General Discussions
General Discussions
"Go next" prevention cant get here soon enough...
Comments
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None of that has anything to do with what I stated or of reality. SWF's don't "go next", they play until the end or (very rarely) all DC at once, they don't give up on hook at 5 gens, 10 seconds into the match. SoloQ though is who "goes next" and I stated, because you didn't even respond to what I actually said, is that the penalty being rained down onto SoloQ is just simply going to deter people from playing altogether and Killers are going to be left with SWF matches and probably increased queues times as well.
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There is a “rage quit” option for reporting. I usually do it whenever someone quits very quickly. I’m unsure if it actually does anything but, I do it anyway.
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Its still a repeated and beaten topic. People get it. Its happening. BHVR has stated they are doing something. What is the point of continuing making these? Genuinely asking. Personally, I love repeat topics if it adds more to things for discussion. But I cant see what was added here that wasn't already there.
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Your first mistake was equipping perks on pig that's kinda toxic
Side not this vote up vote down thing was an utter mistake
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I feel that they should fix tunneling before going-next because one may be causing the other.
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With less people doing go next, I'm quite curious how much kill counts will drop on statistics.
That being said, if someone gives up on hook early instead of leaving a bot for their team, I usually declare the match a bust right then and there and let the remaining survivors escape, or I'll stop on their second hook then let them go. Sucks that they are gutted from the beginning because of someone with a lack of sportsmanship.
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Couldnt be anymore on point. Encore Maestro as I was trying to get the same point across. Say it again.
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So their frustration should trump the other players' ability to the play the game. And then once the thing they're frustrated with gets removed, surely they won't continue to DC because of other things they suddenly find frustrating.
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The reason I mentioned 'skill issue' commentary is because these kinds of complaints often carry an undertone that the problem is with other players rather than the game itself. Even if you didn’t explicitly discuss chases, the way the post frames players giving up as irrational or baseless makes it feel like another 'players are bad' discussion rather than something new. That’s why I found it low quality and downvoted it—it's just the same frustration being voiced again without adding much new insight.
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As a killer player I would much rather wait a bit longer and face a SWF than deal with all these DOA matches where people go next right away. I'd rather take the hit to my win percentage than have half my matches be a farce, and it would waste less time than longer queues.
As a survivor player, my teammates bailing is by far my biggest issue with solo queue. Tunneling/slugging absolutely pale in comparison when it comes to ruining my fun.
Tunneling is never getting fixed. Ever. The reason why is that it is a player problem first and foremost. And making it so tunneling is tantamount to throwing the game isn't gonna work, because it already is for most people that do it. There's no magic bullet to stop tunneling, and if that is what people are waiting for, they may as well just quit the game. It isn't coming.
And some people must not have been paying attention for the last eight years, as imbalance is the name of this game. It will never be perfectly balanced, Thanos isn't the lead dev at BHVR.
That is just to say people saying "fix your game and there won't be a reason to go next" might as well just move on if balance is what they are waiting for. It certainly isn't sufficient justification to bail on every match you don't like.
Beating dead horses is what drives traffic here on the DBD forum, lol. Like half the topics posted here are just echoes of arguments that have been going on for years.
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That's a you issue. When I play Killer I don't camp/tunnel/slug so I don't have SoloQ players going next or really even that many DC's. When I can tell that they are not doing so great, even if they are in a SWF, I even ease up so that they can actually play the game a bit, which I know is probably a shocking concept for someone like you.
IDC if you'd wait longer for a SWF match, that has nothing to do with what I posted. The issue with SoloQ is not the teammates, it's that the game lets Killers treat SoloQ like it's a SWF. I'm not going to blame randoms for not wanting to waste some of their life in a random online match that they don't want to be in and I'm also not going to blame Killers for playing ultra sweaty because they are used to SWF matches, I blame the Devs for allowing the game to get this horrible. It's up to BHVR to make the game fun and worth the time, not the players.
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The best way to solve go next is to allow survivors pick 2 killers and 2 maps they never want to play on and you will see go next die a natural death. Most players go next because they either don't want to play against certain killer or on certain maps.
It's not an excuse I know but some players have phobias and react to different sounds different. Some may be high blood pressure and don't want to face jump scare killers, they want to know when a killer is coming.
