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Give me a bot instead
As a survivor can you stop giving up or killing yourself on first hook and dc instead so at least a bot keeps the game going?
But then you won't because you have mindset of me myself and I.
I'm not going to give you you or my team a good or longer game by having a bot take my place. No I got upset by the nasty killer and gave up because he didn't play fair and hit me and I just had to give up or kill myself on first hook.
Two games as ghostface last night and out of the 8 survivors 4 gave up after 1 hit. 3 killed themselves on first hook and 1 got hatch.
I think total game time for both was about 12 minutes.
Total gens completed- one.
I don't play for a 4k ever. I couldn't care less if I win or lose. I play fun killers like clown trickster deathslinger huntress ghostface and never use add-ons (as I've said before I can't be bothered reading what they do).
I play for hooks which again should be the standard by which killers are ranked not kills like last night - 7 kills but only 3 hooks. Oh that 7 kills out of 8 makes ghostface op. Nerf him.
I appreciate not all survivors play this way but if you are going to give up at the start think of your teammates instead of yourself.
And don't even think about turning this into another boring tunnelling camping slugging post and how certain killers play.
This is purely about the choice of giving up or having a bot take your place at the START of the game.
Comments
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This is the self entitlement issue which sadly just gets conditioned more and more it gets promoted and validated. I'm not even kidding when I say there are big streamers who play/stream this game daily say "X Killer, Perk, Addon, Map etc is perfectly justified to DC against" thus their following parrots and does the same because they have the mindset of "oh? big streamer says it's fine? okay I copy and do it too".
I do think the attempt unhook needs scrapping and instead specifically have it for the likes of Deliverance/Slippery Meat only as self unhook attempt just promotes people giving up at the slightest inconvenience so If people want out they take the DC penalty to which point you get a bot replacing them so at least the match isn't a total loss.
Then to combat people who commonly DC you code the game in a way where It purposely puts DC'ers in matches with and against people who also commonly DC. Eventually a selfish player would soon realise "Oh a teammate DC'ing is screwing me over and thus the match becomes unfun maybe I should consider not DC'ing" then they start learning a bit of self awareness and potentially become less selfish and play the match out.1 -
There is no real punishment for DCing or giving up so people will continue doing it. I feel like back in the day this wasn't as common as it is now. I think that the fact that there is too much of everything also plays a small part. Too many events, too many double bloodpoint earnings, too many codes etc... People used to appreciate thing more in the past. Also MMR takes place here too. Old ranks gave players an incentive to play for something. Now it's about bloodpoints which I already talked above.
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Let me preface this by stating that I don't necessarily think this is what the devs should do. I need people to understand this before I continue.
Having said that…
If you want people to stop giving up on hook, you first need to remove the d/c penalty.
Most people don't kill themselves on hook because they're spiteful or actively want to ruin the other players' matches or whatever. It's much simpler than that: Killing themselves is the fastest way to end the match without having to go through the penalty. Rarely ever is there more depth to a suicide than "I don't want to do this".
Ideally, I'd much rather have BHVR fixing the issues the game has that lead to suicides, but what those are or how to fix them is an entirely different beast that I don't want to tackle here because it'll quickly derail the thread, particularly because people don't agree on them anyway.
However, with the introduction of survivor bots, I think the removal of the d/c penalty is somewhat of a more defensible stance. After all, it doesn't leave the match in an unfair 3v1 like it did in the past. At the very least there is a substitute for the missing player, and at best, a better survivor altogether.
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Unfortunately you may have heard the community mantra of "your fun isn't my responsibility." Many players don't care about how their actions affect the enjoyment of others.
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I’d like to point out that this enduring philosophy as told by DBD killer mains only applies from killer to survivor. It does not work with survivor to killer or survivor to survivor. Survivors are responsible, somehow, for the fun of killers and survivors are also responsible for their own fun. The only people not responsible for anyone’s fun but their own are killers.
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I mean am sure these killer players know why, but they refuse to just admit it. If patch 6.1 to now seem to not give them any hints, what else can we say?
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I’ve only ever seen this argument leveled against survivors from killers. Interestingly, when survivors complain about things like tunneling and camping the argument is that the fun of survivors is not the killer’s responsibility. However! I never see this argument when killers complain about things like sabo squads (I haven’t seen one in years), flashlights, or I guess teabagging. At that point it’s let treat this with the seriousness it deserves. If someone dare says the fun of killers is not the survivor’s responsibility they are derided and/or black-balled by the forum killer mains here. It’s curious.
