Ways to balance out the new basekit mori
This patch has been a really problematic one for survivors with the Distortion nerf and worst part is the increase of slugging ti get the end game mori.
First of all, I’m a killer main, dont get me wrong, but even I think its annoying to slug 1 or more to go find the last survivor, its boring. But that didnt stand for others killer.
The problem here is the killer choose to slug and they are not being punish for slugging.
So here its my idea to counter this playstyle.
- Basekit Unbreakable: now will be a seperate bar from the recover bar, it will goes up automatically after X amount of time, unlimited use. After getting up by this way you get the Endurance status for 30s. The bar will slowdown if another survivor come close like self unhook mechanic.
- If there are only 2 survivors left, and one being down by killer and slug, the gen will slowly repair itself and after X amount of time the speed will increase and block killer from kicking it.
- Adding control to give survivor method to sacrifice themself while in the dying state CAUSE by the killer. Sacrifice themself in this way will award the player with greate amount of bloodpoint and will not reward the killer for eliminate the said survivor.
- If the survivor sacrifice themself from the dying state and there are only 1 survivor left in the trial, all gen auto complete and there will be 2 hatch spawn in the match and the gate will slowly open itself and stopped at 99%.
- If the killer decide to slug more, all of the slug survivors can sacrifice themslelf and create more hatch.
I hope they will read this and make some change, i’m a killer main and I love endgame mori but it need to be work my ass down for that cherry on top not slugging.
Comments
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Alternatively: None of this. The base kit mori is essentially just an alternate hook for the final survivor, nothing more. Survivors don't need buffing because of it.
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The addition to the mori last survivor i don't think increased slugging, killers still did it for the 4k. The only thing i think they should have is some sort of basekit unbreakable that you can do after half bleedout and can only be done once.
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Well there were comments in the PTB about how it would be nice if you could Mori the last Survivor were all other survivors dead OR Hooked. So you wouldn’t end up in a scenario where the killer wants to wait for a Hooked survivor to die. (Which I’d like)
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So:
- Self Pickup
- Auto-Gen repair if the last two survivors are slugged?
- Bleedout Faster option
- Alternate hatch criteria?
I don’t think #3 is necessary as #1 allows a cycle to continue, and #2 allows a survivor to end the cycle faster.
#4 as a method to make a stomp more interesting for the losing side, could be cool, but don’t think it should only be when the survivors are slugged.
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That fancy kill animation is winning games that weren't winnable before, huh?
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They should make survivors spawn with a gun that they can shoot the killer with
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I agree that something should be done about this. The finisher mori system hides a reward behind a 4k.
And just imagine if BHVR started selling new mori animations for different killers. Would people really not engage in whatever playstyle they feel is needed (tunneling, camping, slug for 4k, etc.) to get what they paid for?
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The problem I was talking about is killer doing slug more often to get that mori, imagine getting slugged for 4 minutes doing nothing, nobody wants that. I know that the mori is the final hook stage, but what about the 1 2 3 guys getting slugged while the killer chasing the last one.
I’m a killer main. I love the end game mori, dont get me wrong this would encourage them to add more mori in game and i love it. But if this keep happen no one want to play survivor anymore and they will have to remove it then no one getting anything.
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So, to recap: Basekit one of the best perks in the game, gens repairing themselves, removing BP from killers, and even more auto gen repairs.
At this point, you're not asking BHVR to give you a hand; you're asking them to come, pick you up, and carry you to the exit gates while whispering about what a good job you did. Lmao.
Even the "I'm a Killer main" part at the start, this post just ticks all boxes
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And so the other 4 survivor paid for the game too. So this just a method to counter the most important thing now is the slug playstyle.
I know this will cause another trouble but it would keep the game alive, a dead game is when no one want to talk about it anymore
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do you read all of that or you just assume thing, only when killer choose to slugged then this happens. And if you need more prove, I will be done with my work in about 7 hrs then i will send u a photo of my profile with all killer unlock and prestige 6 at least and no survivor pass pretige 4 except for Claudette
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I think you just forget killers did that anyway for the 4k. Mori really isn't changing anything. You actually get more points for hooking someone during endgame than the mori.
