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Freddy Potentially A Slug Monster with new kit
His new kit has an ability that allows you to teleport to asleep survivors that are healing and this applies to healing slugs. I find it highly likely as a result of this that one of the most effective ways to play freddy will be a slug only no hook playstyle. This will effectively create the problem that the OG freddy had on his first release that gives you a warning that your slugs are being picked up, especially if you use the new iri addon to see all asleep survivor auras freddy will be a very high pressure slug machine and I really don't think this is a healthy or fun playstyle. Freddy's healing teleportation and killer instinct should not apply to survivors who are in the dying state
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100% agreed. I think the teleporting to healing survivors is completely fine as long as it doesn't affect downed survivors. If it stays the way it is now, Freddy will just be yet another killer hated by almost the entire survivor community.
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This is 100% the reason dying Survivors automatically wake up. As long as you wake up often (or before you pick up slugs) it should be fine, but I see the potential for concern.
It's way easier to wake up now, I'm unsure if it will end up being a major problem but we'll have to see if it'll be obnoxious in practice when Live hits.
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This is true, 110% Freddy's design should not encourage excessive slugging, so I recommend no teleport or killer instinct warning on dying survivors. This will 100% become a problem for new or casual players if we dont address this before his release.
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It has to be made expressively clear to everyone who plays Survivor that healing a survivor while asleep will reveal you.
Constructive Feedback:
- Add a Loading screen tip when facing the Nightmare explaining this.
- Make a sound, or visual indication that this is the case. Maybe play a sound of Freddy laughing, this way you know he knows.
I mean honestly with the many Killers in this game, the tips that play during the loading screen during the first matches with said Killer should appear in every match, we have to move away from keeping the Killer in a match a secret, there is just too much info.
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Hmmm... with that you might have a potential issue where there is a frame perfect thing to not heal someone as they transition from the dying to injured state… He gets that 3 second extension so even if you heal a pixel as they stand up, he can still TP to you.
The player downed is always woken up... maybe just a simple 1-2 second delay on the healing killer instinct would resolve the issue?
You pick up a fully recovered survivor within less than a second, Freddy then has to react, then has 2.5s to transition and the teleport will be targetted on the healing survivor, not the downed one.
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freddy gets punished for slugging because when you hit a survivor into dying state, they escape dream world. you get punished for doing well as killer.
He is below average killer in current state. It's like he went from F-tier to D-tier.
they should not wake up.
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Even if you do think he's D tier... which I think is a stretch... isn't your point here basically advocating for making him viable by always trying to slug the whole team?
If his power needs to be stronger (which I'm not sure it does), that seems a rather ill-advised route to achieving it...
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100% agree with this. That proposed change is exactly the healthy change they need to add (speaking as a p100 freddy main). Im fine with it because i've played him so many games now on the PTB and I can safely say that the slug playstyle is completely unfair towards the survivors.
I still think that his pallets are too weak tho and that it is too easy to wake up, other than that he seems to be a decent killer overall. Just fix the unfair stuff and his laughable and useless pallets.
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He should be stronger through map-pressure because thats what Freddy is supposed to be all about when in the dream. The fact that we have a dream mechanic to freddy should mean easy balance for the bhvr because getting out means you're completely safe against Freddy right? Sad thing is we do not have the old version of Freddy not being able to pull people in dreams or being invisible unable to target back because then we could have had an easy balance field day.
Him having this huge weakness of not being able to do jack all towards awake survivors means that his power could be very very good after they are in fact in the dream. This is as they say in soccer: "Huge missed opportunity for them".
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it's not a stretch. literally otz rates freddy as 2nd worst killer in the game. he thinks skull merchant is worse. while i do think skull merchant is very bad, She has potencial vs worse players. -this is tangent, back to main topic.
In all freddy iterations, he was viable because of slugging. it is that first version, the one that generalIV talk about, back old dbd, very few players understand how to play killer. the concept of hit & run and like slugging were non-existent. nobody back in 2017. well… some players did but 98% of players did not. his first version was good at hit & run with low TR. he had slug potencial due to dream world debuff. Later in his 2nd rework, they moved action speed into his add-on which was often coined as "Forever freddy". This version was strong at slugging as well. They did not bring that back as some players express discontent playing against him where he got virtually deleted for perceived unfun play-style by survivor players.