Ithe same way some people can play killer because of motion sickness as a result of First person view.
Fir me don't like to face the ballsack and the unknown and I don't like Hawkins lab and The Nostromo Wreckage, next to midwich elementary School.
I don't go next but I'm sure not enjoying the match there.
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I'm gonna respond to this in parts. Your example of motion sickness is fine, but generally ppl who suffer from it just avoid those killers or... just avoid the role entirely. BHVR has made steps to help with some of the most egregious examples by tweaking Clown's gas bottles to give you a nice dot to look at to help and stuff like that. Things like the Clown's gas that you have no control over has been tweaked. Things that you DO have control over like Playing Nurse is fully on you.
As far as handling different phobias and such... If you have a strong phobia like that, maybe you shouldn't be playing a horror game/ horror themed game with those aspects. It would be silly to have a phobia about Clowns and play Killer Clowns from outer space expecting the devs to give you an option to remove the Clowns. I'm not trying to be exclusive here, but just saying not EVERY game is going to appeal to every person and there's nothing wrong with that. Theres plenty of non-clown games out there for ppl with that phobia. Same thing with your high blood pressure. If it's a serious problem to be spooked, don't play the horror game.
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I get what you’re saying, and I’m not asking for killers to be removed or for the game to cater to every individual issue. My point is that allowing players to ban two killers and two maps would help reduce the number of people dodging matches, which is already happening anyway.
This wouldn’t change the core of the game, and it wouldn’t impact the experience for people who don’t use the system. It just gives players a way to avoid the matchups they personally don’t enjoy while letting the devs actually punish the "go next" players instead of just hoping they’ll stick around. Most people dodge because of specific killers or maps—not because they don’t like the game itself. This would just help keep games going more smoothly.
Its better to do that than to eliminate 1000s of players from the game
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Having a killer ban like your saying though WOULD affect others though. An easy example would be Wesker after his release. He was SO popular for the longest time that plenty of ppl hated him from the sheer amount he was picked. If the ban function was allowed, those players would have a HUGE wait time as all of a sudden Weskerphobia is spreading and wildly contagious.
Similarly, you also have to remember SWFs exist. It's not just 1 or 2 killers/maps being removed. It would be 4 or 8.
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I think it depends on whether it's a four-person team or a two-person team. Personally, I don't get upset when someone gives up on the hook.
What gets annoying is when two people do it at the very beginning of the match.
Penalizing the last two players because one of them gets hooked and gives up to benefit the other person feels like complete nonsense.
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Quick question: why is rage quiting common with survivors more than killers? Is it possible that the killer derives more fun for unfair play styles and tactics. If survivors know they will be banned for rage quitting and still do it doesn't that tell you something is very wrong?
You tunnel someone of the hook 3 times and the person is supposed to smile and play the next game happily (everyone is not a streamer)
Then we have chaos shuffle ( 2 people were given no mither and no perks to help them run or hide) they got tunnelled out of the game quick what did you expect the remaining two to do? Do gens and have fun? No, the remaining two are demoralized and less inclined to play.
Just asking, please don't shoot the Inquisitive student
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Killers don't have an option to ragequit without penalty. The killer players that DO ragequit arnt able to keep doing it because they can't get into a match again.
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This.
Half of the "Go Next" and "DC" mentalities would leave, if BHVR actually stood by their community and made soloQ less miserable because that's a good majority of community in DBD - Solo Q.
If BHVR decided to smell the roses and improve Soloq, the state of the game wouldn't be as horrendous as it is now and we'd be seeing alot less "Go next" players and dcers and that's just the simple truth.3 -
No matter how I put this, it's gonna sound like I'm condoning Go Next or DCing but at the end of the day, you can't really stop players from deciding to leave the game if they DONT want to be in a match anymore lol. People will find ways around NOT playing a match they won't find joy in.
A solid case and point is the DC penalty that was added. When people were punished for dcing? What did they do? They gave up on hook, which is a mechanic of the game you can't really stop or prevent.
What this simply falls down to is an issue of players being players and a group of devs choosing to ignore their players and when players are outraged by an killer, update, or survivor?
They don't play the game as intended and instead, they find work arounds to make the game as miserable as possible for both sides.2 -
if BHVR actually stood by their community and made soloQ less miserable
Our question is: how?
