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Another survivor perk nerfed to the ground. Thanks killer mains!
Comments
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Yeah, I am much more of a "DS + UB every game" person myself.
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Sacrificing a hook state can be well worth the time it take for the 4th person to be in the trial for longer.
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you heal, but you don't necessary SELF-HEAL. This perk triggers ONLY on self-heals
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Reddit is massively survivor sided. If i post anything even remotely about killers having a rough time it gets downvoted to oblivion.
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People aren't sticking their neck out that far for randomsThis is true, but its a bit more than that. Even if survivors used the early game chat, which is exceptionally rare, it's hard to have a dedicated build in soloq. If one survivor brings a hook rescue build, as an example, the other survivors aren't going to know that, so they end up running into each other.
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i disagree on OP post. Shoulder of Burden is one of the most overpowered perk to ever enter dbd. The reason why this perk is overpowered is because when 4 survivor use the perk, they chain all their hook state in global hook state counter which 6.
Normally every survivor has 3 hook states. With this perk, every survivor gets 6 hook states. it takes twice number of hooks for killer to eliminate a single survivor from the game. that's absurdly powerful. A common known sentiment in dbd is that early game is strongest part for survivor because while 4 survivor are alive, the killer is on backfoot. This perk prologues the game to have 4 survivors in the match meaning that killer cannot leverage any advantage on hooks anymore.
It is strong for soloq, it is strong for swf and there is almost 0 reason to not select this perk on every survivor build. the perk single handily has potencial to delete all tunneling plays from killer.
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It’s good we’ve got killer mains around to explain to survivors what the REAL strong survivor perks are. And while they are always, always these perks with massive drawbacks, survivors are so clueless that they just don’t understand the true power of these debilitating perks. Even the best survivor players in the game, who actively avoid these perks (and will avoid Shoulder the Burden) Just Don’t Get It ™. But you do. The killer main always gets it.
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Normally every survivor has 3 hook states. With this perk, every survivor gets 6 hook states.
Did you forget the hook state gets moved, not deleted?
It's not 'every survivor gets 6 hook states'. ONE survivor can get up to 6 hook states, getting one extra for every other survivor that brings the perk, but for every hook state they get extra, one of those survivors loses one.
So rather than 'every survivor' getting 6 hook states, it's ONE survivor that gets 6, in exchange for the other three going down to 2 hook states. (That, and it requires 3 perk slots)
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Self healing is the strongest form of healing due to the time efficiency.
However, I do agree with you that better players rarely use self heals except the syringe (which presumably doesn't trigger the perk? Dont know, sorry)
This however leads to the main problem. Which people use self care to self heal? Lower level players. Hitting skill checks, even doctor ones, is not that difficult for very experienced players. Less experienced players get hit pretty hard by this. They prefer being healthy over Gen progress a lot of the time, resulting in some form of healing activity.
This perk hits those that already have a hard time exponentially harder that those that already perform pretty well. In that regard it's similar to huntress lullaby.
It should be the other way around. A doctor on Gideon with this and a few other perks against lesser experienced players will be an absolute nightmare.
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And every survivor would have to run this. In soloq? Unlikely, sorry.
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Being able to even out the hookstages is still incredibly strong and shouldn't be a thing if you ask me.
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I could have sworned noed,pain res, PGTW, thanatopbobia, call of brine etc. got nerfed.
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Killer players and survivor players provide feedback about perks all the time. That's how the game gets balanced. If you don't believe that the same thing happens to strong killer perks in response to feedback from survivor players, you're delusional. I'm glad that overly strong perks are being adjusted. Having a limited number of strong perks for either side just results in a stale, boring meta that everyone complains about.
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womp womp. Not another completely broken survivor perk? How sad.
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It boggles my mind that casual survivors even play 1v4 anymore. I won't be playing again until 2v8 comes back.
