Exit gates need to be blocked for 15 seconds after closing hatch to prevent hatch stand off

The solution is to avoid the killer's ability to body block the hatch. Enable the survivor to sneak up quickly and go through from behind/etc. If the killer has an issue with it then they should have just shut the hatch when they found it.

You're still contradicting yourself. You keep mentioning that this change would "make it easier for killers, who are trying to make the survivor give up". This change only benefits killers when they close hatch. By saying that this change would make things easier for killers sitting on hatch, you are admitting that these killers would close hatch and hence benefit from the change.

But you clearly want to benefit from the change by closing the hatch.  The "sitting on gate" strategy is the only viable strategy that Survivors have left, and you're wanting to take that away from them and leave them with no strategy at all, thus guaranteeing the 4k.

Seriously, you're starting to sound like that one guy who constantly complains about losing their only kill due to the 4% self-unhook or Deliverance, announcing every time it happens to them and begging to get rid of 4% and self-unhook perks in endgame.

I literally linked a clip in which closing hatch = escape. The survivor was waiting at the exit gate to instantly open the gate as hatch is closed. Without mobility, the killer cannot reach the survivor in time to stop them openning the gate. Therefore, close hatch = escape. In the clip, the only counter play was waiting on the hatch until the survivor gives up.

Ok let us be clearer then: Closing hatch =/= automatic survivor escape followed by the rest of that list.

Also the guy in the clip was getting stuck on smiling rocks and bamboo…is that the standard you want to go by? We also don't see the survivors perks in the clip, we're they running the only 2 things that actually speed up the gate (not that they woulda needed it if they kept that kinda pathing)? We can't see.

Yes. As long as both sides have equal power to end the hatch stand off, both sides are equally at fault. You keep thinking the killer is more at fault, which is incorrect.

You apparently conveniently forget that the killer can close hatch when they find it. What is equal power to you as this doesn't seem equal to us. The survivor has some blame sure, but for us the majority falls on the killer's shoulders because they can end any hatch stand off as soon as they find it. You claim we're incorrect, how so?

Same as the current hatch stand off. One side has to accept an escape or death for it to end.

Incorrect, one side can close a route and force an RNG based….round? Unsure of the proper word, but no its not the same. Neither side is in a stalemate to lose.

I have no idea what you are talking about but if you did gens, that would be in the killer's favour. In that scenario, I would close hatch and immediately run to the completed gen. As a survivor, doing gens is strictly worse than waiting as a completed gen would reveal your location. Also, I would no longer need to afk on the hatch since I know the survivor is not waiting at the exit gate to open it instantly.

Surprisingly your helping our point. You closed the hatch. Now we, who have left that gen that was away from everything, can play the door game. Now we, who may have sole survivor/ wake up will instantly open those doors when given the chance. Or if a key is in play via survivor or box we can do so. Doing a gen in that scenario works in our favor as survivor as you've proven by running to that popped gen.

The biggest reason is that if the killer found hatch, they should be rewarded for it. When a survivor finds hatch, they get an escape. When a killer finds hatch, they get nothing. There is a massive disparity between killer and survivor for hatch. Killers should be rewarded for finding hatch to make it even.

Also, I don't know why people keep thinking this is a massive buff for killers. This change would literally not matter for most games and would probably only increase the kill rate by 0.1%. In almost every game, survivors start openning the gate in the last 50% of the end game timer. The gates would be unblocked by then, so the gates being blocked initially would have 0 impact. I already explained this in my pos

Their reward is denying an escape route for survivors. You want more of a reward, we ask why? There's 1 survivor left, either the rest have escaped or died, and you've denied one exit they can use.

Also, the survivor is equally at fault. When the survivor hides, they are forcing the killer into giving up and closing hatch.

Thats not the killer giving up, thats them progressing the game 😔[theres no "face palm" emoji…sad days]

No, and that doesn't matter. It's a problem when they are abusing the strategy. It's impossible to know whether they are using the strategy or not, which is why it's hard to counter it.

If we're talking about abusing strategies, its gonna have to wait in line behind tunneling, which is hard to counter despite being obvious most times. Secondly it does matter as your whole issue is this strategy and they can't do both. Its on you as killer to try and figure out what your prey is doing.

False. My suggestion still leaves things to chance. My suggestion just prevents survivors from abusing the instant door open strat. Survivors still have a chance to open the door normally i.e. play the game normally instead of cheesing for the escape. I'm not against chance. I'm against a strategy that heavily favours survivors. The odds are like 80% in favour of survivor when using the strategy.

