You have correctly brought up the point that Wesker's map mobility is NOT tied to his kill potential, thus there's no real justification for his 40m terror radius. Billy and Blight's map mobility are inherently tied to their lethality whereas Wesker becomes an M1 killer for a while when he arrives at his destination. His power has significant tradeoffs when used for mobility compared to other killers so I agree that a 40m terror radius is not justified.
Feedback and Suggestions
Feedback and Suggestions
Terror Radius Changes: I understand the intent, but can we discuss Wesker?
SlowLoris
Member Posts: 298
👋🏼Hi there! I'd like to start with saying, I love the Terror Radius changes. I think it will actually end up being a buff for Billy/Blight, shockingly and help stealth killers a lot.
✏Before I start explaining my feedback, I want you to know that I can see the INTENT is to normalize mobility killers with bigger TR and Stealth killers with smaller TR.
🗣 However, we need to discuss Wesker. Since the Mastermind's arrival he has been the only character with a 40 meter TR and from my knowledge it has never been explained WHY. Most of us thought it was supposed to be "on theme" for Global Saturation, etc…or because some people consider him to be a mobility killer and he deserves the TR.
⌚Before I go further, I should probably clarify I'm closing in on 1k hours just on Wesker (9k overall) and while there a lot of little tweaks he could use, his TR is one of the worst things about him.
🏃🏼♀️💨Most people try to justify this by saying he's "mobility", but HE IS NOT MOBILITY. When Wesker uses his dash for mobility he has to deal with a rather long c/d and play as an M1 killer at the destination. Not only that, but his double dashes don't get him even close to half way across most maps.
👉🏼Billy and Blight both have the ability to use their power to cover the entire map and then INSTANTLY use it again when they arrive, so the 40 meters is justified. Blight can choose to not use all rushes and still make a lot of distance / patrol the map. Billy can INSTANTLY use his saw again and is an insta-down killer.
😒Why is this so frustrating?: Since you can't use Wesker's power for mobility, or you you have to play as an M1 killer through his entire c/d, you are forced to walk. When you're forced to walk with a 40m TR you are pre-run like crazy. I'm so tired of every single one of my builds being required to run a stealth perk like Unforeseen, or Monitor, so I have a chance to even get remotely close for a chase that they aren't immediately at a safe tile for. Wesker's power is already so very map dependent due to collision and the increased number of objects being added to maps, It'd be nice to at least be able to use it when I get near survivors.
My silly picture got removed, so to clarify, I am suggesting that Wesker's TR is reduced from 40m to 32m, since he is NOT a mobility killer.
Post edited by SlowLoris on
5
Comments
-
You have correctly pointed out that Wesker's map mobility is NOT tied to his kill potential, thus there's no real justification for his 40m terror radius. Billy and Blight's map mobility are inherently tied to their lethality whereas Wesker becomes an M1 killer for a while when he arrives at his destination. His power has significant tradeoffs when used for mobility compared to other killers so I agree that a 40m terror radius is not justified.
Post edited by Leon_Loves_Cheryl on8 -
This is correct about Wesker. Personally, I am just glad they listened to feedback about TR in general. It literally never made any sense that really fast Killers got essentially free stealth on top of speed with their 32m TR, but actual Stealth Killers got hindered by their 32m TR since they need to be… you know… stealthy to get their kills. Like why is Pig being punished with a normal TR when she's intended to be sneaky, but Billy gets to be there in 0.6 seconds with his Overcharge and you can't react due to his normal TR? Why does Huntress get a lullaby when in range of her hatchets (just as dangerous) but Blight does not when his M2 literally can break through pallets?
I think BHVR also really should consider Sadako being given permanent invisibility while demanifested, or at the least removing her lullaby and giving her a smaller TR. She could also benefit from heightened stealth as she's intended to be a bit of a jumpscare/stealthy Killer just like Wraith, Ghostface, or Pig are. Also it's weird we're making this adjustment to Pig and Ghostie but not Wraith, since he has several tells already, why does he need the extra TR distance?0 -
Most people blindly consider him a mobility killer, and it's so frustrating. His power if used for mobility saves him just under 2 seconds vs just walking across the map, so the trade off of using it for mobility is not worth it whatsoever, unless you know that two seconds might stop a 99% gen. However, even if you DO use it, you arrive with no lethality whatsoever.
I just hope the devs will consider at least testing him with 32 meters. I think people would realize it's a huge QoL for him, but wouldn't make him broken, since he is still NOT a mobility killer.
-1 -
I respectfully disagree, and I do believe that this killer deserves the radius that he has, I do not believe that it needs to be any bigger or small smaller.
Wesker can get around the map incredibly quickly, just like Chucky, he can use his dash to attack or reverse the map.
I don’t think it would be fair to survivors if the mastermind had a 32 m radius.4 -
The reasoning was due to his mobility, but as you pointed out, it doesn't really make any sense considering blight has far superior map traversal speed.
