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Faster Gens for every survivor dead.
Hello, what do you think about increasing the Time survivor needs to finish a gen by for example 20% but reducung the time they need for every survivor killed by for example 40%?
I dont have concrete Numbers (so i just guess some) for it, but im sure its possible to balance it out so the winrate doesnt change. So this is not a killer nor a survivor buff.
The idea behind it is to insentivise a gameplay style where you try to hook every survivor at least once before you start going for kills because the gens are way faster as soon as the first survivor is dead.
ATM when you have 1 survivor dead at 3 gens; the game is pretty mutch gg and maybe it would be more fun if the survivors than still have a pretty good chance to finish all gens.
This Idea has to be balanced in a way that tunneling still works, but is just weaker as it is now. Its important that killing a teammate for the buff isnt a solution. So the game has to be harder with 3 people to win as with 4. So tunneling wont vanish, it will just become less common since "not tunneling" will be rewarded.
Comments
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Despite you saying it isn't a survivor buff, it is a survivor buff. Punishing killers for eliminating people isn't going to make the killer want to two hook people. You got to rebalance the game around everyone being two hooked once before anyone is eliminated and give the killer something tangible for doing it.
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Okey lets say we up the generator time by 150% so the gens take 225sec to finish. With every Gen finish its reduced by 30%.
So one Survivor dead than the gen only needs 157sec , with the second one 110,2sec when 3 survivors are dead 77sec.
Is it still a Survivor buff? Im pretty sure if you balance it like this, killer would allways have 3kills before even the first generator pops.
I dont understand how you can say "its a survivor buff" when i said its not gonna be and the killrate stays the same. One part of the Idea is a killer buff, one part of the idea is a survivor buff. You can set it so that the winrate is not affected. I hope with my example you understand how this could also be easily a killer buff if you tweak it wrong.
You got to rebalance the game around everyone being two hooked once before anyone is eliminated and give the killer something tangible for doing it.
No you dont, you just need to balance acc. to the killrate the rest will come by itself. Killer still can tunnel survivors out without a problem.
Punishing killers for eliminating people
Its more rewarding for not tunneling. If you dont tunnel you get higher gentime as reward. But you cannot just reward the killers, because if you only buff killer or only buff survivor, it will destroy the balance. Thats why a system like this has to buff/nerf both teams so you can balance it.
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Something like this has been proposed many times before. It is hard to balance things in dbd because there is causual, swf and comp.
BHVR struggles to balance because they can't deceide what kind of game they want dbd to be. If you increase the time too much the game will feel very slow and boring to survivors as a good long chase will consume resources and the reward with gens taking that much time is low. So everybody would start prerunning and hiding again.
On the other hand with the current meta gen's fly faster then ever before. You can solo a gen in 22 seconds and depending on perks and items in 15 seconds with 2 people.
While a survivor making a mistake can be outweighted by the team carrying him, a killers mistake can cost you the match and can only be outweighted by extreme game sense or survivors making a mistake.
Increasing the gen time seems necessary to me but we cannot forget about soloq player who already have a really rough time playing dbd.
Decreasing the gen time if a survivor dies would improve gameplay but this can also be abused so it's an overall sensitive topic.4 -
First of all thanks for the feedback while i agree with some of your points but disagree with some because eather nothing will change acc. to the topics or the change might the problem less
It is hard to balance things in dbd because there is causual, swf and comp.
I think the benefit will be especally against SWF, because they will try their best so survive and escape with all players, so they will have a harder game. Make no mistake, my Idea will make 4 escape (as SWF often try it) harder but it will also make 4kill games harder. Thats one of the negative points that i see, because ofc a "full win" feels good for survivor and killers and with my idea this is less likely to happen.
If you increase the time too much the game will feel very slow and boring to survivors
Agree if the time is too high this might be a problem
as a good long chase will consume resources
Agree with this, yes this could happen but im not sure if this is the problem. The problem you are facing than is because the killer is not tunneling and trying to hook everyone 1 by 1. That doesnt sounds too bad for me, thats the idea behind it.
While a survivor making a mistake can be outweighted by the team carrying him, a killers mistake can cost you the match and can only be outweighted by extreme game sense or survivors making a mistake.
Increasing the gen time seems necessary to me but we cannot forget about soloq player who already have a really rough time playing dbd.
Im not sure, how exacly would my idea make this worser? Because after this if a survivor is making a mistake and getting killed early, the team suffers less from it.
But you are right it has to be belanced in a way that the game is "easier" with 4 people as with 3 people, so sacreficing a surivor is not a viable "new" tactic
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Punishing the killer for doing their objective isn't a good idea, imho. You may well punish survivors for every gen they do at that point by survivors getting exposed status or broken if they get 3 gens done. Doesn't make any sense? Exactly.
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Gens are already fast enough as it is so why would you make gens go faster?
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True we need catch up mechanic from 2v8, game is already boring when 3 survs and 4-5 gens left thanks to boring tunnelers
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Reducing the number of survivors until all generators are complete should be an acceptable killer tactic.
If this were to happen, there would be no killer players left on the Asian servers.
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Worked horrible at 2vs8 so please don't do it again xD
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learn how to survive lol
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we should buff Fast Track to increase the survivor gen speed by 4% every time killer hooks a survivor. Sole survivor should grant 100%/150%/200% healing speed increase for 1/2/3 survivors killed. Number of tokens is increased per tier of the perk. (1/2/3). For example Tier 1 Sole survivor would be 4 →3. Tier 2 would give you 4 →3→2. Tier 3 would be 4 →3→2→1.
they would never add this as base mechanic but they could buff corresponding perks which reward survivor for losing. Fast-track being for gens and Sole survivor being for healing.