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This is such a majorly biased take with no regards to balance for both sides you clearly only want op surv sided mechanics.
None of these should be considered
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I mean we have to give them something or they will remove the mori we love and we got nothing, a little hope for them and we still gonna keep what we want. The hunt more fun if they tried to run ya know.
I know this post is crazy but if we cannot sort this out bvhr will remove it and I will not like it
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Nah devs didn't need to change moris in the first place they can just revert it
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i know but those survivors keep annoying in the facebook comment section, in the end game chat, in the youtube cmt. Its annoying, just give them a candy or something to be worried about and they will forget about the mori in no time. And honestly bvhr will not remove the feature, ít their new money tree, unique mori. Thanks for joining me.
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I pay no mind to them when playing. They will whine and complain about stupid stuff about killer but the instant you say something about survivor stuff they say "it doesn't need changed" or "it isn't as strong as you think!". I don't think the mori addition changed anything with slugging at all, people still did it for the 4k why is now any different?
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I know, i’m just afraid that their cry will force bvhr to remove the endgame mori. I having fun with it. Its been a long time since us killer has this kind of fun. Well lets pray that something worst gonna happens so they will forget about the mori and let it be
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How about no :)
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slugging for 4k was always a thing, it's just that you have illusion slugging for mori is more of a thing because you are paying more attention to it
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I've noticed killers getting increasingly aggressive in multiple ways lately. Recently, I've seen an increase in hard tunneling to rapidly tilt matches, much more proxy camping to such an extent that I now expect the killer to use unhooks for pressure, and I even breathe a sigh of relief at this point when I see the killer pick up whoever the third survivor is (whether myself or someone else).
I've even had killers slug for 4k, catch me as the last survivor while I tried to do the heal for my teammate, put me on hook near the downed survivor, and then start hitting me on hook so I'd give up and let them have their mori. I mean, if they're going to be toxic enough to slug for 4k, there's no way I'm just giving them a prize.
I really think this thing wasn't thought through. By hiding the mori behind a 4k, people playing a killer match are now given an incentive to use any playstyle available (tunneling, proxy camping, slugging for 4k, etc.) to get their free mori. And can you imagine if BHVR starts to sell mori animations? Someone who pays money for a new mori will see even more incentive to get a 4k regardless of the methods they use to get it.
Ultimately, I think you're right that some people already did these things, and some people still won't, but matches have been feeling more stressful for me lately as a result of the aforementioned playstyles becoming more common in my matches. Now that there's even more incentive to do those things, I suspect there's a correlation. But that's also just my experience; we really have to hear from lots of players to be sure :D
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You really have an interesting view on "balance".
Killer mori can be balanced with extra emote for survivors. That would be around the same.4 -
Functionally speaking, you're partly right. But moris do take away a small set of survivor abilities; they prevent any chance of wiggling free or using certain perks to break free from what would otherwise be getting carried to a final hook. So I think survivors are actually losing something in this deal.
Practically speaking, I think it's clear OP is trying to suggest ways to discourage the behavior the finisher mori appears to be encouraging. But I think you're right that survivors could be given a small new ability to deny some small killer power. Like maybe the last survivor gets a small advantage in chase for a moment. Or maybe like a single instance of sprint burst to cover more ground at the beginning of the hatch race. It would usually make no difference, but could on very rare occasions.
Realistically, I think that instead of any of this, the finisher mori should be denied to the killer if they slug for 4k. That would be something that discourages negative playstyles, and I think the DBD community needs some incentives like that.
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But moris do take away a small set of survivor abilities
Sure, but it's not like iri mori become basekit. It works only when there is last survivor left and on ground.
Even if you are in unhookable spot, where you are 100% sure to wiggle out. I don't think getting bleed out is so much better option.
Yellow mori can never change the overall outcome of the game.So I think survivors are actually losing something in this deal.
That would be true only with iri/purple mori, so you can skip DS when it matters. Yellow is simply irrelevant in most cases.
it's clear OP is trying to suggest ways to discourage the behavior the finisher mori appears to be encouraging
He is trying to massively buff survivors as "trade off" for basically cosmetic feature. Have you actually read his ideas? Self repairing gens, lol. Rats would love this with Plot twist.
