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Recent Otz Video about Thrill of the Hunt
Recent Otz video shows how this perk is broken and makes Hexes uncleansable on certain killers with specific addons.
Thrill should be reverted back to 10%, then in next PTB it should be tested if 12% is game-breaking or nice buff.
This month there is winter event and something this broken would discourage survivors from playing at all.
No, Counterforce is not an answer, because it does not counter first totem cleanse which is still painfully slow and still broken on certain killers and some totems (Devour Hope) has to be cleansed to have any chance of escaping if killer is on decent level.
Comments
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Yeah I had seen people complaining but to be honest I mostly ignored it as it had not really affected me so… meh?
However it seems people are catching on fast and racing to take full advantage of this, hopefully Otz highlighting this will get the perk kill-switched until they revert the changes. As it is completely broken at this stage, even without using those particular killers.
45 seconds is far too excessive imo
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Once again another YouTuber massively overrating a perk to the point of people will now none stop complain till it's nerfed then just move onto the next thing to complain about. I played 4 matches with it just to test it and the results were as expected. The survivors ignored the totems and just smashed out the gens as they usually do in all 4 matches.
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I imagine they Interact to the first totem they saw and they said to themselves "nah, I'd rather repair the generators than give the killer 47 free seconds" and I wouldn't blame them!
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Wait till Survivors figure out Counterforce is a perk and what It does! 1 perk is about to complete destroy a no doubt short meta
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I don't think it's even the solution because it requires you to buy the character Jill Valentine which costs $5 (because she's a licensed character of course), and if that's the case then the developers are creating a problem to sell the solution.
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massively overrating a perk
Bestie he literally showed addon (brown one) that allows you to wait whole cooldown on Singularity's pod and still managed to hit someone cleansing totem.
Stop being delusional.
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Wait till you realise Counterforce is a perk and will completely single handedly shut down these Hex builds lol
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I personality don't think you need a ptb to test it at 12%. I'm pretty sure 12% would be ok. If they do put it back to 10% then they just revert it and put the BP bonus back
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Sure, try running it and tell us how that goes. And good luck getting your first totem cleansed. Or not being targeted by the killer first. 😆
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maybe start cleansing totem, after like 10-12 seconds, your teammate uses an emp to destroy the camera. BVHR won't make survivor use common sense, they'll just weaken it so you don't need any brain power.
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You talk about common sense, but what you are suggesting is two survivors coordinating and lets estimate, say… consuming about a minute and 15 seconds between the two of them, just to cleanse one totem. How exactly is this going to happen outside of a SWF?
And even then, there's still a very real possibility that the killer walks up and ensures that not only did those two survivors waste all that time, but he also gets free hits.
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Then the third survivor should sacrifice themself, duh! 😂
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this is exactly the problem with survivors… logic. first, the survivor consumes 46 seconds of the time to disable the totem. the survivor with EMP can work on a generator after he has used an emp. Emps have considerable radius and at best, you spend like 5-8 seconds channeling an emp+some minor walking time, a lot of which you should be doing to grab the emp anyway.
During these 46 seconds, there is no risk in getting hit. if a killer drops chase, you pre-run to nearest loop and begin looping like any other killer. The killer that spends time dropping chase is not progressive his hook objective. He's wasting his time defending totems while you push generators for free across the map between survivor 3 and 4. on top of that, survivor 3 and 4 can also be cleansing totems simultaneously as survivor 1-2 which forces the killer within 46 seconds to have to drop chase to interrupt said totem or lose the totem.
All this sums up that survivor can be in multiple places at once and defending totems as killer is often a waste of time because it allows survivors to get free gen progression at worst or at best cleanse the totem. TOTS is potato killer perk. the players that are high mmr/good at the game won't have trouble playing vs it while the casual bad survivor will die to totem builds.
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You are suggesting something that is beyond the developers' control, and it is difficult in Soloq to have an understanding between the survivors. Everyone plays differently and everyone has a different mentality. If there is a need for understanding and coordination, then it requires reconsideration because this will not happen in every match.
Don't expect everyone to think and play the same way you do.
I know why you're defending this Hex, because you finally found something that guarantees kills and slows down the progress of the generators.
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The first totem is the biggest problem - and Counterforce does very little about that. Counterforce really is mostly a counter to Penti and NOED, nothing else.
Of course that hex build doesn't make sense on any killer. - But there are plenty killers where it's pretty much uncounterable for one side, while the other is kinda cheesing it.