I think they just actually wanted to try something new, a killer with a bigger TR to utilize perks to take advantage of a larger TR - mix up expectations. Maybe also they were super psyched to have wesker himself as a killer, and since he's lore-wise very sure of himself and flaunty, him pounding his chest and declaring HERE I AM, PREPARE TO DIE is thematically fitting for him.
Long story short, I feel it's more about the theme of who wesker is than a gameplay balance choice.
3 -
While he doesn't have sustained mobility like Blight or Billy, his burst mobility is incredible.
He's 2m/s faster than an Overdrive Billy. Without a big Terror Radius he'd be able to appear basically instantly with no warning.
5 -
I don’t see a 40 meter terror radius as bad for Wesker. It is so big, that it works as pseudo stealth. It also benefits a lot of perks. Aside from that I like it when killers have more unique trades. Is wished more killers had different terror radiuses, so we have one with 18m, 20, 22, …36, 38, 40.
3 -
I dont think Billy should have 40 meter terror radius mainly because:
Chainsaw is loud.
Has to maneuver around obstacles to get to survivors already giving them better distance to get away from him.
Infectious Fright and Coulrophobia can be problematic for survivors.
Indoor maps especially that have 2 floors will be harder for survivors to know which way he's coming from.
But i do see why they want to make him 40 meters.
0 -
Both Chucky and Wesker cannot attack for their full c/d if they use it for traversal. Both killers that have been added to the 40 meter TR club are able to do this just fine while having insane map mobility.
The thing is, using both dashes and going on full c/d saves you less than 2 seconds in travel time. I think people see Wesker as much more mobile than he is. He can be an M1 killer and waste both dashes for mobility to save 2 seconds, or he has to walk like normal cross map. With the amount of objects that exist on maps now, there are very few situations he could even possibly use his power within 32 meters to land a hit, so it'd be impossible for him to magically appear on a survivor, unless it was a few feet away with no power.
Billy and Blight are able to appear right on top of you while using their power, or have it as they arrive.
0 -
Although Wesker's mobility isn't anywhere near as strong as the likes of Blight and Billy, it still allows him to cover a large gap in a short amount of time and he can still walk people down as a 4.6. With a 32m TR I feel like he'd be able to get too close to survivors a bit too easily without much advance notice, so I disagree, he is fine at 40m.
1 -
I agree with you. Compared to Killers like The Hillbilly, The Blight, The Nurse. Wesker is still a more M1 Killer than the 3 killers I mentioned.
1 -
meanwhile deathslinger who has 32 meter radius and has a shittier power than huntress who got 16 meter terror radius such an amazing logic from behaviour :D
0 -
I feel like there's an important part missing from this discussion.
The Terror Radius (TR) exists to give survivors a fair chance to react and start running, and it’s especially beneficial for low- to mid-MMR players. In that sense, I’d argue that Wesker is about mobility, even if his ability isn't purely designed for it. His 40m TR helps compensate for his movement potential, making him fairer to play against—especially for less experienced players.
The frustration seems to come from situations where survivors barely get a second of warning before suddenly getting grabbed. That kind of instant pressure without counterplay would feel unfair, and I believe that's precisely why Wesker has a 40m TR.
You're right that Wesker’s power isn’t purely mobility-based, but that’s because his large TR serves as a balancing factor, giving survivors time to react. I disagree with the idea of reducing his TR just because it limits his ability to use his power for mobility. If anything, his weaker mobility in exchange for fairness is a good thing—it keeps him from feeling oppressive.
Honestly, I think we should be glad he has this trade-off.
Otherwise, we'd probably see a lot of posts complaining that Wesker is too strong.2 -
Seconded. 40m on Wesker is appropriate imo.
2 -
Yes, he does not have great sustained mobility at all, but if he had a 32m TR, people would run Monitor and Abuse and be able to dash at people with zero warning essentially. His dash range would be barely shorter than his Terror Radius, and he would be able to appear on top of people without any warning due to his nearly unmatched speed (in terms of the traditional "dash" killers anyway).
The only reason Wesker can't appear right on top of you currently is his 40m TR, which is why Blight and Billy are getting changed to work similarly.
1 -
"The thing is, using both dashes and going on full c/d saves you less than 2 seconds in travel time."
This can't be accurate. He can literally get from one side of the map to the other side with his dashes.
-1 -
You mean with only two dashes? Because that is literally impossible. Assuming no infection, you usually need to do your double dash, wait for 5.5 seconds CD per dash (11 seconds total) and you will still need to double dash again to reach the other side. And im pretty sure that even with this second set of double dashes there are many times you still not reach the other side of the map.
I agree that 40m doesnt make much sense. He has not the mobility of Billy or Blight by far. If people want to argue that it is justified because he still has more mobility that some other killers, then we have two options:
- Either reduce his TR to 32 meters and keep Blight and Billy at 40m.
- Or mantain is TR at 40m but increase Blight and Billy to 48m.
Chose one.
People have a point that he is more mobile than a lot of killers, but he is still far, far, FAR slower than Blight or Billy.