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There's plenty of ways to do so, but here's a start.
- Unnerf Medkits
- Finisher Mori can't be activated unless the survivor is on death hook and they're the last in trial. (Which isn't always the case.)
- If a killer is Camping a slugged player, increase their recovery speed by 30%. ( At least till they're at least 40 meters out of range, so no TR camping.)
I can't say I speak for everyone, but I know that Nerfing the Self-healing of Medkits was NOT a good change. Finisher Moris should never be guaranteed, I still don't know why they added this, it only incentivized slugging WAYYYY more.
And slugging is self-explanatory. No, i did not say give Survivors base kit Unbreakable, I just said to increase their recovery speed.
Of course, all of these are opinionated and subjective, but at least I came with ideas.-2 -
BHVR:
"We want to bridge the gap between soloQ and SWF"
Also BHVR:
"You dont get communication or coordination in a team game, but get punished all the same"-1 -
I've noticed some Survivors are changing their gamer tag to indicate that they "Go Next".
I think I've seen 3 since Monday that say something like "S-Tier = Go Next" or "[insert killer name] = DC"
I do appreciate the Warning as I can look for a different lobby.
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Ppl have had names like Doctor=DC FOREVER. I remember seeing that alot back when I played on PC before crossplay.
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Oh wow. I've never seen anything that blunt before this week. At least not that I know of. Perhaps I'm paying more attention because I'm dreading every match, on both sides.
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I mean I agree you shouldn't be doing this regardless, but it is for sure a solo q issue 99 % of the time.
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I hope it doesnt, just got out of a game and honestly just about done until 2v8 comes back.
Guy just sits within range to camp, but not anti-camp, tunnels one out. 5 gens 0 pressure on them. 2 other teammates picking their nose, role playing, … honestly who knows.
Was looking at both of them closer than me for the save with kindred, and they just let it happen. One of them just kind of stood there looking at the killer.
The sable went stage II for free. And got tunneled out after FINALLY, I traded after crossing the map for it, since noone else wanted to do anything.
The only person wanting to do any teamwork in a team game, was me. Yet I get punished for it.No I am leaving, except I cant because someone unhooks my stage II. Killer slugs me to camp the slug after. DCd took the penalty.
Just a regular… what is it, its not even thursday yet.1 -
I refuse to play modifiers anymore, so been just solo'Qing up today.
First two games had team mates bringing coin offerings and opening every chest on the map. Is there a tome or something?
Third game had a Onryo who tried to tunnel me out but couldn't get the second down. Gave up and stomped through my other team mates. Stared me down for a moment in the hall then mori'd me. Not a game I can complain about I suppose lol.
And (5 minutes ago) just had a game where two survivors both just sought out the killer and kept pointing at him. Killers seemed confused and after spotting me in a distance shaking my head, he chased me, downed me, let me wiggle off, and chased me again. Gens eventually got done and He let me and another go while killing the two jerks.
Wednesday is wacky wonker Wednesday it seems
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Well due credit, that third one isn't one we've seen yet.
- Having a way to heal yourself 16 seconds multiple times does not seem like an objectively good idea to us. Maybe a buff to them sure, but completely undoing the nerf isn't the way to go.
- Putting the conditions on the finisher mori, as satisfying as that would admittedly be, won't solve much. Unless the problem is just being moried. It just goes back to normal slugging for the 4k.
- "Camping" is a bit vague but regardless of that how would it make "soloQ less miserable"? The slugged is still a slug, they have the killer on them, and at best they're at "need help to be picked up" quicker...with said killer still on them and all the teammates probably trying to get them up.
Bar maybe that first one, we don't see something that would solve soloQ major problems we see which we can boil into its simplest form of players doing whatever. Killers being jerks, teammates trying to "get out" on first hooks for reasons we can only guess, teammates prioritizing their rift over everything else, etc. For us at least the only real problem that creates misery is other people.
They gave the hud which if people used some brain power is enough to get through average games. Would more be nice? Sure. Do we need people explicitly telling us everything via communication? Nope.
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Every single team game has some form of communication.
A ping wheel with callouts would be sufficient. Anything. ######### sake.
Christ. Anything in life as a team, you have some form of communication.
The people at BHVR just eradically walking around and doing things at their office everyday???