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no. i am defending hex because it creating perk variety in the killer to run an exposed build over the standard generator delay builds that are common in the game. The other reason why i am defending it is because the hex build is defeated similarly to how 3 gen are defeated. yoyoing. the difference is that 3 gen have the element of spawn rng where the killer can have 3 close gens making the match take awhile while hex perk are almost always spread out meaning your always able to split pressure on them. they're fair perks. you have to misplay as survivor to lose to them.
my impression is that if you can't have a strong fair perk be strong than killer are not allowed to have any strong perks at all. certainly not ones that are exposed. only ones that are gen defence but gen defence are also passive becoming weaker.
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And if its good on "certain killers with specific addons" i dont think its that bad. Its not even close to the strengh of eruption alone. The Talent itself is pretty useless, so it will block at least 2 Perksslots similar to Undying.
Thrill should be reverted back to 10%, then in next PTB it should be tested if 12% is game-breaking or nice buff.What i really dont understand is why do you want to revert it back to 10%? We allready know that 10% is to weak and nobody will play that perk.
It really doesnt sound like you thought this through. It sounds like you lost a couple of games against it and instead of figure out how to counter it you want to be gone. You are free to convince me otherwise.
No, Counterforce is not an answer,Why? With Counterforce you are back on the level how thrill of the hunt was before.
I mean yes thrill of the hunt is a bit hyped atm. Just wait 1-2 weeks and check out how it works. Im sure in 3 weeks you will again maily only see pain+pop builts, i guess thats what you want?
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What i really dont understand is why do you want to revert it back to 10%?
So in next PTB there could be tests if 12% is too oppressive or not.
With Counterforce you are back on the level how thrill of the hunt was before.
No, you are not. There are multiple posts with calculations that it does not work like that.
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And I don't know what your problem is, but maybe you'd do well to stop trying to categorize people into boxes just because they disagree with you.
The reason I add on more time to the 47 seconds is because the OTHER survivor is also spending time. The first survivor I'm already giving the time of finding totems and getting to them for free. The second survivor you are talking about has to get an EMP and make their way to that same totem as well, and charge the EMP. And since they're trying to coordinate their efforts, neither one of these survivors can also be spotted by the killer and chased, or the whole plan doesn't work.
You wave your hands wildly and make a good argument on paper, but seems you don't even think about what you're saying for two seconds. If the strat is just to prerun when the killer starts coming, then that's what.. 20, 30 seconds potentially wasted cleansing the totem? And then all that effort is undone and for naught. Not to mention all the effort the 2nd helper went through. But hey guess what? After you prerun, the killer can just go back to the chase they had before. And you'll also need ANOTHER emp to try again and hope the killer doesn't scare you when they turn and walk towards you for one second.
Also remember that HUX is a powerful killer. It's very easy to place biopods ahead of survivors, instantly tag them, and catch up no matter how badly you get mind gamed or how much distance they make. In your makebelieve scenario, the killer instead scares the survivors off the totem who prerun, he goes back and quickly finishes downing his original target, then he activates his biopods and scans around the map, probably still tags those two sad survivors trying to cleanse or get a new EMP… and then you're back to square one, but minus hook and health states and also infected.
You talk a big game, but it is never, EVER going to work like you imagine. Every second wasted cleansing totems is seconds that could be spent doing the generators, or unhooking/healing a teammate. And every time the killer interrupts the totem cleansing, that's even more time, doubly wasted on absolutely nothing. Hook states accumulate, map/item resources dwindle, then soon devour hope activates and it's GG. Everyone's slugged on the floor or dead.
We don't even need to go to PTB to test this. If thrill gives 12% per token, then the base totem cleanse time is 35 seconds. That's still too long imo.
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The talk will not change, 47 seconds on a totem is completely unacceptable and the excuse of buying a licensed character to confront this Hex is also unacceptable, also there is no point in arguing with you, you will die on a hill to defend any perk that gives the killer a guaranteed win or is very problematic for the game, this alone shows that you have only played the role of survivor once a year.
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We don't even need to go to PTB to test this. If thrill gives 12% per token, then the base totem cleanse time is 35 seconds. That's still too long imo.
Than what is the right time?
Before it was 28sec, we know 28sec is garbage and nobody used the Talent (thats a fact). Now you say 35sec is still too long. So if i may ask you, what is the right time and why?
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Yes so leave it at 14% and test 12% at the PTB. Because we allready know its to weak at 10% so there is no use in nerfing it back to that. You also dont bring arguments why it should be 12 and not 13 or 11 or 14. You sound like a panic player. Its like when freddy got released and was the weakest killer (with basicly no ability) , but survivors dindt knew how to play against him and cried so he got gutted to the ground.