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In high MMR gens get done in 4-5 minutes at times, causing killers to need to camp/tunnel some games especially vs SWFs. And conveniently SWFs will by far benefit the most from shoulder the burden to spread hooks and will make high MMR games more miserable for killers.
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I don't plan to buy any survivors for this game. The perks I use are so bland that killers will likely never complain about the likes of bond. I have at least workable builds to play. They aren't good…but they are immune to nerf hammer. And it saves me from ever having to spend money on this game.
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Definitely not
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They probably think that because every killer main on here says that they aren't a killer main because they play chest builds on survivor once in awhile.
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Ah I can't wait to see survivors using the perk, taking a hook state, and die on hook in a matter of seconds
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We know. You've said as much on these forums about it constantly since you joined. And as a casual Surv, I LIKE 1v4. Most people are in the same boat or simply not playing until 2v8 returns. Very few of them are complaining about it.
I'll see you in a few months when I go on my designated "2v8 is on so queues are awful" break. :)5 -
Because getting an extra hook state is the most broken thing in the game?! You're lucky the perk exists at all! If killers had the level of influence you imply, the perk would never be made.
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Sounds like the same bunch who say survivor is actually the stronger role because killers only win 50% of the time.
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You're not getting an extra hookstate, it just transfers one.
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That said, it is more to keep track of, since the game still does not have hook states visible to killers, which is a change that absolutely should have come with the introduction of this perk. At this point that info is less valuable than most of the things added to the survivor hud, and now you have to throw +/- variables (hook state transfers) as well as who has used the perk and who hasn't.
Honestly I just think its a bad perk from a design standpoint. Its either too strong or borderline unusuable depending on your team. Its just an effect that should not have been handled this way.
Edit: it also kinda encourages killers to camp and trade rather than spread hooks and seek new targets. Either the killer downs them again quickly and chews up another hook state, or they go after the unhooker and basically have a soft Make Your Choice without the distance requirement (or even bringing the perk.) We should be incentivizing spreading hooks and punishing camping and tunneling, not the other way around.
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Fortunately beyond the initial two weeks where people run the character for the adept achievement, you’re quite unlikely to ever see this perk in action. One of the brilliant things about DbD survivors is that they catch on pretty quickly to garbage perks.
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I don't think the increased exposed on shoulder the burden is even worth complaining about at all. It's like everybody forgot what the perk was for. It's not meant to help YOU survive, it's meant to help the OTHER survive. You quite literally take a hook state away from someone, nothing else in the game even does that so spending a while being exposed for it? Fine by me. If it's really that huge of an issue for you just ruin vigil to cut a huge chunk of the timer.
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As the representative of the killer main association, I inform you that we will give you the PTB Shoulder the Burden back when we receive back the old Eruption, Pop Goes the Weasel, Ruin, Thanatophobia, Call of Brine, Overcharge, Save the Best for Last, Sloppy Butcher, No One Escapes Death, and Pain Resonance. Once that is done, we will consider releasing your hostages.
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Question though: what's the benefit?
Because taking someone else's hookstate, barring some altruism gimmick, doesn't benefit you unless the target is getting tunnelled. But a tunnelling killer is likely to return to hook upon unhook, in which case this perk gives exposed for a cheaper down, at which point you are on death hook.
It's effectively an anti-tunnel perk, but the exposed effect benefits tunnelling killers disproportionately, defeating the perk's purpose.
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the killer taking a minimum 6 hooks to kill 1 person is double hooks compared to before in which tunneling only requires 3 hooks. If a killer alternatives between two survivors and ignores other two survivors, this perk will artificially make killer to spread hooks evenly to be 1 1 1 1 instead of 2 2 0 0. It means you get worst start as killer every single game.
