http://dbd.game/killswitch
Can we please revisit The Onyrō
Comments
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Oh then I apologize I did misunderstand. I thought you meant one or the other, not both, okay that's fine then.
I'm still more of a fan of tape destruction over passive condemn though. They both punish tape holding but one is free and one is earned.
Yeah the chest having priority over killer spawns is a huge issue. Idk how that has existed this long and not fixed yet. I can lose matches just because I get a bad map or they have things that add chests. The TV spawns can make or break a match. Asylum is notorious for this. This map screws you on TV spawns.
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The tp is not a problem and totally fine. There is nothing wrong with it. Having a cooldown on projection felt terrible and anyone who knows what they are talking about wouldn‘t suggest something like that.
The cooldown on the TVs serves a purpose limiting her condemned spread.
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The projection cooldown only felt terrible for bad players who relied on spamming tp, the projection cooldown was only 10 seconds, there was literally zero reason to project again within 10 seconds unless you made a mistake. A projection cooldown would also limit her condemned spread while also limiting her mobility and force her to play more carefully, an absolute non-issue for good players.
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It‘s not a mistake to search for people and doing it more efficiently with the teleport. Without aura perks or knowing there is high progressed gen you can‘t know where people are.
It‘s insane to me that you complain about the weakest part of her kit. There is no reason to nerf it, especially since survivors can deactivate it all times with 0 cost. If you struggle against her mobility that is huge skill issue on your part.
You probably also want condemned on hit back and global condemned because it was „absolute non-issue for good players“
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You quite literally can know where people are, it's a skill called game sense, any skilled player has it. "Without knowing there is a high progressed gen," exactly, so use game sense to know there is a high progressed gen, it's a skill, and the lack of it is a skill issue. It's not even up for debate really.
Who said I struggle? Sadako is still a weak killer, but the point is that if you want her buffed, so that survivors can deactivate her power with more than 0 cost, you have to make her less brainless, you can't have a killer be strong while not taking a reasonable amount of skill.
Condemned on hit and global condemned were a non-issue for coordinated players, but condemned on hit should be reimplemented as condemned on down and global condmen basically still exists since the previous caveat of not affecting survs holding tapes is very similar to the current one of not affecting survs near unpowered TVs.
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You‘ve still not told me ONE good reason why it is a problem. It‘s just you talking about how something is not skillful enough for you, which it also doesn‘t need to be. There is no difference between blight running over the map and finding people and Sadako doing the same with her teleport. Same with nurse, Dracula …. They all traverse the map fast and find randomly people.
Sadako is not strong and with those changes she would still not be strong. Sadako has also a diffrent skill celling than others, but ask Radianthero if you want him to explain it to you.
I‘m done here arguing about irrelevant stuff and your only argument being „Skill issue“, which is no argument if you didn‘t know.
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Facts! People actually felt awful playing her when there were 2 split cooldowns. It was very frowned upon. I agree. We do not need to go back to that.
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I've told you it's a problem because it allows her to mindlessly get info and tp to survs with no effort, that's a good reason, not my problem you don't see it just because you don't want to put in the effort. Blight has a cooldown btw. Drac has a cooldown btw. Nurse literally has the worst map mobility in the game, how are you gonna make a claim related to whether or not people know what they're talking about then bring up Nurse in a discussion about map mobility lol.
Also we're talking about skill floor here not skill ceiling, and having to redirect me to someone else clearly shows you don't think for yourself, which would make sense given you don't want projection cooldown to come back.
To say something is a problem because it's too easy is objectively an argument and that doesn't change just because you ignorantly rephrase it as "just calling something a skill issue." Maybe come back when you're based in reality whatsoever.
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Cool, no worries that man!
Yeah that's a fair shout.... as I think about it, tape destruction does handle the "eat a hit to rush deliver the tape" issue she has right now.
I'd happily accept this version instead of the passive condemn build up... in fact as I'm thinking about it more, I actually prefer it, since the killer is rewarded for ending chases rather having a "stall for condemn" cheese issue she would have with the passive condemn method
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This feels good too as well!
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Then they should get rid of the tv specific cooldown. No reason to tp again within 10s of tping unless you're spamming condemned or made a mistake by teleporting to the wrong spot, which are not good reasons. Only people making mistakes often thought it felt bad
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So many good suggestions in thsi thread to be fair... The potential... it only needs to be realised... plz BHVR🙏
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In my mind they already are!💯❤️
This has been a very productive thread. Thank you everyone for your time, and thoughts. 💭2 -
While I like your suggestion, it doesn‘t really solve my problem with her. I liked her first version the most because you had a very good/ fun map traversal and chase power, but since her reworks survivors are forced to turn TVs off and have TVs auras. This leaves very little room to use her power to chase survivors like back then. I wished they‘d separate the condemned counter from her mobility.
