cause you go in with a brown/yellow item(doesn't have to be a flashlight) and basically use the Killer to upgrade your items for free. Being that you get a lot of brown items it's a nice little side challenge in the match.
I have to make little fun challenges like this because ma dude, after awhile the jumpscare Myers and Ghostfaces and having a sweaty Xenomorph chase you just numbs you from that horror aspect. Eventually you need to find alternative ways to derive entertainment from the game. This is a game after all and we are all supposed to have fun for a few hours before re-joining our real life. Mind you if some of these players (Survivor/Killer) were to be as competitive/sweaty-try-hard as they are in-game, in real life. Without a doubt people would either be financially well off or millionaires lmao.
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I find Killer on this mode to be quite relaxing. Survivor on the other hand.. not so much.
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Super easy especially with Onryo.
Onryo can literally proxy her gens and teleport to nearby gens, doing a hit and run strat. I've went against one Onryo and multiple Bubba's and it takes a lot of coordination to complete it as it's super easy to go through your gens one by one by preventing generator progress speed.
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Oooh, that's super nasty. 😂 I didn't even think of the tapes and the candelabra not being held at the same time.
Because killers have been monitoring their gens, I kinda just drop my candalabra near a gen I'm working on to keep tabs on what gen I was working on in case I get chased off of it, but I haven't really enjoyed the gamemode. I guess I do enjoy the thrill of constantly being on edge and excessively looking around to prevent being grabbed off a gen, but everything else nah.
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Haha, I met a girl yesterday who proactively tries to pet the doggy in wolf form and each time just is her getting downed. She did it every time we went against a Drac in the game mode, but I'm glad you're finding the small wins for sure.
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I played a few times as Sadako without an issue but I agree with the OG post. Besides - lights out just isn’t for me. I wouldn’t be sad if it disappeared forever.
Bring back my 2v8 and now we’re talking! I got to play with old friends that took a long break from Dbd so it was nice to catch up again.
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Surprisingly enough, people still don't understand what the "official" win-conditions are for both sides. This just adds to the entitlement as you said.
I've read over and over again that people feel 3k is a tie and 4k is a win. Yet the wiki clearly states what it means to win/tie/lose. I've taken a screenshot for those who want a reference. Yet, it still feels like the community at large still follows old ways and if the Killer doesn't get a 4k then it's a loss(not everyone thinks this way).
I agree that the player base on both sides are a bit entitled. Although BHVR should of clarified from the start what the win-condition really was. They technically have but very little awareness is brought to it. How many games do you see the Killer slug the last two Survivors because they "feel they have to" otherwise they lost. When in reality the moment they got the 3k they won! Many view the hatch as a win but in reality giving hatch or losing a Survivor to hatch does nothing for that Survivor. It legitimately is neutral (a draw) for that Survivor. Yet Killers will feel like they lost to hatch and Survivors feel they "won". When in reality they didn't win or lose.
If Killer-mains were conditioned to know 3k is automatically a victory. Maybe just maybe they wouldn't feel they needed to sweat as hard for the 4k. Ya know what I mean… I mainly spoke of Killers but only cause Survivors are just weird lmao. There are so many win-conditions in Survivors I could right a whole post on it!
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Even worse - there are people who think ONLY A TEAM ESCAPE as Survivor is a win. And too many people care too much about gaining and losing MMR, which doesn't even give you anything for gaining it or punish you for losing it. All you "win" are sweatier opponents, rising in MMR in this game is deadass never worth it.
The wincons for MMR aside, judging wins by MMR gain and loss is a stupid, stupid thing and we all need to get off the MMR gain/loss copium yesterday. Just play the damn game and be happy with your results.
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funny enough my games as killer on this gamemode are so EASY even with this basekit buffs for survivors; meanwhile as survivor my team still get totally destroyed in the first 2 minutes with barely 1 or 2 gens done (often by myself).
basekit: stealth , not worrying about perks , solo q survivors can barely work as a team due to the lack of information going on.
it makes some killers that rely on the hit and run playstyle insanely good and map mobility killer soo opressive.
what else do you need? like really, this mode is just killer sided to me if u think otherwise, u maybe are just bad honestly.
not sure if MMR is active on this gamemode but holy ….teammates aren't great lately… for me atleast idk about the rest.
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MMR is active, you just don't gain or lose it. The Devs have stated this to be true about modes multiple times. Ironically it means there's more breathing room, because you're less likely to be paired outside your league for winning/losing too much if that happens.
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