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Thrill of the Hunt isn't OP
Survivors still cleanse my totems ridiculously fast, and running a full Hex build doesn't impede their progress on Generators either. I don't know why people are saying it's busted, I have even been playing The Blight and still struggle against Survivors. I just don't think Hex builds are ever going to be as strong as Generator Regression and Prevention builds like Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance, Dead Man's Switch, Grim Embrace, Corrupt Intervention. And when they cleanse all my Hexes, it's like I am not even running a build. Even if Thrill of the Hunt is OP, I would figure Survivors would start running Counterforce to cleanse and locate Totems faster. What I am saying is, Hex: Thrill of the Hunt and Hex builds are still neither an easy nor guaranteed win, and should not be nerfed because the reason I lose games is because I clearly suck at the game. Therefore, even if Thrill of the Hunt gets nerfed, nothing is stopping a really good Killer from securing kills with 4 Slowdown perks. For those who say otherwise, what builds have y'all been using for Hex: Thrill of the Hunt? I have been using Blood Favor, Crowd Control, and either Undying or Ruin.
Comments
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Survivors still cleanse my totems ridiculously fast
Thrill of the Hunt takes 45 seconds to cleanse; or half a Generator. Pushing them off the totem removes ALL progress meaning they have to restart the full 45 second process.
This isnt even considering how other perks interact with this, Hex: Face The Darkness forces Survivors to scream every 25 seconds and effectively makes it impossible to cleanse a Hex Totem outside of the Killer's Terror Radius; and on stealth Killers, you can easily remove your Terror Radius and make this a near impossible thing to deal with.Saying "I wish Hex Totems would be meta again" to the Monkey's Paw and the finger curled back… I do want Hex Totems to be meta, this is just not the proper way.
Post edited by Iron_Cutlass on47 -
Your entire post screams you don't know what you are doing. If you can't check on your totems every ~40s on Blight then ######### are you doing?
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Played against a killer with thrill of the hunt and face the darkness, and it was legit impossible to cleanse totems because screaming would just remove all the progress from cleansing the totem.
As Iron_Cutglass said earlier cleansing totems with thrill of the hunt makes them take 45 seconds, and face the darkness causes you to scream every 20 seconds it's basically impossible to cleanse the damn things at that point.
Hex totems needs love but making them this annoying is beyond absurd.14 -
Sad is one of the 2 counters to this combo is a Lara perk and it takes cleansing a totem to even work.
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And thus continues my favorite charade; a broken, overtuned perk comes out that gets panned in discussions prompting other people to rush in to defend it because they don't want to lose their new toy.
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It would still be the exact same interaction at 50% speed, its a hex face the darkness problem not a thrill problem
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thrill of the hunt threads are everywhere jesus
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Cleansing totem vanilla: 14 secondsThrill increases to max: 70%, making it 23.8 seconds to cleanse.
Face the darkness: scream every 25 seconds.
This was the numbers I found and did myself, but I feel it's probably wrong. I have no idea where 45 second cleansing comes from, but would like to!
Using my numbers, theoretically a survivor can cleanse if timed right after a scream. But then you know they are there, you know to come running back. So defense is all but guaranteed.
If survivors cleanse dull totems they could chew down on that penalty. But this again is assuming the numbers. I need clarification.
If the interaction with H:FtD and TotH is the only real issue, then hopefully BHVR just tweaks that. Butchering seems to be their way.
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Thrill does not increase cleanse duration. It decreases cleanse speed by 70% meaning survivors cleanse with 30% speed resulting in over 3x the duration.
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Forums math makes my head hurt.
Thrill increases to max: 70%, making it 23.8 seconds to cleanse.
This isn't what the perk does. It's not "70% more time" it's "survivors cleanse 70% slower".
So a totem takes 14 charges to cleanse, and at full speed of 1 charge per second, it takes 14/1 = 14 seconds to cleanse.
But survivors are cleansing 70% slower, which is at 30% of normal speed. Which is 0.3 charges per second. That means to cleanse 14 charges now takes 14/(0.3) = 46.666... seconds to cleanse.
Face the darkness is impossible to avoid in that situation.
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History repeats itself. The funny thing is we've had this exact scenario 4 years ago when OG undying was released and people are using the same arguments to defend new thrill.
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Good.