NO!!!!
The whole idea of a team, breaks down when there is >0< communication.
A hud telling you what other people are doing is not good enough. Not even a tenth good enough, to allow for coherent team play in DBD.
If BHVR wants to insist on 0 communication in any form, they have to restructure this game from the bottom up honestly. SoloQ is just a wipefest with all these killer updates, which only are for the SWF complaints.
Roll the dice, hope the killer is an idiot, and you might just win/the match wont be done at 5 gens = soloQ.
Players should not be punished because
:16th brains, or silly challenges, or insert excuse here….
I should not be punished okay? If timmyshinsmcgee over here wants to stare down the killer and spam point at him, while my teammate goes stage II for free.1 -
Is anything in this game as complicated as a studio that makes games? Can tell you nothing in this game is even remotely that complicated. We see someone on hook and 2 not on gens via hud, we work on gens as we can make a pretty good guess that either 1 of those 2 is going to get that unhook, or something bad has happened (them trolling or killer camping) that caused them to not get it. We see both them get chased? Ohh thats probably a sign that we'd need to go try and do something. The killer stopped chasing someone as soon as the unhook happened? They probably coming back to tunnel.
If everyone knows what they're doing (admittedly a somewhat tall ask at this point) then yes, we feel its enough to get by in average matches. You don't need to have the killer be an idiot, you just need teammates who aren't idiots.
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You could say that about any game.
The fact that every single change happening to dbd, specifcally on the killer side of things with buffing them.
Is because of SWF.
Killers are not being changed or buffed because of soloQ.
They have to start changing what soloQ's issues are. And its issues is its not a team game. Because you cant communicate with each other.-3 -
Getting team mates who aren't idiots is also a tall ask. If they were idiots, or new, or whatever you want to label as a reason for not good play, then giving communication seems like a good choice to shore this up. It wont affect SWF, it will only help Solo'Q.
I believe you're right that your scenario can carry out well most of the time. But is it enough? At the moment, I don't feel like it is. Games are too similar for me to play more than a few nowadays. Its either a tunnel/slug out the gate or team mates that suck at direction/objectives/looping. I just want variety back and 'good' matches, the kind that are close and get the blood going a bit. Its just more rare now and I'd personally enjoy that coming back.
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We were forced to admit it's a tall ask…
Giving communication doesn't exactly shore up people doing dumb things. For example had a game at lerys a couple days ago where 2 ppl, for some reason (hey look, shiny flashlights), refused to touch gens as long as someone was being chased and would go and look for the chase. The expected outcome happened (with a twist but that's a whole story). Maybe we're being pessimistic here, but we don't think any pings or even verbal communication would fix that.
We can debate if the hud is enough forever if you want, we really just wanted to point out that there have been tools given and are very good tools if used well enough (though adding somethings would be nice). We agree that games that get the blood going are rare, but we're not exactly convinced that adding a lot more communication is going to fix that problem for reasons like the above.
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We're fairly confident that every killer change is not tied to SWFs. Hell we're confident not every change is tied to survivors in general.
So we want to point out that DBD is not your standard "team" game. Despite the fact that everyone, including us, uses the term "teammate", it's 1 killer against 4 different survivors who want out, aka 1 v (1v1v1v1). As survivor, your not graded based on the whole team, only your own efforts. Survivors are only a "team" in that working together usually is the best chance at escaping. Hard to explain but your both a team player while looking out for yourself.
Second is that having communication doesn't make a "team" game. Having communication doesn't inherently fix the teammates themselves. In our game shared with Spare_Them_Mori_Me, the problem wasn't communication, it was (to our eyes) self destructive lunacy. We'd get trying once or twice especially if the killer was nearby, those ones we're going every single chase off to who knew where hunting for it.
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Every change to killer side for buffs is the direct result of complaining how "underpowered" they are.
Like none of the killer changes needed to happen at all in the grand scheme of this game. This includes last years billy blue overdrive.
I quotation underpowered because this only applies in SWF cases. Just scour the forum for all changes that apparently need to happen.
Legion changes is a good example. Perfectly fine killer I main it. But apparently needed all these changes and updates.
Plague another one I main people are asking for changes as well. Perfectly fine killer.