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That's why hook suicide needs to go. It eliminates the purpose of the dc penalty. I'll usually just slug them to death if they try to suicide
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Devs should analyze situations when someone DC/gives up and find some patterns:
- Maybe on some killers DCs are worse because they are just unfun to face or are just difficult to face.
- How that game went that someone tried to give up (save hook states of other survivors).
- What was the killer build, how many regression events there were on specific gens.
Investigate why someone tries to give up and implement stuff to prevent some kind of things from happening.
Sure, someone might give up from silly reasons, but this also could be seen in this data.
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FYI people give up against GF cause hes one of the most unfun killers to play against. Its not the right behavior but this is why they do it.
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But you can't just say that. You can't say, "I don't like this killer. I get to rage quit." It's childish, and it messes up your teammates' game.
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I agree it's wrong no argument there.
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Most intelligent reply. BHVR has fostered this with how they've balanced the game as well. Killers are really the only people enjoying the game from both entertainment and winning standpoint.
Bots was never added to support survivors because there was actually a dev patch note where they nerfed them. It was to directly to help killers with their specific achievements, etc.
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I'm lost on what y'all are talking about, for the most part. Something about 6.1.0, the patch that was a downplayed major survivor buff, because most of the killer buffs got done away with?
But killers not caring about the survivors' fun is sound logic, because to most people caring about their fun is playing bad on purpose. "Don't tunnel someone out, because it's mean! Who cares if it's the objective best play?!" But when we flip it and say survivors don't care about the killer's fun, that means gen rushing, generally. I don't have a problem if they just do the gens fast and win. I have a problem with the game state that allows that, not them... unless they want to be toxic and showboat about it.
To me, when survivors SWF up and go all-in on flashlight saves, sabo, or Head-On, that's not simply not caring about the killer's fun. That's going out of their way to give the killer a bad time, because again, if they just wanted to win, they'd simply gen rush. All that other stuff is them wanting him to get stunned over and over. And while it's less efficient than rushing gens, it allows 1-2 survivors on gens to keep knocking them out, so they're essentially bullying the killer while not being slowed much at all on their objective for doing so. That's not right.
Also, I've never heard "the killer's fun is the survivors' responsibility" from anybody. More often, I've heard so-called killer mains talking about supposed "sportsmanship" and "giving a fighting chance" to the survivors. How come? I don't know. I've never been one to give up a free win to give the other side a chance to beat me. To me, that's toying with people.
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It's honestly painful playing this at times. Good games this morning, jump on this evening and it's suicide on hook simulator. Doesn't matter if you have 3 gens about to pop. Survivor, gets hooked after a decent chase? Suicide.
The killer has 3 hooks in total, 2 gens left, survivor gets hooked. Suicide.
It's every game this evening. Why do these idiots even bother playing at this point? It's not even against Blights, Billy or Nurses. The killers don't make a difference. It's just pathetic.
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Yeah it generally is. I kind of take the view though that alot of people play both sides, usually with a preference of course, but the same killers who don't care whether the survivors have fun probably also don't care whether their team mates have fun when they play survivor.
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ThIs is true yet I cant seem to find which patch it was but the bots have been significantly nerfed in chase. They will literally double back alot and do things like revault even knowing its a hit. Heck they just seem to run staight now, no attempts to dodge say a hatchet.
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Do they "all" go in or just two?
I personally really enjoy groups where all four survivors try to "bully" me as killer. I play this game for chases and interaction. Spreading out and doing gens is the least interactive thing to do as a survivor. Same is tunneling as a killer.
Most of the time, a whole team going for blinds, saves and stuns throw the game anyway if the killer is competent enough.
Regarding the fun - aspect though, it is debatable if the survivors dont care about the killers fun at all. They rarely do gens, therefore providing the killer with more time to kill them. They offer the strongest slowdown imaginable. As you pointed out, killers dont like it when gens get done too fast, so survivors that go in to be done with them as quickly as possible "dont care about the killers fun".
I guess this solely comes down to the mindset of both sides and what they consider the other sides actions to be fun for them. Some survivors enjoy getting tunneled, some dont. Some killers enjoy "bully"-squads, some dont.
I do. I give up free wins to give people a chance to beat me. Why? I dont like free wins. I like to work for my wins and if they result in a loss, I dont really mind because I have nobody else to blame for than myself. I found the most interesting and entertaining matches to be close ones. If you have the opportunity for a "free win", the match presumably wasnt that at all. I dont mind giving my opponent a bit of room for error if it results in a more entertaining experience for everyone.
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that's griefing and it should be bannable every time.
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