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Aye, your rework is an interesting take, and it certainly sounds unique for Sadako.
The only reason I never commented on it is the logic of OG Sadako was reversed to my mind, and while I understand your rework and it would probably be fine, its not intuitive to my brain, so I don't feel like I could genuinely add to/argue legitimately for it. Survivors only grabbed a tape to try and remove condemn, there was literally no other reason to grab a tape since Sadako disabled her TVs longer than survivors did.
This to me means however the condemn management is less unique for the survivor side, it's effectively like fighting Freddy, where you ignore the effct while its not a problem and when the effect needs to be dealt with you come off gens and go deal with it with a quick fetch quest.
A modified version on modern Sadako with the global condemn and a tape effect sees survivors responsible for managing their own condemned dynamicallybbased on what is going on in the trial, and makes facing Sadako feel more unique.
At least that's how I see it, old Sadakonfeels like she was more aggressive about targetting a specific survivor for condemn. Modern Sadako feelS like a more slow burn across the whole team. Since i have a preference for modern Sadako, I don't think I'm the right guy to argue for a version that focused much more on OG Sadako, but certainly wont argue against your version... it sounds cool 😅
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He's got some great ideas too in this thread. Him and I have spent a lot of time exchanging ideas together.
I hope a Ryan or a dev sees this.
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My intention was not to talk about my discussion. I just wanted to bring attention to this issue that remains untalken about. For me it’s sad that almost no one talks about how to make her the scary omnipresent killer again and everyone forgets her invisibility. Both of these things have so much potential and are for me much more fun to use than condemned. The condemned playstile is always spam tp to spread, which is not even fun to do in my opinion, but with the reworks they reduced her to that and made my chase playstile completely unviable (just because condemned was „too strong“ not the chase). This leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.
its not intuitive to my brain
What do you mean by that?
Only to be fair, I still had a global condemned passive timer suggestion, so I wouldn’t remove it. Just make it so you no longer have to spam it 20 times, which makes it easier to balance against good and bad players and less boring, because you can do something else in the meantime.
I generally also don‘t understand why you‘d want survivors to grab tapes? It gives you no advantage and when forced only downsides.
This to me means however the condemn management is less unique for the survivor side
What is so exciting about grabbing and turning off a TV? It is half a second interaction and not interactive. I would generally like to know.
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I think the simplest explanation I can give is having regular access to teleporting across the map at any time eliminates the need to really play the macro game of DBD at all, and where I find it especially problematic is regards to tunneling (off hook or otherwise).
In games I love trade offs and questions. I've never liked having a clear option that is the best to take at any times. When it comes to tunneling, the thing that annoys me about Blight, Nurse, Kaneki and Billy; there is never a question on those killers of "hmmm... this is a survivor I can tunnel out now... but I'm a long way from that cluster of gens... do I commit to this tunnel target to eliminate them at the risk of losing this 3 gen? Or do I leave them and try to hold it?".
For those killers the answer is always "yes, tunnel them out" because they can always get back in time to defend with near impunity.
So in regards to Sadako, it's the not quite same thing, because she doesn't have the loop lethality of these killers... however she can hit and run like Wraith. If survivors are heavily discouraged from using tapes to shut down her teleport, it means that Sadako can keep hitting and running, wearing down resources (like she can now), but with the goal of tunneling out a given player in between. Tunnel aggressively, because you might as well, and as long as you can end chases reasonably consistently, you can always make it back to defend your gens.
If however survivors can shut down teleports, but with a potential condem penalty, that decision to tunnel comes with a cost, you can't TP straight back for the 3 gen, so you've got to weigh up the pros and cons of the tunnel.
In the same breathe a team who doesn't respect your condemn and just shuts down tapes mindlessly also runs a risk of giving her windows to suddenly build a lot of condemn pressure (this is what is missing now), and can lose the game via this alternative method. Weighing up this balance and reacting accordingly is more engaging to me and my playstyle 😁
However of course... just cause that's my preference doesn't mean I'm right... so I don't want to derail an alternative take on the killer 😁🤘
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I enjoyed reading your thoughts surrounding safaris power. It’s always nice to see a perspective!
Thank you so much!