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uuu, can we get slower gens for each gens finished without any dead survivor?
Slugging would be lovely.
Just no… most features in 2v8 were highly overtuned on purpose to make it more fun for survivors, or simply more fast paced. They have no place in normal game mode.3 -
It was fine in 2v8 because it's a casual mode, it has no place in 1v4.
It does make me think about some sort of mechanic that could serve the same purpose, but isn't a free as simply increasing gen speeds the more your teammates fall. Like a "desperation" mode where you can increase the speed at which you repair a gen as teammates die, but with a requirement, like being afflicted with Oblivious and an onslaught of skill difficult checks (as if you were actually desperately focused/rushing the repair).
But I don't think we need a catch-up mechanic that simply hands survs a bonus because the killer is doing well.
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It was done in 2v8 but the implementation was flawed, seeing as survivors got a generator speed increase per hook state, rather than per death. Seeing as survivors who were on death hook could still do gens just as efficiently (or more so with the buff), this was the real problem. They should have only got bonuses to repair speed per dead survivor.
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We saw how well that worked in 2v8.
Absolutely not, not unless we hella buff Killer gen control to compensate.
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Thats the Idea, increase the Gentime when 4 people are alive, but reduce it for every survivor that dies. In the end the kill/escaperates stays the same. Its just a system change that gives you a reward for not tunneling.
You dont, you make em go slower when 4 people are allive.
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They literally tried this in 2v8, this exact mechanic, and it led to THE most Survivor-sided mode in the game's history. They tested it. They tried it. Catchup mechanics don't work because they punish the Killer for being too good… the same is true of Survivors. It punishes Survivors for playing too well. We shouldn't punish good play. That's anti-fun.
We have perks, items, and even just teaming up on gens to push gens faster. Survivors don't need more. If anything Survivors need to be able to push gens less and Killer basekit control (that is, kicking) should be stronger. Ideally no generator progression or regression ANYTHING should be above a 15-20%.
Post edited by SidneysBane1996 on1 -
Thats not the idea behind it. The idea is when the killer allready has killed a survivor, he has an easy game. When 4 survivors are allive the game is harder. Thats why as long as 4 survivors are alive, the game will be easier for killer as it is now.
The objective of the killer is not get the first kill ASAP, the objective of the killer is to kill as mutch as possible.
They did it on every hookstate to balance out the result of the game. This idea is to blance out tunneling/spreading out the hookstates. Its a different mechanic.
It still is. How i wrote on top, with balancing it is important that tunneling one survivor out is still the "best" tactic. If loosing a teammates would be too benefitary for the survivors they might implement a tactic to sacrefice one survivor at the start (what would be very unhealthy for the game). It would just switch the balance between tunneling and speading out hooks a bit more into spreading out hooks.
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The problem is that this mechanic punishes me for getting kills quickly, I surely won't just leave a deathook survivor just for the sake of my genspeed not being 800%. This doesn't even just punish me for tunneling but even if I switch between 2 people whats the maximum you can do efficiently, I'll get punished when I probably get a kill around 3 gens and it doesn't make sense at all because I didn't even tunnel but just targeted tactical.
Also it's super annoying with constantly changing genspeeds because you have constantly to think about how fast you'll lose gens if you do that specific thing now. I don't want have gens I could hold normally and next seconds I lose all of them just because I got a kill, it's just super annoying like this.
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The more you punish killers for hooking people, the more killers are going to just slug more often. Is that what we're really wanting?
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i mean that is what 2vs8 did. 1vs4 has perks to increase gen speed when you lose but the corresponding perk are probably considered like among top 10 most worthless perks for survivor. who really runs fast track or Sole survivor? i mean they can buff the perks but i sincerely don't think anyone would use them. Maybe i am wrong.
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Cant really use 2v8 as an example. That threw in absolutely unbalanced features all over the place that it's hard to tell if one particular new mechanic was actually good or bad. You had catch up mechanics, but also had instant heals, and 5 second gen repairs.
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Gens are already going fast enough as it is it but why not?
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nothing in 2vs8 is not already in 1vs4. Instant heals already exist in the form of med-kit syringe which i don't know about you, but when i play killer, i play against these syringes almost daily 2-3 in a lobby.
The 5 second repair is also in the game, it's in the form of streetwise+build to last commodus toolboxes for co-op. if you run prove thyself, you can negate co-op penalty of doing gens. it is like 30 second generator. This is less common because you need 2 player running same build but it's same concept as it was 2vs8. 1 generator class = insignificant. 4 generator class stacked in 1 gen = significant.
The catch-up mechanic is also in 1vs4 however the perk that represent this mechanic are complete total garbage. As i said, they're Fast track and Sole survivor. Sole survivor gives 75% repair bonus when you are last one alive. unlike distortion mechanic of the perk, for some reason, this perk doesn't scale with people killed. Fast track is a perk where whenever killer hook someone, you gain 3% bonus for next skill-check you hit. This is much laughably under-powered compare 5% that award in 2vs8 mode. If fast-track was award you 4% repair bonus permanently for every hook, you'd have similar effect towards catch-up mechanic of 2vs8. the two perk related to catch-up mechanic are there but they're completely irrelevant/garbage presumably because.. if these perk are good, you legit get punished for killing survivors and hooking survivors.
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