When the hatch spawns between both doors is it in the survivors favor? When the doors are close together or playing the map Midwich, is it in the survivors favor? When its a wide open map like the rotten fields, is it in their favor? Lets ask this, is camping to eek out a kill at end game cheesing a kill? [We'll even give you the answers as to what happens: yes = hypocrisy, no = theres no problem with survivors sitting at gates waiting for their best shot at escaping, Taking pieces of it = an effective answer of "yes"]

As long as you aren't fine with removing base kit Borrowed Time, you can't tell me to run No Way Out instead of patching hatch stand offs. There will always be a flaw in your argument, which you should run Borrowed Time or Off The Record instead of having it base kit.

We don't give much a damn about base kit bt, go for it. Others are going to complain, and probably with good reasons, but we 3 personally don't care. You should run whatever you think will help you best, for us thats running whatever gimmick build we have and getting better, but everyones different. So we repeat, run No Way Out.

It's RNG, but it's a problem when it occurs. The old hatch stand off was RNG too. Both survivor and killer running to the hatch at the exact same time is complete RNG. Old hatch stand off was patched out despite it being RNG, so the current hatch stand off should be patched out too.

Didn't you just say you weren't against chance just abit ago? Old hatch stand offs, as we've previously said, were removed because people would sit there for long times. This was because killer could grab the survivor out, but couldn't close it, while if the survivor got hit next to it, they escape during the wipe animation. Neither side backed down so the devs added a way for this to not happen via giving the killer a way to end it by closing the hatch. RNG aint a problem here despite you flip-flopping (not the perk) on it.

I'm not against playing for doors when it's fair, but if it's heavily in favour of survivor, I would rather sit on hatch. This change is intended to make exit gates fairer by eliminating a cheese strategy.

You're still contradicting yourself. You keep mentioning that this change would "make it easier for killers, who are trying to make the survivor give up". This change only benefits killers when they close hatch. By saying that this change would make things easier for killers sitting on hatch, you are admitting that these killers would close hatch and hence benefit from the change.

Ohh its fair. The killer has opportunities to look at the doors before closing the hatch, can use a plethora of perks (and some powers) to track survivors, some have mobility to do multiple things, and the door placement (plus hatch) is still based on RNG.

False, we aint contradicting ourselves. Firstly we were talking about hatch stand offs before moving on to your issues with this strategy. Second the whole quote by us:

Second going by your logic above, if the devs don't think forcing one side to give up is a good idea, why would they make it easier for killers, who are trying to make the survivor give up, by following your suggestion? We see it now, second to last survivor died, both doors and hatch open, and the killer can't close the hatch. All because people can't take the chance for RNG.

This asks why the devs would make it easier for killers when they are the ones trying to make survivors give up. It doesn't specify that it strictly benefits the killers sitting on the hatch, this is a benefit to all killers. So why would the devs help killers more when they are the primary issue in this scenario?

Third, we never denied that they would benefit (as stated, benefits killers across the board), we ask why they would still bother giving survivors a chance when they can continue to sit on the hatch regardless and continue this circus? Many (and we mean like 90+%) of those few who already sit at hatch waiting would very very much be willing to continue to do what they do with or without this idea. It solves practically nothing about any "hatch stand off" while simultaneously making it much harder for survivors needlessly.

Depends on where it is and how well you can get to stairs. GoJ cinema map is still worse if the exits spawn at the cinema and the statue. There is no way you can check the cinema exit from afar, so you always have to go around. If you make the wrong decision after you close hatch, the survivor is out.

Your idea would make it a nightmare to get out after hatch has been closed on maps who infamously spawn exits close together (e.g. Azarov's, DnD map, Midwich). On maps like these you basically NEED to stand at the exit and hope the hatch was far away and have the killer check the other gate first. If you don't get it during that time, even using the red light tech, you are not getting out unless you brought Sole Survivor or Wake Up maybe.

I main Survivor, so I know how difficult it is to escape through the gate after hatch is closed. It only happens perhaps 1 in 20 matches, not counting the ones where the Killer lets them out. You're trying to make it even more difficult than it already is, and I will not support that. I have a clip of me escaping through the exit gate after hatch was closed, but I only escaped because the Killer allowed it.

Of course you'd also suggest Survivors instantly die after closing hatch. That's how sweaty for the 4k you are.

I don't understand how you got that from my post. You are actually coming up with a totally different thing that what I wrote. I'm trying to ease things by not having stand offs.

I'm sorry, I quoted the wrong comment when I made that post. I meant to quote the post from adsads123123123123. Sorry for the confusion.

first of all the guy on the vid got stuck on onjects several times.

second you didn't show if survivor had gate opening perks.

Third i rarely get out with hatch standoffs. Especially because killer usually guesses gate right.

