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Why do people believe bloodlust should be removed?
I've seen a lot of bad takes from Survivor mains, but I recently stumbled across a YouTube short where the comments were filled with people complaining about how "unfair" Bloodlust is. Correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not), but isn't that the point, considering Dead by Daylight is an asymmetrical horror game?
Comments
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its a field where some survivors miss when dbd never had bloodlust, then a side where they wish they experienced no bloodlust dbd. Bloodlust is very healthy for the game and it actually feels good and fun when you’re looping a bloodlusting killer imo.
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At tiers 2 and 3, all it does is reward killers who are playing poorly. There are some instances where BL can be a necessary mechanic, but tier 1 alone achieves this.
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I’m not someone who thinks Bloodlust should be removed, I’ve never really given it much thought to be honest, but I imagine those who do are saying it in retaliation to the slew of changes to maps over the last few years. BL was initially included to help killers close the gap when survivors were successfully looping or evading chase. But the maps are now becoming much smaller, pallets have been almost universally nerfed and loops have been made much less safe. Add all that together and some people may feel the reason BL was included is no longer applicable and gives killers too much of an edge. Just surmising.
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Bloodlust is a bandaid fix to infinites.
Now that those don't exist, they can remove the bandaid. Wound healed.
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depending on map and pallet placements it can be needed, playing Freddy you have only your teleports and snares (which do little to nothing) so it can be hard on maps like the game where you get pallet smacked and ran around.
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Gens already pop pretty quick, so quick that many people are forced to use regress perks or tunnel/slug (no time to spread the hooks). Removing bloodlust would make it even harder to catch people which would further increase the need for regress and further push the tunneling/slugging thing that the survivors seem to hate. At some point survivors should pick a lane, they either don't mind the tunneling play style or they want it to change. If they want it to change then it's probably best to not give killers any more reason to than they already do. If they don't want it to change then what's all the crying been about when killers use these tactics?
Also many killers don't like going in a circle scooby doo style, it's not fun, it's highly repetitive and requires very little skill (I know survivors like to think it's skillful but it's really not, I know how easy it is and how little skill is involved I done it for 2 years)
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Not only that tho…
Bloodlust helping low-tier killers with unfair map rng. It's some sort of a band-aid to fight off with a things that out of killer player's control.
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It was meant as a temporary counter play solution to infinite loops, which no longer exist.
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Pathing as a survivor is significantly easier, and since DBD is an asymmetrical 1v4 game, it’s not supposed to be fair by nature. Otherwise, the game wouldn’t make sense. Despite what you see in every Probzz video, you’re not meant to loop a killer all game and escape. As a killer, you need to hook each survivor three times (or get them to progress to the third state). That’s 12 hooks and, at the very least, 12 chases. Typically, you must hit a survivor twice to put them in the dying state before you can hook them. All of this consumes valuable time. Bloodlust is intended to mitigate the time it takes to down a survivor just once.
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A killer is holding W and pathing incredibly poorly if they're hitting bloodlust 2 and 3. Bloodlust 2 and 3 is a conscious decision for a good killer player where they want to force a hit on an otherwise safe tile. Good killers are only using it for zoning. If someone is hitting 2 and 3 consistently, there is something very wrong with their gameplay.
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Bloodlost 2 and 3 are there to make sure that no situation is 100% safe. In most cases it means throwing if the killer goes for a BL3, but if they want to, why do you get angry at this? Its also a kinda training wheels for the smollest of starter killers, who might never get a hit at certain survivors otherwise.
But back to OP: you got all the answers you will ever need in this thread. A lot of people are just opposed to the idea that a killer should eventually get the survivors, to kinda put a hard limit on looping, regularly citing some outdated ideas that it was originally intended as a bandaid, so it should never be allowed to stay in the game beyond that time.
But it turned out that BL is quite the good mechanic, and of all the other stuff in the game, camping, tunneling, bleeding out, etc. Bloodlust is probably the least problematic aspect by a long mile! But still, people will fight tooth and nail insisting that it should go away yesterday.
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So, by extension of your logic, then why would it matter? If BL is only beneficial to incredibly bad killers, then why remove a beginner friendly mechanic that welcomes new-players to the game? Doesn't even seem like YOU know why you're arguing against it.
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I don't have an opinion either way, but the reason i usually see is that bloodlust was introduced as an answer to infinite loops, which no longer exist anymore
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People forget that the killer is intended to eventually catch survivors. Bloodlust exists so situations where survivors are uncatchable don't exist.
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Because the loops are getting mindless
The new Coldwind loop is a joke
Bloodlust is a mechanic to address "infinites"
They just need to stop making loops that does nothing to survivors
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Does anyone else get a little annoyed when they hit BL2 sometimes? Like this sort of "back up man, I don't need your help!" kinda thing?
