http://dbd.game/killswitch
Why the haste/hinder changes are actually a great idea
I've already seen a lot of people complaining about these proposed changes, but I think people aren't seeing the long term goal of these changes.
First of all, haste/hinder stacking is nearly impossible to balance. The problem you run into is that Bhvr has to keep the effects of the individual perks weak to avoid overpowered combos like mft + hope for example. This leads to the perks typically being weak on their own, but decent when paired with others, but having to dedicate 2 perk slots to what is usually only a situationally useful effect is not a good idea for most killers or survivors.
By removing haste stacking, and buffing the individual effects of haste/hinder perks, Bhvr is removing the possibility of any broken combos, while simultaneously buffing most haste/hinder perks in the process. Haste/hinder perks might actually be worth using on their own now due to the increased effect. This allows for these perks to fit into a build much easier.
Haste/hinder stacking just creates a similar problem as old tinkerer did where Bhvr has to severely limit perks or add-ons because their interaction with a few other perks creates problematic effects.
Personally, I really hope these changes work out well in the PTB and make to live.
Comments
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Anything relating to movement speed should have never stacked - just causes balance problems.
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I'm really not understanding why people have an issue with this to begin with. Its a flat buff to a whole range of perks which is massively a good thing and might make some worth using while simultaneously improving long term game health for future perks and add-ons. It also takes a lot of stress off the devs shoulders now that they no longer need to worry about how certain perks will interact or handicap them just so they can exist in obscurity together.
How any of that isn't a good thing is beyond me. All I can think of is selfish players not wanting to let go of their haste/hinder combos because they don't know how to live without them.
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It's true that removing haste/hindered stacking will be more healthy for the game, but it will also remove a lot of creativity at the same time, which is a shame.
Hopefully whatever positives come from future updates, is enough to offset the interesting things we lose.
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It is just haste and hinder which are already powerful effects in the game that can dictate whocomes out on top in a chase. All other effects will still stack so there will still be room for creativity in builds and may even free up a perk slot for more flexible builds.
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Please stop, my mind cant handle this much correct.
Yeah, Agreed. And I much rather see ALL the Haste Perks be good on their own.
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They aren't nerfing Haste and Hindered, they're removing stacking so that individual perks can be stronger.
It's overall better for the game if they balance the perks correctly.
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I don't think people know how different haste/hindered really is when applied to either a survivor or killer. Haste effects on survivor are insanely strong mathmatically, while killer haste/survivor hindering perks have innate diminishing returns on reducing chase time, which only really affect killers without much mobility in the first place.
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I can understand multiple perk effects not stacking, because this stops excessive stacking on both sides, but it should stack with a killer basekit power because that's not an optional choice and denies perk viability and build versatility to killers while also creating dead ends in killer power design for the future.
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Simple example:
Dark Theory and Batteries Included, give 2 and 5% respectively. Too weak to be used on their own as a sole effect, they are used mainly to amplify other haste effects.
3% and 6% wont make much of a difference as most haste effects will override them anyway.
So 4% and 7% are the lowest numbers you can give them to be somewhat viable on small maps, you need 5-7% and 10% to make them viable on bigger maps.
But whoops, problem, Midwich exists, and 4% boon on the top layer of midwich while a survivor is being chased at the bottom, or a generator on the top layer while the killer chases you with 7% haste downstairs are both too strong of an effect on those maps.
So, how to balance them in a way where they are balanced on smaller maps, while also still viable to use on bigger maps? Keep them at 2-3% and 5%, and make them stack.
Not even talking how Clown would legit be unable to use the entire range of perks, since his 10% haste is the biggest haste a killer can get.
Its best to split the perks up, make SOME perks exclusive, and put the rest in a seperate section that DOES stack. You can easily switch them from one group to another and easily tweak numbers2 -
I agree with the OP. It's a hard pill to swallow since it does remove some niche/fun builds that weren't problematic, but it also removes some combinations that were and it ensures that this will never be a problem again in the future. As more and more stuff gets added to the game and we keep getting new perks/killers this was only going to become more and more of an issue and it's not sustainable long-term. And it's better to get rid of it now than later when there would likely be even more stuff that gets impacted by the change.
Speed-altering perks should all be allowed to be decent perks on their own and not be forced to be limited by the fact that stacking makes them broken. Since unlike a lot of things in this game where stacking gives diminishing returns, stacking speed-related stuff in some cases does the exact opposite. There are definitely some perks that should be buffed as a result of this change.
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I think this will allow other perks and powers to be more balanced and allow certain others to be upped. Maybe Dark Theory can actually give +7 haste finally?
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Does that means clown deserves to have even better haste/hinder also?
because he certainly is underperforming without doubt, too
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I'd say that's a fair comprise - otherwise, some killers addons or perks are immediately defunct if the killer has a basekit speed up or slowdown.
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Ain't nothing more disgusting than facing a clown going like 200 with haste stacking build. I do not remember if its otz or hens but it was atrocious seeing it.
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