It's not hypocritical, that's just the difference between Killer and Survivor role. It is not the same for Killer. You say the Killer and Survivor only have a 50/50 chance of finding hatch first, so explain to me why the Killer finds it first 90% of the time. You and OP are whining that Survivors get a free escape when they find hatch while Killers have to seek out the Survivor when they close hatch. However, when Survivors find hatch, they should escape, because there is literally nothing else to do at that point.

And a side note, all these personal attacks are not convincing anyone as to why exit gates should be blocked after closing hatch.

They aren't wrong though is the thing. Survivors have to find the hatch against a faster killer while simultaneously either staying hidden (outta sight, leaving as few marks as possible) or while being chased by the killer if found (dodging and looping to not go down and smart killers will corral them to spots they checked before making it harder). Killers don't have these problems and can also deny the hatch which then leaves it to doors. That's not counting the number of tracking perks killers have while survivors have 2 for hatch and 2 for doors. You can't use clean numbers as it simply won't work.

We would question what you'd have in mind if you have survivors something else to do. Say the hatch spawns closed and a key spawns somewhere. If the killer doesn't know where it is then the killer has to look around for the key while simultaneously checking doors. If they do see it then they gotta guard 3 places. We can keep going for a bit. The alternative equivalent for the killer would be to immediately end the match when killer closes hatch. We're not opposed to this, but just saying.

Nah dude wasted like 4 seconds getting stuck on objects. He could have easily killed them… Say it with me: the killer doesn't not need to guarantee a 4k in every scenario

Can tear many holes in that argument if you want, but it seems easy to us.

If you knew he was camping the gate, you shouldnt have been so eager to just close hatch. You simply didnt have the guts to risk leaving the hatch open so you could first clear the gates. Most rng will make it almost impossible 4 the killer to not make it to the gate first.

The purpose of the video was to show that a scenario in which the killer cannot reach the gate in time before the survivor opens it exists. As mentioned, it was to stop the "he got stuck" comments.

Fair enough.

When I said optimal, I meant that no time was wasted in walking to the gate not that the hatch spawn was optimal.

You specifically said:

Note that this example shows what happens in a perfectly optimal situation with 0 time waste, which is unrealistic

Your words specify the whole situation is optimal with zero time wasted (and called it unrealistic at that, but thats us nit picking) so you can't blame us for pointing these flaws out.

At least half of the killer roster cannot do this, so it is still a problem for a large portion of the killer roster.

This argument also assumes the killer has time to pre-setup at the gates. There is not always time and opportunity for this.

Also, for your example killers, Hag and Trapper were the only relevant killers. The info from Doctor and Artist are useless since the killer is already walking to the correct gate where the survivor is. Info will help you choose the correct gate to go to but not get there faster. In fact, using your power will cause a movement speed slow, which will cause you to reach the gate slower.

The ones that can't do anything at all about guarding gates are: Bubba, PH, GF, Meyers, Freddy, Pig, Nemesis, Chucky, and debatably Vecna. Everyone else has either some way to move, guard, or check gates. And yes, thats on the killer to make time to pre-setup at gates, as trapper I usually do near the start or when passing by so its not rocket science. You neglect to mention the times where theres ample opportunity to do this.

As doc it saves us from checking around a gate (or the survivor outsmarts us) and as Artist we don't fire towards the door we're going to, we shoot at the opposite. Firing at the door we're walking to would be stupid. All that aside, fair enough for those 2.

That won't help since they are already waiting at the gate to start openning it immediately. When you close hatch, they will be on the gate not anywhere else.

That one we did misread so apologies. The main point was you can move and look around (aka patrol while looking) since you only need to guard the power switch during end game, you don't need to deep investigate and map RNG decides how easy this is. For 2 extreme examples from both sides, think Midwich and Lerys. Midwich has super close doors that you can easily check the gates, lery's you more or less have to go out to make sure.

Killer doesn't get another 50/50 chance after survivor finds hatch. Hatch is already a 2nd chance mechanic as the last survivor would practically never be able to escape with 2+ gens left. After closing hatch, survivors need another 2nd chance mechanic. Smh. I don't see killer getting a hatch that instant kills a survivor when they are about to 0k.

Cause the roles aren't equal in an asymmetrical game? Killer is the harder role as they're on their own. Survivors meanwhile have to rely on each other or theres at best only going to be 1 escape. With how often hook swings and tunneling have been survivors often lose 1/4th of their ability to contest the killer quickly and often. The hatch gives survivors a motivation to keep playing after something like that happens.

It's a waste of time to discuss which side is favoured to find hatch, which is heavily RNG, without stats. There are millions of possibilities that can only be effectively summarised with stats.

Well, we could point out simple facts like what we said before~

Also yes, we got pinged 4 times…not entirely sure how that bug worked…