There have been times when I'm playing Pig, have all the pressure I want and there is particular survivor I know I must catch now due to head trap pressure and alike. I've hit BL2 just cause of y'know... pallet stun into hold W can sometimes take a long time to catch back up... and I've corned the survivor at a tile and I'm happily playing the mind games, and BL2 procs and I'm like "God damn it, now I just walk them down...".
It's like I can't play the mind game anymore cause I'm moving at BL2 speed, the mind is won almost no matter what I do, but the tile is bad for an ambush... but its also a weak pallet I don't wanna break to allow them to run to another tile.
It's rare I do hit BL2, and there are times really can't help hitting it against uber survivors who just follow checkspots perfectly and don't ever fall for any mind games, where tbh I don't feel too bad about hitting BL2...
But more often than not when I hit BL2 I'm thinking in my mind "Aaawwww man... I don't want BL2! Get this crap off me!"
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At least Bloodlust 2 and 3 should be removed. I see it more and more that Killers just Bloodlust loops which they should not Bloodlust. They dont try to mindgame them and they dont break the Pallet either. (Not talking about something like Shack or Jungle Gyms here)
And this is just boring and way too effective, since you dont get as punished for that as it was a few years ago.
EDIT: I also think that whiffing should remove Bloodlust. If the Killer is so bad that they miss a few times, they should not be rewarded by getting faster.
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They dont.
Seriously generated bot rage accounts on this forum need to have some sort of verification process.
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Because loops are becoming a joke and BL tier 2 and 3 reward killer for playing poorly, it's literally a scummy hand-holding mechanic now.
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And ended up being a simple and elegant equaliser for low-mobility/non-chase killers.
Removing bloodlust now would see those killers struggle even more, and force us back into a Nurse/Blight/Wesker meta.
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The game can decide to whiff for you thanks to aim dressing, completely out of your control.
At most missed attacks could have a slightly longer cooldown (like 0.4 seconds), but removing Bloodlust is way to much of penalty for something you can't control.
BL 2 and 3 could comfortably go back to being 30 and 45 seconds respectively though.
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Well said, friend.
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Because it doesn't feel good to be "outplayed" by it. If I'm running the tile correctly and you're running it incorrectly, or missing your power, or losing every 50/50, you shouldn't down me. Tiers 2 and 3 are not needed in modern DbD.
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i don't like it for few reasons. the first one is i dislike that bloodlust forces you to drop pallets, it justify god loops an god pallets being in the game which are not healthy mechanics. the second reason i dislike it is that it punishes survivor for greeding, aka if your good at survivor, bloodlust is actively detrimental to you but if your bad survivor than bloodlust has no impact. Being punished for being good is bad. Last reason is that I dislike that bloodlust is based off time. it makes gen defence == extra bloodlust time which promotes tunneling. a gameplay tactic that should not rewarded. the game should promote going after multiple survivors. not bloodlust 1 survivor to death.
bloodlust should be designed for like emergency situations for like infinity loop as last resort type mechanic. that is what mechanic was originally invented for.
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If they're missing their power then they're not getting BL anyway because using their power cancels it.
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Being punished for being good is bad.
So, you want Killers to be punished for playing Killers instead. Got it.
It's funny how people get countless perks that give them Haste, second chance perks, medkit add-ons, but God forbid Killers don't just sit there without any other way to play, but get looped into oblivion.
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You are comparing things you have to bring with a mechanic you get for free.
And to be honest, Bloodlust Tier 2 and 3 are obsolete. Because you have either mindgameable Loops, which the Killer should be able to play without just forcing Bloodlust OR Loops which need a Pallet to be kicked, which removes Bloodlust anyway.
But what we currently have is a lot of weak, mindgameable Loops which are just bruteforced by the Killer without any mindgames, because they can and it is beneficial for them.
Post edited by Aven_Fallen on3 -
BL is used for high-mobility/chase killers too that makes them even stronger.
What about these?0 -
No it's not. Bloodlust is literally worse than just using their power.
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It is used by strong Killers as well. Just not the ones which are good at the game.
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And to be honest, Bloodlust Tier 2 and 3 are obsolete. Because you have either mindgameable Loops, which the Killer should be able to play without just forcing Bloodlust OR Loops which need a Pallet to be kicked, which removes Bloodlust anyway.
Bloodlust was added specifically because there were loops that allowed survivors to safely waste Killers' time and essentially leave them helpless to do anything. And given how maps like Eyrie of Crows, Garden of Joy, and The Game are loved by survivors and bully squads, these loops still exist and exploited like there is no tomorrow.
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No, those Loops dont exist. Dont pretend that a mechanic which was implemented 7 years ago is still justified today.
But dont worry, the Devs somewhat recently buffed it, it is not going anytime soon. So you dont need to mindgame or break Pallets at unsafe Loops.
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If they didn't exist, there wouldn't be such term as a "survivor-sided map". But there is. There are maps that are extremely safe for Survivors — and they are perfectly aware of it. So to suggest that Killers should be slowed down while Survivors get to keep all their Haste perks is kinda odd.