I hope today BHVR wishes to share some explanation why they even have PTB if they don't test changes and why this change was so rushed :)
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BVHR will nerf perk regardless what any killer says because survivor's say that the perk is unfun to face/not fair.
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Anyone who isn't completely saturated in killer bias can see this perk is wildly overtuned and, importantly, was never tested on the ptb in this state either.
This is effectively the equivalent of the more recent patch where killing a survivor caused an extra gen to pop for free. It shouldn't have gone live that way, likely was never intended to work this way, and should be corrected in the first available patch.
The only differences here are that survivors are suffering from this faux pas instead of killers, and, of course, that most of the forum posts are discussing how and why it's overtuned and requires a change instead of simply screaming at the devs to change it out of pure egotistical entitlement.
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what is over-tuned about it? the fact that you need endure hex effect instead of remove the hex immediately from the trial?
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That is the overtuned bit, yeah. Hexes were balanced for the fact that they can be undone, but new Thrill removes this as an effective drawback.
Imagine if there was a perk that allowed you to consistently tank extra hits while injured. It'd remove a chunk of No Mither's drawback.
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They said in their own post that their maths was probably wrong and didn't understand where 46s came from, but would like to know. All you had to do was explain the actual calculation.
Post edited by Rizzo on0 -
- in this situation the funniest thing is to read the comments of people who claim that "toth" is completely fair and balanced. If you have more than 100 hours on DBD, you'll quickly notice that something about this buff isn't working. this perk will definitely be changed, but not because survivors ask for it, but because it is a clear mistake of balance. if you're on a small map, with a Doc or Legion, or a Blight that wants to defend the totem… you simply can't break the totem, you don't have time, even with Counterforce... I don't think you have to be team Eternal to understand this problem. It's true, you could play an entire game with Ruin, but Devour """forces""" you to break the totem.
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Damn, I post a take on a perk and it's getting more attention than any other post I made lol. But yeah. Thrill of the Hunt isn't OP, I think people are overreacting to it. Cause like, I have even been playing Doctor with Face the Darkness, Devour Hope, and Pentimento, and I still lose at times to Survivors who don't know what they are doing. The Survivors could also just, not cleanse totems. I mean, you don't have to cleanse the totems. If Survivors simply do gens and loop the Killer effectively, which is what Survivors should be doing anyway, it's not strong. Especially if Hex Thrill of the Hunt is the first Totem cleansed. Even with Devour Hope, if I can't hook any Survivors then I don't get Devour Hope value. Also, it being a Solo Queue stomper isn't really a good reason, considering Solo Queue is… bad in general. I lose most of my games in Solo Queue cause me and my teammates are just not good, this build doesn't make us play any different. Although, I guess I am just used to losing as Survivor. I am using the build because it is nice not having all my totems cleansed in the first 30 seconds of the game, but again it isn't an easy win nor a guaranteed win.
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Things change as soon as you bring hexes they absolutely have to cleanse like Blood Favor or Crowd Control on some maps especially on stronger killers. If you need help getting hooks then ditch Penti and bring something that actually helps in chase. Thrill already gives you time. Evidently, you don't need even more time which is what Penti provides. After everything you said I think you don't understand the game enough to be making such conclusions whether those are true or not.
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a perk that is balanced off being removed from the trial will inevitably become a perk that is empty slot in the majority of trials. I disagree that hexes are balanced off being removed. hexes should be balanced off being endured as perks. Most of the hexes have some form of drawback or require a certain amount of preparation for their effect to produce value in a trial. The perks that do not have them such as Ruin tend to have low reward because their reward is near guaranteed. it is possible to escape killer trials while leaving a hex entirely active for entire trial. Cleansing hexes should be opportunistic action, not the default action.
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I do, I used a variety of hexes to see what value I can get, and so far Pentimento has given me the most value since it allows Thrill of the Hunt to gain more tokens back. I am indeed saying it is strong, but I personally do not believe it to be OP or a free win. I don't really care if it gets nerfed or not, and let's be honest, it will. I do think it's funny people only care about saying that I am wrong than anything else I stated. I am not trolling though. I do believe it isn't OP as many people make it out to be. Thrill of the Hunt always felt like diet Undying or Hex: Undying at home. Now that BHVR finally buffed it so that it is actually worth it as a Hex Protection perk, people are calling out for nerfs and saying it's horrible for the game. I have watched the videos from YouTubers like Rapid and listened to them explaining how long it can take to remove a Totem with both worse and best case scenario, and the whole time I was thinking, he could have just been working on a Generator the whole time instead of cleaning a Totem. People will stick with their opinions regardless of what is said, and I have my own too. I don't believe everything I hear from the internet and prefer my own experiences and proven facts to make my own claims. Along with that, this has only been in the game for like, not even 3 days. Sorry I haven't come to the conclusion that something is OP in one day (considering I only started using the perk a day ago), but I will need to use it more to come to my own conclusion if the perk is really OP or not, and again, it's not like my opinion even matters to any of you nor the game devs. I am willing to change my mind with more tests, but until then, I am adamant that it isn't OP. It is strong, but not OP. Either way, have fun in the game!