So now we are 3.0 freddy where freddy can teleport to injured survivors and pressure survivors healing survivors. he's suppose pressure people through mobility. information and slugs. that is where we're at.
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I mean I think there is a miscommunication?
You are saying he's F tier going up to D tier… I don't think these proposed changes put him in D tier… I'd say at least he's as good as Clown, because he has a similarly effective slow as Clown, that doesn't require a LoS to hit, it's a similar skillshot to Pyramid Head Punishment of the Damned, with a faster startup, faster recovery, much lower slowdown on Freddy himself, and only 5s cooldown, and he has the major advantage over Clown of not being limited by poor map traversal… so based on that alone, he's a minimum of C tier… and likely higher. Please clarify what makes him D tier, cause it isn't difficulty keeping people asleep, as there seems to be very little issue putting people asleep most of the time, usually taking 1 hit of his snare to do it in all the games I've seen people play thus far.
If we're gonna talk about how slugging was so strong and how you're supposed to play him, it's worth bearing in mind that BHVR have walked back on both of those reworks… so it doesn't seem like making a killer exceptional at slugging is good for the game… another great example is Twins, who are one of the most deadly sluggers in the game and only not a problem cause killers don't want to play them.
Now in fairness Matthieu Cote has gone on record as saying changing OG Freddy was a mistake, but if slugging players in the dream was the most effective gameplay loop, it's not hard to see why players rebelled on mass… and based on your arguments thus far, your stance seems to be "Yes, make him exceptional at slugging, cause that's how to make him strong"… which is not giving you much credibility on realising the goal of making a fun and engaging power….
You seem to be in favour of making the power cheap and lame to play against…. which again… is not healthy for the game…
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clown can lop bottles over loops in an arc to avoid LOS problem. he also has haste bottles and hindered bottles which is 25% collective speed around loops. it is very significant increase in speed for chases and anti-shift w play.
freddy hindered is 12% which is worse chase. Since his 2nd rework, He's been more on lines of a killer that focuses more on macro gameplay with a little bit of chase but not fully specializing chase. The problem is that they gutted his macro play to the ground and they also gutted his chase to borderline useless which is why Otz rated him so poorly. many player agree with freddy being in a poor spot.
His chase is better but it's marginally better and it is add-on dependant. His macro play about as bad as before. If they buff his macro play, he'll be around B-tier average killer with slugging. if they bring back his action speed mechanics back, he might be top-tier killer again but I highly doubt they will buff so significantly to make him high-tier killer. At this point, it's just asking for bare minimum for his kit to function.
Now in fairness Matthieu Cote has gone on record as saying changing OG Freddy was a mistake
I agree but we're long past that. move on from past. look into the future.
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I did run into this a couple times yesterday and I think it would be best if the healing teleport/killer instinct just didn't work on healing actions involving survivors in the dying state. While you can negate Freddy's teleport by having the healer wake up first, this still indirectly buffs slugging and it shouldn't really be encouraged.
So I'd just make it where Freddy cannot use dream projection in this case and once the survivor is returned to the injured state give a 0.5 - 1 second buffer for the survivor to stop healing them safely before they get revealed on killer instinct. I would then also revert the change to waking up when downed back to when hooked instead since there'd no longer be a reason for that nerf.
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I don't know, majority of the community agreed that Old Freddy was trash and the only thing that he had was his "uniqueness" to him, that being the ability to wait for 7 seconds before you could hit a survivor. The counterplay is already in the patch notes. Survivors are woken up when they enter the dying state and can't enter the dreamworld when they are downed, the only way that Freddy could telelport to the survivor that is reviving them is they are asleep in the first place and considering that there are 5 ways to get out of the dreamworld, i don't see any reasons why survivors shouldn't get out of the dreamworld in the first place. The most common and easiest way to do so is to use an Alarm Clocks which they made even easier now since you can use any Alarm Clock on the map. Dreamworld as a whole has been changed into an anti-heal strat for Freddy which like i stated before, you can deny pretty easily.
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Every killer is a potential slug monster it mostly just depends on if there is a monster behind the controller/keyboard
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Just make it so Dying state and Unhooked survivors can't be TP too
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