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If you have a safe structure nowadays, the Killer breaks the Pallet. So Bloodlust does not even apply here.
Yet, if you have an unsafe Loop, the Killer can either try to mindgame or still break the Pallet. But this is also not the case because Bloodlust exists. It is extremely cheap.
Bloodlust was introduced because back in the day we had actual infinites. Structures, where Killers cannot gain any distance anymore. And those just dont exist anymore and if you think they exist, then you are not good at the game, sorry.
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Well, if you're the one who can't win against the Killer with Bloodlust despite all the opportunities you have as a survivor, maybe you're not as great at the game as you pretend to be :)
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How exactly do you want to avoid getting hit if the Killer decides to neither mindgame (which might give some distance if you play it well as Survivor) nor breaks the Pallet (which will give you distance), but instead decides to just follow you, because they know that they will have a guaranteed hit in a few seconds?
I mean, I see that you are trying to mimic my point, but it just does not work this way, lol.
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By doing your own mindgames and knowing the map? A good survivor wouldn't be asking that question, really.
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Sadly Bloodlust makes Mindgames from Survivors obsolete.
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Using Bloodlust means you're not using your power.
Using bloodlust means you're playing an M1 non-chase killer, whichever killer that happens to be.
Using Bloodlust as Blight? You're not using your power, therefore you're a non-chase killer. And you're still playing worse than if you used Blights power.
Bloodlust is not an issue, it is the last resort and the least effective way to play killer. Waiting 35 seconds until you have a chance to hit the survivor you're chasing is already going to lose you the game.
You're complaining that you can't run a killer indefinitely, which the game is not designed to allow you to do. Survivor resources are supposed to be finite, the killer is supposed to catch you eventually, because it's an asymmetrical game. You are not supposed to with a 1v1 scenario under normal circumstances. Doing so is supposed to require additional resources, perks and/or teamwork.
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No, I am not complaining about that. Nice Strawman.
The problem with Bloodlust is that at this point in the game, it is either not used (strong Loops) or used with not being needed (weak Loops). How you translate this into "you are complaining you cannot run a Killer indefinitely" is funny. Shows that there are not really arguments.
And yes, there are Killer players who prefer bloodlusting over using their power. And it is super-boring to play against them.
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How are you not arguing that when the use of bloodlust 2 or 3 means you've already had a long chase? You've already used pallets, or at least you should have. You're not getting outplayed by bloodlust, ever. If bloodlust is in effect you're already winning and gens are popping.
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Bloodlust needs a rework like: Each time you break a pallet, breakable wall, damage gen or vault window you gain bloodlust I for 10-12 seconds and that's it, there is no point in having tier 2 and 3
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Missing M1s*. I should probably edit the post, but it's an important distinction. Power cancels bloodlust, missing a basic attack does not
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So are you saying Nurse Blight and Wesker don't need bloodlust?
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But what we currently have is a lot of weak, mindgameable Loops which are just bruteforced by the Killer without any mindgames, because they can and it is beneficial for them.
To be fair, this is has more to do with map design being horrible ever since the Realm Beyond, rather than Bloodlust being in the game.
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The original purpose of Bloodlust was to aid in dealing with the infinite loops situation the game had back then. Some survivors try saying that it's bad because it "rewards the killer for playing bad" even though survivors have either had or still have perks that reward them for the same exact reason of "playing bad" because of examples like both old MFT and even current Resilience where the survivors are actively buffed by the perks for being simply injured which means that they have to get hit therefor rewarding them from the killer's efforts.
Also Bloodlust is still very much needed due to 1) there's still a fair few of M1 killers in the game and physically need Bloodlust to help them counter some loops such as Ghostface, Myers, Trapper, Plague(yes, Plague, because she can rarely get her Corrupt Purge and therefore is restricted to M1 most of the time), etc and 2) as I mentioned with the original purpose of Bloodlust, there's still some infinite loops in the game that killers physically can't counter without Bloodlust such as the fence vault directly in front of the school on Badham and removing Bloodlust would result in a lot of survivors bringing offerings to these kinds of maps for that specific reason.
The point is that Bloodlust is still a much needed gameplay mechanic and, on top of that, survivors should be careful of what they say about it because, if BHVR were to take their side in the argument and remove Bloodlust(which they won't) that means that killers could use the EXACT same argument to get more survivor perks nerfed.
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Saw a video recently where a survivor kept complaining about bloodlust anytime he got hit. The killer had rapid brutality, so there was 0 bloodlust that match...
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Any killer that is using their power in chase, is not using bloodlust anyway. It is a non-issue.
That's precisely why Bloodlust is a good and healthy mechanic, it works where it's needed, it doesn't work where it's redundant, it's self limiting.
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Missing M1s*. I should probably edit the post, but it's an important distinction. Power cancels bloodlust, missing a basic attack does not
Which is a good thing because aim assist can make you miss M1s you shouldn't have.
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Can you please send a link, we'd like to see a good laugh
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