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I agree with this chap.
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People here act like the whole team is going to stop doing gens and go look for totems at once and therefore the game cant progress because you know cleansing totems is a must if you want to open the exit gates at the end of the trial.
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Ignoring the totems altogether basically means you have 3 unhooks until you are permanently exposed and 5 unhooks until you are 1 hit from insta mori. Any killer with mobility and a half decent knowledge of maps will easily be able to get that way before 5 gens are completed.
The problem is solo queue and lack of comms and coordination. A SWF can tackle it but solo queue, there will always be major problems. The slowdown TOTH gives need dropping a touch from the 14% they've changed it to.
Another perk/build that massively impacts solo queue. I don't even mind it, at least it's something different as I'm now running Counterforce, but will get annoying very quickly if it becomes too common, especially as there are certain killers and builds that make cleansing impossible from what I've seen.
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All BHVR needs to do is introduce a mic option for survivors. This whole party-game, scary independent lone survivor sneaking around trying to avoid the killer as much as possible is so 2017.
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hexes should be balanced off being endured as perks.
That would, in this case, involve nerfing them dramatically to the point where they wouldn't be hex perks anymore. I don't know why anyone would want that, unless they're expecting Devour Hope kind of power without being removable.
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Hexes are designed to be countered by being found, cleansed in 14s, or blessed in 28 seconds.
This one perk alone changes nothing about the "being found" part, but increases the cleansing part to 46.666 seconds instead, which is more than 3 times as long.
Given that people threw a fit and lost their minds over claiming that MFT increased chase times by "20%", and since I need to put everything in killer terms for you, this would be like MFT instead increasing chase times by 300+ percent instead. I'm certain you understand how bad that would be for the game.
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win within 5 hooks. it is not impossible. it is more realistic than the killer winning with 12 hooks.
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holding m1 not for 14 seconds, but for 40 and then turning off the perk is not the same, the closest thing is if the sprint was 10 seconds, but was turned off after 1 trigger
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You are joking now right? Your solution to Devour Hope + Thrill of the Hunt is simply escape within 5 hooks?
Not to mention the exposed effect already kicks in after 3 unhooks. Not being able to cleanse Devour Hope is almost always a guaranteed win for the killer.
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I mean you don't have to do totems to finish your objective…
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Well sure, but if the killer gains instadown after only 3 unhooks, you are never going to finish your objective anyways. So if Devour Hope is in play, you kind of do have to cleanse the totems if you want to win.
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That's part of the game when it happens. Not every match is perfect. I don't understand the REAL objective of the gameplay of this game when everyone on both sides poses picture perfect scenarios.
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Appreciate it, but all good. The forums are full of those types lol. I should really play more killer to refresh myself with the perks.
They're saying if Devour hope is in play, you have 3-5 unhooks before you are perma exposed. Theoretically you 'can' still win, but your chances are abysmally low against any drunken killer or higher, skill level wise. Its good math, I promise lol.
All in all, I can definitely see what the problem is. If a great totem destroying build were in play, would it be effective to counter this new "Thrill the Darkness' combo?
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No the problem is that with the new Thrill of the Hunt, Devour Hope activating will happen almost always if the killer is somewhat decent at defending totems. That's the big issue. I always have hated Devour Hope but it never was op to me, because it could be cleansed and countered. But with new Thrill of the Hunt, cleansing Devour Hope has become too hard and unlikely.
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Totems just need a grace period of 5 seconds, where if you stop cleansing or blessing them, the progress doesn’t immediately get reset to 0%.