Question(s)- How do you feel about her spawning out of her Well each trial? 😁 Should this come as an additional teleporting location for her?
- I hope we get another Map Control killer down the road. I enjoy killers with side objectives. Ie. Pig, Sadako, Pinhead, (nemesis?)
- Something that has always bothered me about Sadako. I would like to express it here and get your perspective on it. (Here it goes…while Sadako is demanifested. She flickers in and out at a range of 24 meters in her power. Cool right? While manifested at 24 meters she is STILL visible at the same exact range while NOT in her power. This never made sense to me. I feel like clump of hair should fill this as basekit. She shouldn’t be visible at equal ranges. Am I crazy for thinking this? 🤣?)
This was just stuff I thought of today.
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- Her spawning in a well and crawling out would be cool.
3. I don‘t think there is something wrong with her full invisibility range being the same while demanifested and manifested, but they should reduce it to 18 meters and make Clumb of hair that it reduces the full invisibility range to 12 meters.
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That would be so fun!
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- Hahahah, a well spawn would be so damned cool... I feel it should be added for no other reason than being simply badass xD
- I'd like another taken on this mind of killer. I'm quietly hoping the Skull Merchant rework will get a TCM Grabdpa effect, but also applicable to Conspicuous Actions, with a lower warning and a lingering effect on anyone revealed.
- Only visible manifested while 12m away? Is there even a point demanifesting? I'd be tempted to run Distressing cause noone would know where I'm coming from on gens xD
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- RIGHT! LOL It would be SO fun hahahaha!
- I would love this. I love that idea for sure. 100%! Very cool.
- I don't agree with the 12 meters. That's a little too short but 18 would be nice.
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There is the add-on though? 🥴
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True true you are right but I guess what I mean is it might as well be basekit. She's in "Power" she should get a little less visibility. I don't think it would be anything over the top by any means. Its a pretty bad addon anyways since their is a lullaby. Make it basekit and perhaps rework it.
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Ohhhhh I gotcha... objection withdrawn xD
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Speaking of Addons. My favorite one use to be Tape Editing Deck. I hardly use it anymore because it's meh..Since she needs an addon rework do you think Well Water would be okay if they just increased its duration?
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With @Blueberrys tape destruction change, TED would be crisp.
I think it can be extended yeah, although this invisible at 18m thing is a little worrisome with that... Sadako has her Lullaby and her flicker is the more important aspect of her demanifest...so it's probably fine... but one to watch I think.
I realised the other day on the Wiki I'd never heard Sadako's Terror Radius.... Only he Lullaby and chase music...which is a shame cause her terror radius is a banger 🫣
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Tape destruction would be nice for sure and it could synergize well with TED not to mention if you had ring drawing. Could help for sure.
Her VCR addon is neat but its a copy/paste. Freddy has a similar feature when teleporting (However, its more convincing than Sadako's) Wraith has a similar addon where everyone can hear the bell..etc.
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She should keep undetectable during the lingering invisibility duration (well water basekit). Her invisibility mindgames are already difficult enough to pull off with bugs, wall hacks via a directional lullaby and how you have to time it.
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The full invisibility at 18 meters would be nothing buff really. If you equip the addon it barely does anything at the moment, so we might as well make it basekit. It‘s just a nice to have. Clumb of hair would also only reduce the full invisibility to 12 meters while demanifested. This would make it fairly useful at bigger structures and make her very scary. It would be fine since she becomes visable while manifesting and loops are generally a lot shorter than that, so you would see her while looping. The only time it would make it harder to track her is when you gained a bit of distance and she has to catch up. There you wouldn’t know is she there or not? It could probably reduce the threshold for full invisibility to 12 meters while manifested as well, it should at least get tested.
That‘s the pictures we took together if you remember.
24meters:
18 meters: still very big but a lot nearer and better.
12 meters: (new basekit with 18 meters and Clumb of hair -6m)
So in comparison: The red line would be the 12 meters and yellow the 18m. Myers is the zero point.
Closer look:
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I do remember, and if you recall I wasn't convinced then when we were talking about it... 😅
12m where Sadako is completely invisible while manifested? I don't know where to run until she is less than 3 seconds away from me, with my reaction time to factor in too?
I dunno about you, but I have had trouble with spotting Freddy sometimes, and he's 32m invisibility range.... maybe I just suck, which is highly possible, but I know for a fact I'm gonna have A LOT of problems against a killer who I can't see beyond 12m xD
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Maybe 12 meters while manifested would be too much, but while demanifested would be fine. The devs should at least test it on the ptb to see what people say. Or the solution would be making the basekit 18 meters and the addon 14-16 meters. Generally speaking 18 meters is not good, otherwise more people would use it.