Hard-tunnelers get punished because entire team can gift 3 hooks to 1 person
Killers that soft-tunnel are punished because you will force killer to evenly distribute hook states
Proxy camper get punished because you can leave survivors for whomping 120 seconds and then gift hook-states so that the person after being unhooked is not punished for being on death hook. you can rush gens while killer sits around hooks doing nothing. typically leaving survivors on hooks to go 2nd stage only to unhook them before they die results in killer tunneling them because they're on death hook. this perk removes risk of putting people on death hook in early game and allows survivors to weaponize hook trading against the killer.
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he killer taking a minimum 6 hooks to kill 1 person is double hooks compared to before in which tunneling only requires 3 hooks. If a killer alternatives between two survivors and ignores other two survivors, this perk will artificially make killer to spread hooks evenly to be 1 1 1 1 instead of 2 2 0 0. It means you get worst start as killer every single game.
However, this requires at least three survivors to all equip the perk, and to take turns doing the rescue, even if that's otherwise sub-optimal, and if the killer catches any of them at the hook, its value is immediately nullified since the user is brought from zero to death hook in one hit.
You're acting like this is an automatic feature that's basekitted in, as opposed to eating a big chunk of survivor perks, on top of the extra time required to coordinate a daisy chain of StBs. Leon's right next to the hook but has a single hook state? Gonna have to wait for Felix to trudge all the way over from the other side of the map, it's his turn to do an unhook now.
Killers that soft-tunnel are punished because you will force killer to evenly distribute hook states
Considering the game is perfectly winnable with evenly distributed hookstates, especially if all survivors have to drop an entire perk for it AND gift the killer a free extra perk (Make your Choice) on steroids, AND have to be sub-optimal with their unhooks, I don't see this as a problem.
Proxy camper get punished because you can leave survivors for whomping 120 seconds and then gift hook-states so that the person after being unhooked is not punished for being on death hook. you can rush gens while killer sits around hooks doing nothing. typically leaving survivors on hooks to go 2nd stage only to unhook them before they die results in killer tunneling them because they're on death hook. this perk removes risk of putting people on death hook in early game and allows survivors to weaponize hook trading against the killer.
Then maybe don't play AFK killer? If you actively go out to disrupt the survivors and spread your hooks yourself, this perk doesn't come into play at all. It's only if you tunnel or camp that this perk can potentially be a problem, though the exposed effect is there to reward you for tunnelling/camping anyway.
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Considering the game is perfectly winnable with evenly distributed hookstates
you could not be more wrong. the game is balanced around killer taking shortcuts to win. The analogy of this perk for survivor is like if killer had a perk in the game which blocked every when any gen reaches 50% progression permanently. All gen are unblocked when all gens reach 50% progression. The perk grants you permanent wall-hack when you are 32 meters away from the killer.
A perk like this for killer would ensure that every survivor has to repair 7 gens before they complete a single gen making survivor play the least efficient as possible. Permanent wall-hack is great on killer but downside of needing to repair 7 gens before completing single one far out weight the upside of wall-hack. Regression perks elevate power of the perk.
Back to main topic, Shoulder of burden has nasty synergizes with second perks on survivor. For example, a singular survivor can use more then 2 dead hard's. Off the record can trigger more times on the same survivor. Decisive strike and hard-tunneling is more painful. Reassurance can make hooks take 100 second to regress adding extra value to the 6 hook. Gen progression perks are more likely to generate more value because first kills are going happen later due to 6 hook requirement to kill. Deliverence is stronger because one of the weakness of deliverance is that you can be first person to be hooked but this perk can remove first hook syndrome of deliverence.
The perk is far from useless and borderline game-breaking.
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The devs have stated time and time again and also proven with many changes in the last years that they nerf and buff because of numbers and balance sheets and not cause one side screamed the loudest on the forums or on reddit.
Saying it's the killer players fault that survivor perks got nerfed is honestly just bait
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Am very grateful to the Taurie doing her adept. Was on my third game today going on my third game of being tunnelled and she used this perk on me, which was nice. That's enough DBD for me today though lol
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I agree 100% - Hardly anyone complained about it on the PTB forums.