But I think you're right that survivors could be given a small new ability to deny some small killer power.
Why? It's pointless feature, with petty reasoning in my opinion.
I think the DBD community needs some incentives like that
That's not an incentive, that's punishment. It's not like I care about mori anyway, I have used it once since it went live.
I just find it hilarious people try to "balance" yellow mori. It's just an excuse to ask for buffs.2 -
you’re wrong. It has increased.
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The finisher mori can definitely change the outcome of the game for survivors, just not much for killers. Wiggling free can be the difference between death and hatch. You and I appear to agree that the small chance to wiggle free is being taken from survivors as a result of the finisher mori :D
Given that, it's definitely not just cosmetic. There is a functional effect of the finisher mori on the game and on the experience of the players.
I did read OP's ideas, and I agree that they're overkill if we're just trying to address the functional loss survivors experience as a result of the finisher mori. But there is an issue with how the finisher mori rewards getting a 4k regardless of the methods used to get it. I don't think the ideas presented here (e.g. self-repairing gens) are necessarily the way to deal with it, but I do think playstyles that disregard other players' experiences (tunneling, proxy camping, slugging for 4k, bully squads) should be discouraged by in-game effects.
On a different note, I'm curious why you call my reasoning petty. :D
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The proper balance for the basekit Mori would be to give survivors a special animation they can equip to play for them whenever they run out the exit gate.
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You and I appear to agree that the small chance to wiggle free is being taken from survivors as a result of the finisher mori
It's so small chance that in my 2k hours it never happened. If killer can't hook you, they can just drop and bleed you out, or look for it.
There is a functional effect of the finisher mori on the game and on the experience of the players.
Cosmetic things change experience of the players. It doesn't change balance in any way, it's just for show.
I'm curious why you call my reasoning petty
"Killers got something I don't like, so what could we do to them, which they won't like too."
Mori is irrelevant and noone asked for it. So it would be very pathetic, if there is a negative feature for killers, because of something so pointless.0 -
#BringBackOldHatch
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Your framing is wrong, the reason Killers wanna see the Mori is not a balance issues, its just players playing harder than normal.
Even tho I think your ideas are good, but if you frame it the wrong way, they dont seem good.0 -
I understand the thinking behind your statement, but the finisher mori isn't just an animation, it's a reward. Any playstyle a killer can use to get a 4k will get them the reward, and tunneling out a weak link in the early game will help get that for them. Proxy camping hooks or running back to unhooks is encouraged by it. Slugging for a 4k is encouraged by the system.
Also, there is some agency taken from survivors by the finisher mori since they go from having a very small chance to wiggle free to a zero percent chance. An animation on its own isn't equivalent to those things.
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since the hook regeneration, the possibility so wiggle out is basically zero, so it doesn´t make much difference
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Since its basically aesthetic more than anything else… I don't think it needs massive basekit counter buffs for survivors
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Idk how it could increase, i'd say prior to it i'd have 7/10 games a killer would slug for 4k and it's pretty much the same. This doesn't really give you much more incentive to slug if you weren't already for the 4k.
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I definitely had a match where I wiggled out as the last survivor and escaped through an open gate my teammate escaped from. Having said that, it was just once. Nevertheless, that sort of chance for escape is removed by this.
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I agree that slugging for 4k was too common before the update, but now I'm finding more slugging for 4k as well as increased tunneling and proxy camping in my matches. It's literally reached a point where I expect the killer to either come at me during the unhook, or run straight back as soon as an unhook happens. I usually run kindred, and I find I have to wait extra long to even think about going for the unhook these days.
And I used to rarely see hard tunneling, but now I'm seeing it in a sizeable number of matches. I find I breathe a sigh of relief when I don't see those types of things from killers, and that sense has really only developed recently.
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In general things have been progressively getting worse. The mori addition really wouldn't affect it much but there's little incentive to really go after other survivors without killing one. 3v1 is significantly more easier than a 4v1.
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