-1 -
No, I think you should play with him more, his dashes don't even cross half the map, they go less far than Nurse's blinks and has a significant cooldown.
2 -
It was an exaggeration. My point still stands. His dashes gives him a lot of distance and mobility. They dont take long to come back. Wesker needs to keep his 40 meter terror radius. Thats just my opinion though.
0 -
Huntress has 24 meters. And a lullaby so stealth is not as impactful on her.
But even though all that is true, Deathslinger's TR should be 28 meters, or less.
2 -
I agree Slinger feels like he's on a short end of the stick, I don't think TR is the right way to buff him though.
Regarding TR based thing, the difference of the 2 is Huntress has a much better one-two punch knockdown ability that Slinger just doesn't have due to her quick hatchet throw recovery, thus she has her lullaby to limit her ability to make use of Undetectable perks. Slinger on the other hand CAN use Undetectable perks quite well, and given the speed of his projectile, a good Slinger with undetectable can be pretty game defining.
That said, the combination of weaknesses he has: -
- 4.4m/s for poor looping and map traversal.
- 32m Terror Radius and relatively tall profile giving vulnerability to pre-running and voice comms.
- Long recovery times after each use of power (hit or miss).
- Relatively long to injure time for each use of power.
- Down not guaranteed on power hits at certain tiles.
- Very vulnerable to body blocking, with ample time for Survivors to do it.
- Limited range of 18m.
It's clear he just has more hoops to jump through than Huntress. He does have add-ons and perk options to address some of these problems but I don't think TR changes really address these issues for him (a SWF on voice comms is still gonna give him just as much grief even if you lower his TR).
Obviously we've also got the issue that Deep Wounds has also been repeatedly nerfed for him, and it was already a meh part of his kit, because unlike Legion, it's rare you want to drop chase to hit and run on Slinger; he doesn't have the kind of action economy/map traversal to allow it, even if he finds 2 players at once.
Off top of my head, I'd almost be tempted to suggest adding one or multiple of these feature: -
- Making a greater than 12m shot at basekit should just down an injured survivor.
- Let his harpoon go through players and hit multiple targets. (If he skewers both, he can still only melee one, but it prevents the other from making distance if the team is body blocking for them).
- Give him a double shot, where he basically has a single rapid reload on a miss and/or a hit cancel to fire 2 shots in quick succession. (Unrelenting could allow for him to cancel a tag he doesn't want for another shot pretty quickly).
I feel like something like these would make him stand out a bit more from Huntress, rather than make him more homogenous to her with a smaller TR.
0 -
I feel like the vast majority of people truly think Wesker has MUCH more mobility than he actually has (especially since 2v8 might be messing with a lot of peoples perception).
Because of that I went through and I made a comparison video of Wesker literally walking vs dashing and comparing him to Blight/Billy.
There truly is no comparison. In all instances Blight/Billy reach the same destination in half the time + have most of their power left to continue using it at the destination.
Please, take a look, I spent hours making this. (the embed quality isn't the best, if you want higher quality, you'll have to go to the source for 1080p)
0 -
Please view the video I posted above, you'll see just how little distance he makes with his dashes.
0 -
A couple other people have mentioned this already, but I truly think his ability to specifically cross the map isn't really what's relevant here. What's relevant is how quickly he can traverse 32 metres to threaten you.
He doesn't need to get from one side of the map to the other that quickly, he just needs to be able to get to you quickly enough that there's very little gap between hearing the faint terror radius and him lunging out of nowhere to grab you. Somewhat like Nurse, but to a less insane degree, Wesker has very potent short-range burst mobility, but his power doesn't really allow for more extended map traversal the way a Hillbilly or even to a smaller degree Blight might be able to get.
It's about how much time you have to react if he's beelining for you, not map traversal.
0 -
I can understand this to an extent and would 100% agree with you if this was the year that Wesker launched and the maps were much less cluttered, but that's not the case anymore. There are so few maps that he can even cover that small distance quickly and unobstructed. You'd basically have to be not paying attention at all to not notice a Wesker at 32 meters from you and there is a HUGE chance he can't even directly use his power to you without getting stuck on something and getting put in recovery mode. If he does manage both dashes, he still isn't landing on you with both dashes without warning. Near you, sure. On you, no. You then arrive with no power and a long recovery.
I'm not asking for a guaranteed change. I'm begging for just a PTB test. Wesker was already greatly nerfed with his infection (rightfully), so now people rarely even waste their time cleansing vs him. They simply slam gens injured, because he's not a threat most of the time and predrop pallets when he's even remotely a threat. This change would at least make people consider spraying, because he could get semi close with them full infected if they skip doing it, whereas now they easily make a resource and ignore this mechanic.
0 -
I will also add up the fact that his iri coin add has a chance to not work at all if you catch the survivor just at the end of your spear cause they got plenty of time to get out before he can actually hit them I had such thing happen once I literally could not reel them in fast enough before the chain break I tried hitting but nope it is 1 second before the status dissapears so they get scot free with one hit
1 -
Such a tease when you nail a hit at range 😭
0