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Oh good idea! I never even really thought about that before. Yes! Which would make sense because she isn’t “fully manifested” just yet. I love this idea. 💡
Totally makes sense.
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A test wouldn’t hurt for sure but 16 meters I feel would be the sweet spot. Not too far, not too close.
It would make her telephone addon a little more of a choice to use as well. Otherwise I don’t know how I feel about the 3% hindered for 3 seconds only 6-7 meters away. Seems….off….to me.
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She should also keep her pallet stun immunity and her loss of collision there. That would be great.
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The telephone addon needs a number buff to something like 8%. Personally I would want that + it reducing the time it takes to manifest/demanifest by 0.2seconds.
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Not too long ago the devs reduced that timer already. Not sure if it would really need that or just a slight numbers change on telephone. I am open to any addon ideas with it anyways. As a purple addon you should WANT to have the desire to select it. I am probably one of the few people who do for some reason xD
But there are so many other addons you can be using that are better of course like video tape copy which is brown hahaha.
Rickety Pinwheel and Sea Soaked cloth need brand new effects too. My suggestion they either keep what is there just number changes and fix the elevation bug that these 2 addons have OR make both of the have completely different affects.
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They haven’t reduced the timer in any update. Number buffs would probably do it, but I really want that effect and it fits to this addon.
I leave you my suggestions of my addon ideas. I think sea soaked cloth and rickety pinwheel need only some adjustments no rework.
Addon changes
Chase addons
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Iri videotape (rework) - for map traversalHitting a Survivor within 8 seconds after Manifesting turns on the last TV turned off (partially reverted).
Sadako can teleport to a turned off TV. She does not spread condemned, when teleporting to a turned off TV 📺. (new)
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TelephoneSurvivors suffer from a -8% (was -3%) hindered Status Effect for 3 seconds, when Manifesting within 7 meters of them.
Reduces the required time to manifest and demanifest by 0,2 seconds. (new)
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Tape editing deck - for jumpscaring peopleCauses all Survivors start the Trial with a VHS Tape. All survivors must bring their VHS-Tapes to the TV that is furthest from their current location.
Survivors who are in a 3-5 meter radius to an active TV get twice as many stacks of condemned and are revealed by killer instinct. (new)
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Well stone - for the early gameAt the start of a match she crawls out of a TV next to a survivor and the TVs are not on a 30s long cooldown. (new)
Reduces the time it takes for TVs to turn back on by -9 (was 7) seconds.
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NewspaperIncreases the duration of your full Invisibility after Manifesting and while being demanifasted (new, merged with reikos watch) by +33 %.
We don't need two addons for the same thing.
Condemn addons
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Ring drawing (rework)Condemned Survivors spread their Condemnation to other Survivors, who complete a Healing action on an injured Survivor. (revert)
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Well water (rework)Every time a generator gets completed every survivor receives a stack of condemned. (New)
Stealth Adoons
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Rickety pinwheelSurvivors suffer from the silence (was oblivious) status effect when within 12-16 (was 8) meters of a turned on TV. This effect lingers for 1-2 seconds after leaving its radius (new). When turning the TV off, the addon's range becomes 3-4 (was 0) meters.
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Clump of hairReduces the threshold for full Invisibility while Demanifasted to 12 (was 18) meters and the invisibility lingers for 0,5 seconds (new).
Alternative playstyle addons
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Sea-soaked clothSurvivors suffer from the blindness and fog Status effect when within 12-16m (was 8m) of a turned on TVs. This effect lingers for 1-2 seconds after leaving its radius (new). When turning the TV off, the addon's range becomes 3-4 (was 0) meters.
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Reikos watchThe haste from protection gets turned into hindered and given to survivors for the duration of the speed around 16 meters of the TV you teleported to. (New)
The victims wouldn’t be able to move like in the movies, while Sadako comes slowly closer to them.
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Cabin signHitting a survivor breaks their tape. (New)
New status effect:
SilenceEveryone becomes deaf and doesn't hear anything. The visual heartbeat deactivates.
New status effect:
FogThere is a wall of fog which blocks your view and auras outside of a 24 meter radius.
Maybe there is something you like.
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Every time a generator gets completed every survivor receives a stack of condemned. (New)
This looks cool!
Your well stone looks neat too! However, I can see survivors will whine about that one LOL xD
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