Look at the flame turret debacle for Alien. The changes were done directly for soloQ, and their inability to coordinate turrets. Youll just have teammates waste them, put them in places they dont need to be placed, or take extras they dont need. Having one do as much as it did with the first changes was a buff to soloQ.
But as usual, this would be too powerful for SWF. Was complained about. So it was reverted.
So, every update to the killers is directly catered towards the high end of survivor play. And not the average.
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If it is truly 1v1v1v1v1 then there is no way they can keep the game designed the way it currently is. You shouldnt be held hostage by your "teammates" as they arent even your team at the point.
Winning wouldnt mean 3k/4k on killer if things are 1v1v1v1v1.
TCM for all its problems, did this so much better. Not just on communication, because you actually have that in that game. But also agency in your own play. You arent effected or held hostage by your team. You can just leave.2 -
Those all buff SWF as well
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So we got a question, which survivors wanted those terror radius changes? Some got bigger, some smaller. Having a bigger radius on Billy or Blight seems like it helps all survivors. Those legion changes seem in response to messing with the mend timer cause people complaining about "mend simulator" or the like. How about those small little buffs to Chucky? Those don't seem tied to any survivors and seems like an attempt to make playing as him (or her for Tiffany) feel better. Most changes are because of people whining, not tied to SWFs or solo. It's because people just don't stop complaining and the devs trying to please the masses (success rate varies).
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You realize that the game has been this way for close to 9 years now and is still kicking strong despite the community semi sabotaging itself right?
How are they holding you hostage exactly? Body blocks? Reportable and actually against how a game is supposed (using this term very loosely) to go. Excessively hiding? Good news, the devs are actually addressing this soon. Your perfectly capable of leaving without your team helping, it's just a lot harder. Players have agency, it's just most in DBD like to either abuse or be lunatics with that agency (slugging, tunneling, 3 gen camping, leaving teammates for dead, self-destructive tendencies in trying to blind the killer over everything else, using everything on the map for yourself, it's a bloody long list)
You also realize that the killer is a vastly different role than survivor right? You can have a 3k be a win for killer while having the 1 survivor that escaped win too.
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I only try to go next if I’m running the killer in long chases and gens are not getting done, because why should I be forced to stay in a match if my teammates aren’t doing anything???
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So nerfs and buffs come in different magnitudes.
The TR changes arent what we really think in overal power. Im talking major changes that happen.
In which case for the TR changes its 50/50. There were complaints, still are about ghostface/pig/SM.
Billy blight TR changes wont do jack though. They move so fast that it doesnt matter what their TR is. (obviously not being stupid small would matter) But base radius versus an extra 8 is not going to change anything about those killers.
Not to mention most billy players play with some sort of stealth perk anyways.
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Game has been going strong because its cornered the market. There just is no other option.
Taking the game hostage as in you are now in a match, where you have teammates, who are not interested in playing the game normally. (refusing to participate in normal gameplay).
By sitting there and pointing at the killer. Hiding. Not progressing generators. Not saving. Not saving at the right time. etc.
Its a match that should not have happened. But you are there with them.
The fact that you can have these even happen is the issue. "abuse cases" "lunatics"
3k wouldnt be a win if you are going against people that are handing you the game. Which is currently the majority of soloQ games.
Throws.0 -
The point is that the changes are not all tied to survivors. Not what they do, if they're effective, not how strong, not anything else except to prove our point.
-----why the line?-------bullets better!-----hahaha…------
There were other options but they failed. From what we heard VHS made the monster role miserable and from what we experienced from Texas Chainsaw the "communication" was an annoying experience along with the killer role more relying on teamwork than the survivors. There were also other games that tried to be the asym champ but DBD currently for good or ill has a formula (and we should add icons) that people like more than anything else.
We don't call that taken hostage. Your free to try and do gens to get out after all. The problem is you can't force ppl to play how you want. Unless the devs completely railroad players, they will always have freedom, and that double edged sword come with this as we all see. Your not forced to save that amazing team player survivor off hook just like your not forced to save that taunting sandbagging arse at the endgame and freely leave. To us at least that freedom is something we like about it even though it comes with problems.
Now tell us, how is more communication going to fix this? Going to magically force others to listen?
3k wouldnt be a win if you are going against people that are handing you the game. Which is currently the majority of soloQ games.