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Probably because if they introduce strong perks then they get accused of making the game more pay to win. I swear people in this game are impossible to please. It was a due nerf, and there are plenty of strong perks out there. Shoulder the burden was being abused by SWF's, mostly streamers, to have way more chases with a killer while running a runner build. That wasn't the intention and it got nerfed because of it. Really sad to see people get this dramatic over balancing.
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How does increasing Exposed from 20s to 40s change things for swfs?
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"Considering the game is perfectly winnable with evenly distributed hooks" we are not in the same world. Try even distributing hooks as trapper or clown and you will easily get 3 outted if not 4 outted if the survivors know how to do the objective and run from yellow to yellow with windows.
"Its only if you tunnel/camp that this perk can ptoentially be a problem" No… just no this perk is gonna be MORE of a problem for killers that decide to play nice because someone who previously wouldn't have access to deli could then have access to deli.3 -
The objective is transforming killers into useless npcs to provide survivors with entertainment.
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Remove the option to stack it, change Exposed to an aura reveal.
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Have 2k+ hours on pig, 4k hours in general and am playing survivor for a good while now.
My usual build:
- Second wind
- Well make it
- Lithe
- Alert
Please. People play both roles. Enough with the tribalism.
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"hard-tunneling is more painful"
You lost me there.
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you could not be more wrong. the game is balanced around killer taking shortcuts to win.
"Considering the game is perfectly winnable with evenly distributed hooks" we are not in the same world. Try even distributing hooks as trapper or clown and you will easily get 3 outted if not 4 outted if the survivors know how to do the objective and run from yellow to yellow with windows.
I know this is a point that forum killers love regurgitating to one another, but there's nothing to prove this. It's always just forum killers pointing towards one another as sources without any kind of underlying logic or argumentation. It's always just a presumed consensus, with nothing backing it up.
You run the risk of confirmation bias, since every match you win with tunnelling/camping/slugging gets chalked up as having required it, without considering the possibility that you could still have won without it.
You mess up your MMR, since these tactics can crutch you above your natural skill level, which in turn makes the game feel slanted against you, when in reality you're just not where you're supposed to be matched.
You are relying on being an accurate judge of your own skill level, since you are the only one judging your own games and finding that there's nothing you could've done to play the match out better -without- tunnelling/camping/slugging.
Yet despite that, it is held as some kind of holy cow to the forum, and anyone that suggests these tactics need nerfs is committing heresy.
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Because non solo survivor is very strong. And they just realesed a weak killer also so no reason to be too sad. They nerf strong killer perks all the time also this is the game.
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I did run Vigil. It made no difference. Non-tunnelling Killers aren't hanging out by the hook and tunnelling Killers are proxy camping so they're at the hook before the unhooker can get away. STB is a weak perk.
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Has zero value during chase unless the Survivor runs Calm Spirit because it's typically Survivor that scares the crow first.
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don’t forget Skerchent got obliterated due to the tsunami of survivor tears
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The only interest I have in this chapter now is the killer, and that is just for the perks. Once I get her to prestige 3, I drop her.
The survivor meanwhile is such a mess perk-wise. A kind of meh healing perk. An invocation perk that won't get run, SWFs would rather have Spiders unironically. A rescue perk that is a trap for solo and really only meant for SWFs.1 -
I mean you can do the experiment yourself. Get some good survivors in a custom lobby that actually try to escape and try to spread hooks with a lower to mid tier killer. You'll find quickly that spreading hooks wont get you wins. Sure you might be aiming for more fun and dont care about wins but not every one thinks that way. They don't even have to know each other they just have to try and escape so no swf.
Hell even decent survivors will do with the right map.2 -
Ah, but the critical difference is: I am not a competent killer. I can play a decent match, but I've no delusions that when I lose, there was nothing I could've done better. I've won plenty of matches without slugging, camping or tunnelling though.
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