Weak/Mid Killers should be just buffed, not buff/nerfed

While clown and knight changes specifically are questionable, most weak/mid killers need to be buff/nerfed because of their low skill requirement

Are you serious. Nurse is the hardest Character in the game. I barely see a Nurse if I do they are rather bad or God's. The Ghoul is supposed to be easy because they wanted him to be beginner Friendly. Bright I have no idea he's to hard for me to play. The reason why these Killers are barely touched is because they have a high Skill Ceilling. Even if there very Strong or S Tier in strangth. Ghoul is strong because he's easy to play because he's supposed to be. As for Knight and Clown that are B tier Buffing and Nerfing them is a bad idea it's like doing that to The Unknown who has a High Skill ceilling as well. you nerf buff a Killer Like that will put all the Skill for those who put time in them completely for nothing. plus Clown if his goes live his Haste bottles will be nerfed in like week and will be where Skull Marchant is which I'd in the dumpster.

Maybe see why the Killer has there power how it is before you say something on them.

Clowns Purple bottles are his most iconic Power which is to Hinder survivors to catch up to them. His Yellow bottles didn't come in until later when he was reworked. Removing what was Clown will Remove his Identity of what he was supposed to be.

MHm sure. Totally not the hardest Killer to Learn.

True than we have billy haedest from strongest killers (harder than blight for sure), dracula hard but strong overall, singularity is just work with cameras and you never loose survivor when he is marked (maybe on indoors like larrys),twins just master of slug (maybe they will fall of when phase 2 hits) and then we have killers like skullmerchant no need to play her same goes for trapper (biggest trap in dbd, I was his main but he is so weak even when you do something well you will still get punished more than survivor who made mistake), ghostface fun but weak same goes to mayers.

In this specific instance, I agree that Pyramid Head getting such great buffs while Clown/Knight have gotten really bad changes sucks. Knight's Standard changes should either be reverted or completely rethought (IMO they should make 10s the new default standard spawn time for Jailer & Carnifex with Assassin keeping a 5s spawn) and Clown's changes should probably be brought back to the drawing board.

But, I disagree with the idea low/mid Killers should only be buffed and not recieve a buff/nerf bundle, for two reasons:

• Not every Killer patch needs to go in with the goal of moving a Killer up/down the tier list. Pyramid Head's seemingly well recieved rework is proof of that, because frankly it's just a fun patch. PH players who zone and tunnel are annoying to play against, so that playstyle is now worse. His addons used to suck, now they are much better. Pyramid Head didn't need a strength buff, but he did need fun, so he got it, I think that's a good thing.
• These specific nerfs made Knight and Clown both less fun to play, and that's the real issue. Knight's Standard changes are a travesty that disincentivise his interesting macro gameplay for dull zoning again. Clown's bottle changes mean instead of only using purple bottles being the low effort strategy, throwing a yellow bottle at the ground then M1ing like you ordered Wraith from Temu is the new low effort strategy, which is even less fun for both sides. There'd be little complaint if the compensation nerfs were slightly longer cooldowns or reloads, the issue is that the nerfs have damaged both of these Killers' playstyles and fun factor.

If Clown's yellow bottles were overbuffed to the point where he was super strong, this would have still been an awful patch for Clown. If Knight's #########-a-guard strategy was made so strong he's S-tier, this would have still been an awful patch for Knight. Mid/low tiers existing is fine, Killers getting their playstyles butchered is not

"There's no reason we can't have killers that are reasonably easy to learn and be decently strong." This either means you want killers that are easy to be as good as those that aren't, which you seem to be denying, or that you want weak killers to be better but not better enough to be as strong as Nurse, so not better enough to have any chance vs competent survivors of the same skill level. So do you only want weaker killer buffs to give inexperienced or uncoordinated survivors a harder time, what's the point in that?

Also no killer requires or ever has required what you're saying, don't be overdramatic

"I don't understand balance of killers in this game."

Don't worry. Neither do the devs.

We seem to be misunderstanding one another so I'll try to be more clear. I want every killer to feel good to play. For them to have a power level that makes them viable against most groups of average survivors. Where there's basically no killer below current B tier. As I pointed out with Oni, you can have strong killers that aren't mechanically difficulty or have an extremely complex power to use effectively. There's room for the difficult killers but they shouldn't be the only viable option.

