8 gen kick limit discussion
How you feel about it? In my opinion it's unfair because it denied to patrol objective at late game.
How to fix that?
This mechanic would be disabled once 2 or less generators need to be completed.
Comments
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No, that's fair. Who needs boring matches with gens patrolling? Look for survivors, you have everything for that.
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That would destroy the entire point of the mechanic. It's not a funny thing BHVR put in to make sure Killers can't defend specific gens when there's still 4 to be repaired, it was made to ensure 3-gens cannot be defended infinitely.
You absolutely can patrol objectives at endgame with the mechanic and as long as you're reasonably focused on Survivors above the Generators, the kick limit will rarely stop you from doing anything, unless you're running a perk like Surge that runs into the kick limit easily.
IMO the kick limit is an excellent addition and while it could use continuous tuning the game is much healthier for having it.
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needs to be removed tbh it limits what perks i can use and mostly affects m1 killers
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Main issue here, perks like call of brine or eruption along with other perks make you run out of kicks pretty quickly without giving you much of perk value.
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My opinion of it is, unless you are hard 3-genning, even with Surge and Eruption you're still unlikely to hit a limit against any competant survivors... and even if you do, it's not likely to be the sole reason yo cost you the game.
With those perks, you're looking a total of at least 59 charges of regression (3 kicks, 3 surges and 2 eruptions) on a single gen before it is blocked.
That gen will either be rushed long before you hit the limit, or you've likely had enough time to get a good amount of pressure on the team in general, given you need 3 downs at least to trigger those scenarios.
This is of course Ingnoring the fact that Surge and Eruption isn't the most synergistic combo available, where Pop/Overcharge + Eruption for a kick build would be much more effective, or something like Pain Res + Surge for a non-kick build.
The gen limit enforces the killer to have to commit to a chase at some point, which these perks encourage you to do already, and reward you handsomely for doing so compared to not having them and using the basic 5% kick.
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For me, there shouldn't even be a limit in the first place. Meanwhile, perks that boost repair speed haven't been nerfed at all and they keep adding new ones. On the other hand, almost all of the generator slowdown perks for killers have already been nerfed.
I'm fine with having a limit system, really. But could you please make the regression speed work like it does in the 8v2 mode? Because in 4v1, the regression is extremely suck and slow plus it’s limited in how many times it break.
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Unfortunately such a change only benefits top tier killers, not the lower tier ones who actually need it... 😔
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That is not true, I have to admit that. Both gen progression and gen regression got nerfed. So the balance didnt happen really. i kinda understand that sitting on gen for 120s would be boring, but if they make so 14 chests with components spawn within map and survivors have to attach 2 of them to every gen in order to start repair, it would be more interactive while helping the base game slowdown. And killers would finally be able to chase someone without losing 2 gens within 60s.
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If it was limited to actual 3 gen situations, I'd be fine with it. However. It unfairly and unjustly negatively affects m1 no mobility killers making the weakest killers in the game even weaker. Why? No mobility killers cannot afford to patrol far away gens. Survivors know this, so they leave those gens for last. That means the only gens survivors are focusing on are centeralized gens that are near each other. That means the m1 killer has no choice but to focus on center gens since they can't afford to go to far gens and survivors aren't at those far gens anyway. ALL of the action is in the center of the map. That leaves m1 killers absolutely ripe to getting the 8 regression limit with perks such as surge, or if they dare use perks like eruption despite there not being a 3 gen canping situation where the killer is refusing to chase and hook survivors.
It's a good idea on paper, but absolutely wrecks already weak killers by kicking in when 3 gen canping is NOT happening. The regression limit should change to getting reduced to 6 charges and only kick in counting regression hits once 3 gens are left.
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This is a take I agree with, the system does affect killers more reliant on 3-gens more.
Though to be fair, around the same time as that change (7.5.0) BHVR have been buffing/reworking a number of the killers worst affected in chase, such as:
- Trapper getting a basekit stronger version of Coffee Grounds (7.3.0)
- Myers rework to reduce his start up and can now stalk from afar and shift his downtime after hooks (8.4.0)
- Bubba got basekit Chilli and Beast Marks as well as improved/reduced collision (8.0.0)
- Freddy got his rework to be much better in chase and traverse the map a lot better (8.5.0)
- Pig got her basekit crouch speed and ambush buffs (7.6.0)
- Legion got their FeralbFrenzy speed, duration, cooldown and fatigue buffs to get more pressure and the ability to close out chases (8.6.0)
- Demogorgon got reduced recovery on shreds (7.6.0) and better map traversal tools (8.4.0)
- Nemesis got buffs to his power startup time and his whips slow/recovery improved massively to help him chain hits (8.2.0)
- Sadako has alot going on here, but she got her lock in on Condemn, faster TV projection movement speed, faster demanifesting movement speed, and longer invisibility duration while demanifested (7.5.0)
- Dredge got faster movement speed while gloaming, faster map traversal and night charge, shorter cooldowns, and faster locker break speed (8.2.0)
- Knight got his rework and while his cheese got nerfed, he did get things like the criminally underrated Carnifex which is crazy good (8.1.0 and 8.2.0)
- Skull Merchant got her laser beam changes to be more chase oriented, which had potential (7.3.0)... then got Old Yellered behind the shed (8.3.0) 🥺
- Singularity got a heap of changes, but basically his pods attach slipstream better, his slipstream cooldowns are shorter, his overclock is faster, his wake up time is shorter. (8.1.0)
Other killers got buffs of course, but these are the ones I'd say were more 3-genny, and in (almost) all of these cases the killers got improvements to their chase, encouraging them to actually go for downs rather than having to fall back to 3 genning.
How successful each of these are is up for debate, and its map mobility that really makes the difference, but you can see a clear trend in how BHVR are buffing killers following the anti 3-gen change.
So... while I agree with your take on 3-gen kicking in before 3-genning actually happens... I can at least say I do agree with the direction BHVR are going…
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That killers got buffs doesnt mean they are strong. The game is still heavily survivor sided and developers are afraid to do a bigger balance changes. 95 % of killers need way more buffs.
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No ofc not, but, that doesn't change the fact that all of these killers did get buffs to their chase and/or map traversal, which in conjuction with the 3-gen change does appear to indicate an intent to push these killers away from relying on this playstyle and committing more to chasing survivors.
If you have all these killers with these buffs without the 3 gens changes then they just get better at 3 genning, whereas doing this in conjunction with the 3 gen change is the kind of change you make if you want to shake up the game...
The argument is always these killers have to 3-gen, but if you take it away as a steadfast strategy, you can then start buffing them since you no longer have to worry abuit excessive 3 genning in your balance changes. The principle is short term pain, for long term gain.
Whether or not we all agree with every change BHVR makes, you can't deny that BHVR have been taking a lot of steps to shake up the game lately... and they've been listening to their community more than ever for the last 2 years.
Anyone at this point who claims BHVR are only listening to one side is just flat out wrong, because there have been a lot of sizable buffs and changes for both sides.
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Big agree! Small steps, but it's happening.
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