This would allow screaming perks to exist, and not need to be nerfed, because survivors would scream, then be able to resume their full progress on the totem.4 -
i'm cackling dude this is the best joke i've heard in a long time
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Just add like a Ruin effect to totem progress. It starts going down as soon as you let go, but you or someone can come back a few seconds later, and only have lost half progress or something. Sounds good?
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Chasing survivors and pressuring gens? You can't be everywhere at once. What if you have multiple totems?
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Well he's not wrong. Get a lucky 2-hook on 2 people, and camp the last 1 in endgame. Follows the flow of the average match perfectly. I'm just not lucky enough to get 2-hooks, especially because of the 70-second hooks + potential Reassurance.
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I don't see how good hexes so radically change the game, like so many are suggesting. Either be on a gen, or on a totem, but going for 1 doesn't mean you stop doing the other. The killer can't be everywhere at once, and through split pressure alone, you just beat him. Like you, I highly doubt hexes will take the place of gen defence. It's too high risk, because once those perks are destroyed, no matter how difficult that may be to do, they're gone forever, and you just lost a huge chunk of your power, which means you lose.
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ooh buddy, if you think that's the average game you got another thing coming
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You have it backwards-ish
Slowdown is a decrease to the value added per second not an increase to the value needed to complete an action
Every action is basically done at 1 charge / second, for however long that takes, slowdown doesn't increase the charged needed to complete an action, aka if a totem is 14 seconds, and you cleanse at 50% slowdown it doesn't take 50% more seconds (21) it takes 28 seconds because the charges per second are decreased
Old thrill 50% slowdown means you cleanse a 14 second totem at 0.5 charges per second which takes 28 seconds
New thrill's 70% slowdown means you cleanse a 14 second totem at 0.3 charges per second which takes 46 seconds
Face the darkness makes them scream every 25 seconds
Either way the interaction forces the survivors to first deal with the face the darkness then deal with the totems and its not really fair to play around if the killer is smart, but you might be able to try and brute force it by having multiple survivors in an area and having the first one hit go around and cleanse the totems (as face the darkness only affects the other 3 survivors after the first one becomes injured).
I do think screaming shouldn't reset interactions like totems and pig boxes for this exact reason where silly interactions like this form, I think its fine with gens but not totems and pig boxes.
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You applied the modifier incorrectly. Action speed is actually calculated as: (1 - first modifier) x (1 - second modifier) etc.
So you get an action speed of 100% - 70% = 30%. The base time to cleanse a totem is 14 seconds, so with 5 stacks of thrill we get 14/0.3 = 46.7 seconds.
You can look it up here.
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"What is happening? Why is everybody loosing their minds over this perk?"
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I don't see the issue, no one is forced to do the totems…You can ignore them and do gens. It's interesting that people say it's an OP perk now but people were fine with the way totems spawn in a survivors face when the match starts meaning the hex gets disabled right at the start and had no effect at all.
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You need to counter certain hexes, which typically involves cleansing them.
But current thrill makes the cleansing part either very difficult, or with the right killer perks or playstyle downright impossible.
Hexes are supposed to be map wide effects that have the downside of being cleansed and removed, but this offers a fairly simple way for killers to remove that downside entirely.
Not acknowledging that fact means you're either not considering the immediately obvious implications here, or you simply don't care and want hexes to be permanent regardless of what game balance would look like.
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Why do you need to counter certain hexs? They are not stopping people from doing gens. Even with thrill totems can be cleansed...not impossible. Again I don't see the issue, it's better this way than how it has been. Hex totems spawning right next to a survivor at the start of the match which negates the hex effect immediately. It's balanced the game imo as now hex totems actually work and mean survivors have something else to do other than speed rush gens. As others have said killer can't be everywhere, it's hard enough defending gens alone but defending totems aswell as gens and downing survivors? It's a lot for a killer to juggle
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Why do you need to counter certain hexs?
Because Ruin adds a metric ton of slowdown for a killer who keeps decent pressure, and Devour Hope can close a game out extremely quickly once it gets stacked up. These are hexes that -must- be cleansed.
Again I don't see the issue, it's better this way than how it has been.
It's better for killer only, for the game as a whole, it isn't. Underpowered perks are always categorically less of an issue than overpowered ones, otherwise Invocations would skyrocket to the top of the charts in terms of priority.
As others have said killer can't be everywhere, it's hard enough defending gens alone but defending totems aswell as gens and downing survivors? It's a lot for a killer to juggle
Don't need to defend gens if survivors are stuck on totems.
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