So first this is your opinion. There's a thread recently asking about what ppl consider wins and we saw a good handful saying 3k = win. Didn't specify how they got it. Second, survivors throwing isn't exactly on the killer is it? Third, why does it matter if a 3k is a win or not in this whole conversation? We kinda just realized we don't know why we're rambling about win conditions of all things here.
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What exactly do you think this going to prevent? People will just sit there and do nothing. Afk/DC penalty? They'll just find something else to do or quit playing entirely. Maybe we should be focusing on why so many survivors give up so quickly. A lot of times they know if they get hooked first they'll get camped or tunneled out. And the whole stay in the match for your teammates is a joke. Half of survivors you get matched up will leave you on hook to die or won't ever take a hit for you.
Either make it possible so survivors still have a chance to play the match fairly or watch things continue as is.
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If ppl are at that point where they're assuming the worst the second they get on hook, why bother logging on? So many ppl are killing themselves before the killer can even turn around, let alone camp and tunnel. If THOSE ppl wanna uninstall the game, I'm not gonna shed a tear about them leaving.
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Any buff to Survivors buffs SWF and that's something that has to be lived with, tbh.
SWF are always going to be more powerful because it's communication and planning ahead of time in comparison to being thrown into a match with a bunch of randoms. That's something that really can't be avoided.1 -
Then wouldn't killers need buffs to be able to stay against swfs?
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Its not going to fix it but it creates a no excuse scenario and we can start to get rid of these players that just dont want to play the game as intended. Or stick them in some que where they can sandbag their hearts out.
A game like the one I described yesterday should not happen. Not only does it happen, it happens at a very high rate.
If you wanna role play and start pointing at people, not saving, not progressing the game normally, hiding, queing up with a key and a plan to abandon everyone; while having communication enabled, there's no excuse to play like that anymore. And it should be reportable.
Kind of like LoL with people throwing and it being an actual bannable offense.
Again TCM gameplay wise, is just better because of things like this. However it just isnt popular and doesnt have all the "fortnite" esque drive to it.
IE
1) Skins
2) Reward Track
3) Licenses
4) Pop culture
Coupled with its pretty abysmal launch with cheaters and what not. Which funny enough DBD is seeing a rise in again in recent months. Maybe if they keep improving it rather than it fizzling out who knows, I enjoyed its short run0 -
No.
Because that's how we GOT into this situation to begin with.
That is literally how SoloQ got so miserable, a domino effect of SWF being so OP and powerful and Killers complaining, then survivors complaining, then Killers complaining then survivors complaining in an endless loop of agony and misery.
At some point, people have to come to terms with certain things and inevitability, SWF is one of them.0 -
Well now we see a slippery slope.
So how does giving communication, via ping or verbal, create this "no excuse scenario"? More to the matter what exactly is a "no excuse scenario"? Since the excuse is "I have the freedom to do what I want"…having the ability to let them know something doesn't…fit…as a way to say "you can't do this" to us… are we missing a piece here?Ignoring that train of thoughts for a bit lets say we wanted to finish our rift challenge of the white glyph. While trying to sneak to the basement with it lets say someone pings "GET ON A GEN". Obviously we ain't going to listen to that till we finish so to them we're probably a lunatic whos looking for the basement. We can even defend the two in our story if we wanted by saying that maybe they were trying to finish their challenge of blind the killer x times and were just particularly stupid about doing it. They weren't sandbagging or taunting or the like after all. Would these fall into the reportable? The short of what we want to get at is that to control how players play you'd need to remove agency (tired, cant sleep, but dont wanna think hard).
So we're at a bit of a loss here. On the one claw comparing it to a more standard team game doesn't usually hold well and we could point the flaws. On the other claw the devs are currently doing something about people who are undeniably throwing, specifically the "go next" thing, making a lot of said flaws moot.
Again TCM gameplay wise, is just better because of things like this.
We apologize but can you specify "these things"? The only thing we can find is "communication", which we have and are talking about, and "agency", which both have but one being more difficult for the lone survivor.
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If you need to ask that question than go play solo q for like 20 matches. I bet you don't even get 10 matches in until you want to dc or give up. You'll do realize you need for 4 survivors to 1 killer to play a match. Have fun playing against bots. This is the attitude that puts people off from even posting on here
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