Speaking in general terms, buff + nerf combo changes are sometimes necessary because adjusting one aspect of a killer has unintended consequences to other mechanics. You have to look at buffs and nerfs as they relate to a killer’s entire kit.

Another thing to keep in mind is that tier lists aren’t data - they’re opinions. For example, in my experience I can get 3-4Ks with Singularity, Dredge, and Unknown with much less finicky controls and effort than Nurse or Blight. If I were to make a personal tier list, Nurse and Blight would not be S tier just because they might have similar results as other strong killers but they’re more of a pain to play so why would I rank them higher?

Nurse's skill ceiling isn't much lower than any of those killers because none of those techs are actually difficult to do. Moreover, Nurse's skill ceiling revolves around actual mindgames, and that's game sense. Compared to techs, which are mechanical, and therefore less skillful. The only real case you have is Blight, and he's not weaker than her.

And while I'm not a fan of using AI to argue for you, LLMs do source their information from multiple parts of the Internet. That means that it'll probably spit out the most common take on the subject, which in this case is that Nurse is the hardest killer.

Either way, it really doesn't matter because nothing in this game is particularly hard anyways. It's a casual game and the discussion of skill floors/ceilings is useless

True look at skull merchant whenever she is mentioned it doesnt matter what the news are good rework, nerfs,buffs outcome is just backlash and hate same goes for killers like ghoul,legion it doesnt matter all thats need for that hate is to mention them.

You're describing the process of learning as if it's a counter argument. "Cracking the enigma code isn't difficult once you learn how to do it."

Nurse is objectively the hardest killer to play because she does not play by the same rules of every other character in the game.

A player taking the time and effort to master her mechanics does not magically make her an easy killer.

I mean your follow-up was to call someone an entitled Survivor main.

We weren't exactly promoting conversation prior to this either.

Seriously, the buff/nerf thing they do with lower tier killers drives me insane. At least Pig got actual just buffs this time around but it's so frustrating seeing weaker killers only get like half an addon made basekit at the cost of a nerf. Then it comes out to a net nerf because many people will still use the addon that was given half basekit so now they just got nerfed for no reason.

It's pretty obvious the Devs have a bit of a favoritism problem. Blight is clearly their golden boy, he's been overpowered since his release and they have done nothing about. They rework his addons and literally nothing changes, they even buffed some of them afterwards. Nurse is a flawed character design in general and will always be OP, even if she only had a single blink and moved at 4.2 she would still be strong. Kaneki is another flawed design, everything people complain about with characters like Legion or Skull Merchant for "Free injures" is 10 fold for Kaneki and are actually free injures. He has insane mobility and can traverse the map in seconds yet is still 4.6 (Just like Blight) and all 3 suffer from the problem with how gaining any distance against them feels completely pointless and even if you do manage to dodge their hit from their op powers you get to extend chase by like 5 seconds.

It's so frustrating to see characters that aren't even strong like Skull Merchant or Clown get completely gutted just because Survivors don't enjoy playing against them while the big 2 never get nerfed, and Kaneki makes it the big 3 and I doubt he'll be nerfed again even though he needs it.

I quite literally explained why in the comment you're quoting

It depends on the changes.

Some killers, as weak as they may be, can't just be buffed with no mitigation. If Clown got his immediate speed like in PTB at 12% haste with the same hinder as before, you'd get a killer with average map mobility and chases that last 15 seconds because the speed differential would be absolutely insane. This is just not fun and interactive. We can't compensate the lack of map mobility with ridiculous anti loop and vice versa.
The changes to Clown, on paper, made sense. Use more haste and a bit less hinder than usual because hinder was the only tool players used in chase and players didn't use the full kit entirely. The problem is they went overboard with the yellow bottles that give instant better speed now.
I get the idea for Knight as well but the execution is terrible but that kinda comes with the design of the killer. How do you give "smart" anti loop to a killer that can ######### a guard at a loop and will track you for 30 seconds while the killer can just sandwich you.
Changes to Pig are fine but for example, we can't make crouching speed too fast. It's as fast as survivor now which means that it's impossible to lose her if she chases you with a bear trap on because it doesn't trigger chase.
Any changes to base power needs to be balanced with the rest or it creates absolute frustration: Old SM had no real chase power, no mobility but her ability to defend areas was beyond insane. Old Houndmaster could get hit instantly at any pallet or window because Snug vaulted way too fast.