My Argumentation is, i know 10% was too less, because noone played the perk. Im not sure if 14% is too mutch its way to new to have tried it out. Did a couple of games as killer, it dindt seem to be mutch stronger as Pop+Pain.
Yes Thrill+Devour+Undying is a strong combo but blocks 3 perkslots.
I mean it sounds atm more like singularity is the problem and not the perk per se.
No, you are not. There are multiple posts with calculations that it does not work like that.
Checked it you are right its not fully the same time. Did you tried it out? Is it still too long? After how many totems does it feel like a "good" time?
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this post strikes me as if you are not reading what i was originally responding towards. what i was responding towards is otz's video where he uses singularity camera recovery add-on to scan the survivor across map as evidence that
- totem in not possible to cleanse
- the perk is imbalanced.
You talk a big game, but it is never, EVER going to work like you imagine. Every second wasted cleansing totems is seconds that could be spent doing the generators, or unhooking/healing a teammate.
I could just as easily reverse your statement that every second spent for killer focusing on walking to totems defending totems is time spent for killer not progressing hooking which is exactly what i wrote in my previous post.
The very good teams that play vs hexes don't need to cleanse hexes very much. you can win full hex builds without ever cleansing hexes. I know that this sounds alien and impossible to you but it really is possible. hexes builds don't have any real direct gen defence and can easily be gen-rushed. I have had many games like that as killer. Tru3 posts an exact game to describe what i am talking about.
this is a great example of how killer games can go with 4 hexes builds. even tru3 at the end of the video says that hex builds are not good at high level. they're gimmicky and rely on survivor to make mistakes to be successful.
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Actually, no, I think 28 seconds was fine. It's not clearly garbage, and there were still many ways to capitalize on it. 28 seconds is still too much where people affected by Face the Darkness cannot cleanse totems, but hey at least it was a shorter time than doctor's static blast.
I have also made a new suggestion regarding Thrill in the suggestions forums and even put a link to it here, which, funnily enough, no one seems to have read or responded to. There's other ways we can buff Thrill without making it completely unfair.
It's imbalanced and "not possible to cleanse" because .. YES, technically it is possible to cleanse, with all the right strategies and coordination, but once again we are at the conundrum where bhvr is balancing everything around high level SWF teams.
Otz's video is evidence enough how unbalanced the perk is. Just because two survivors on comms could MAYBE do it if the killer doesn't walk up to interrupt them in that entire 47 seconds does not mean it's a viable strategy, and that the buff to thrill is justifiable.
every second spent for killer focusing on walking to totems defending totems is time spent for killer not progressing hooking
Which is completely wrong, since killers also earn chases and downs by defending totems.
I really don't know what else to say to you, except play some survivor against these builds. Bring all your friends and see how fair and fun it is.
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If every solo Q team was good enough that they could make it so killers only get 3 hooks the entire game so devour never proccs and can be completely ignored then yeah maybe thrill isn't so bad.
But is that realistic of how 80% of games actually go? def not imo.
You can def ignore ruin but you can't ignore devour unless everyone on the team is good. Same goes with stuff like blood favour.
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lol getting 3 hooks is extremely easy. To expect that survivors haven't gone down at all during a match is incredibly unrealistic. Not for 80% of games, not for 10% of games, not even for 0.5% of games.
I have had my fair share of losses on killer, even quite a few 4outs, but even then, I've still usually managed to get a fair number of hooks. Sometimes to the point where everyone was hooked twice.
I still don't have access to devour by the way…. 🤣
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3 hooks? it takes 5 hooks to acquire the mori. More if the team saves survivor before killer runs away from the hook and than there is perks like deliverance that can deny devour stacks.
I still don't have access to devour by the way…. 🤣
sounds low level. if i can escape in soloq with devour hope being active for entire game, so can you.
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I love how even after posting my original thread there are still people trying to argue that Counterforce "HARD COUNTERS" Hex Totems when in reality it doesnt do much and most people have no idea how efficiency and deficiency modifiers work.
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Actually, no, I think 28 seconds was fine. It's not clearly garbage, and there were still many ways to capitalize on it. 28 seconds is still too much where people affected by Face the Darkness cannot cleanse totems, but hey at least it was a shorter time than doctor's static blast.
I mean if you ignore the facts i dont know that to do. It clearly was garbage and nobody played it and yes nearly all killers at least once tried to make it work. If you just ignore the pickrate and the facts this discussion is futile.
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And AGAIN.
The main issue with totems was their placements. The reason most people didn't bother with totem builds? Because it was too typical that the totem gets found instantly at the start of the match and then destroyed within the first 20 seconds.
For starters, totems should not be blatantly visible out in the open. They should not be near generators. And active ones should NOT be closer than 12m to a survivor spawning into the match.
If this issue was actually addressed first, like people have been asking for YEARS, then maybe pick rates would be higher, and maybe hex perks wouldn't be considered disappointing options.
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Yes and its still like this that the totems gets found instanly… Thats the point why thrill was too weak for the effect and nobody played it…
And if you make it back to 10%, nobody will play it. A Perk cannot be "fine" when nobody plays it. Its not a hard concept. If rarly anybody playes it, its too weak. For thrill you loose a perkslot, and if the effect is too weak to protect your totems its not worth it.
You are talking about Thrill+Face+The hex you want to protect. Thats 3 perkslots and not worth it with the old Thrill.
I mean i really dont understand why its so hard for you to understand that a Perk that nobody playes is obviously too weak and need to be buffed or reworked.
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The exposed does more damage than the mori though
When someone goes down to it that's when survivors are forced off gens and have to find it. Devour's mori is sometimes just a 'win more' aspect that only really comes into play if you mori a survivor who's not been hooked once which is usually unlikely since you need 5 hook stages to begin with
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Finally someone that plays the game, or at least understands it.
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so what on the exposed? you treat the game as if your playing vs tuft of hair Myer's. Devour hope at its peak strength is glorified NOED. The 4 perk slot investment to make Devour hope justifies its strength. The killer using 4 perk slots for 1 particular should grant a good effect. End games saves are more difficult when killer has exposed but at the time, the killers often play more defensive around hooks because of exit gates & pre-running. with 99% exit gates or open exit gates, you have the choice between spending extra time to save the teammate or to leave like typical noed situation. either way, the killer loses when survivor plays it correctly.
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But we say 'skill issue' to me & 'full hex builds are fine, even with ToTH' on Steam forums when I say the same thing like OtZ…
Man, these people are just mad or smtg…0 -
I mostly ignored it as it had not really affected me
Awesome, thanks for the update.
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Frankly I don't care about Otz's opinion on anything. He is a completely buck broken self hating killer main. ToTH is fine, since it made hexes relevant for the first time in literally years.
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Counterforce enough said
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You have to pay $5 to get this perk :)
This is what I call "create a problem to sell a solution."
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True, I don't have RE chapter because I'm not a fan of that game, so I dont have counterforce
Thrill is still not nerfed?
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My teammates refuse to play when they see thrill, what do you say about this? Or do you like this kind of match where everyone gives up and you destroy everyone on 4-5 gens? That's selfish then
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Wowie, you changed the first totem cleanse time from 47 seconds to 39 seconds! Good luck! 🤣
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It gets stronger as you cleanse more and more totems
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Its selfish to give up. Should killer start to stop playing whenever they see a flashlight? For some reason main survivors think that the killer is "suppost to be" play in a certain way they enjoy the most, but on the other side they can play as ruthless and dirty how they like because thats "part of the game".
I mean sure just do it, i think we should all play this way when the other team uses perks, items, addons that we dont like we just give up and let em seach new.
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Well, Killers can easily dodge the lobby when they see a flashlight, so that argument is moot. Survivors don't have that luxury; they don't see what the Killer has until they're well into the match.
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Flashlights are in nearly every match and you get a penalty for dodging. So no thats not a realistic possibility.
And your "solution" that everybody just dodged every game when he doesnt like the loadout is a as strange as your idea before that everybody just gives up in game as soon as they see the loadout (what b.t.w. killers cannot do that easily)
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Survivors giving up is big issue and has been for a long time and i frankly don't see any good solution to it. You remove the DC penality and a lot of killers would be playing a PVE game and if you get rid of survivors killing themselves of hook they would just give up by intentionally running to the killer after an unhook and trying get themselves killed.
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What penalty? There's no penalty for dodging. (Unless you count having to queue up again as a penalty.)
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True killer can check our profiles, see our items, so they easily can dodge match before it starts with no penalty, we as a survivors "have" to play match even if killer is the most sweaty player with boring totem build+thrill
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I call that s a BHVR problem. They have done this numerous times with perks. It's not my fault that BHVR uses perks as artificial balance, that's all the perk have ever been.
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