Survivors should really stop playing this game for the time being
Comments
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We know which side they love. They give filtered feedback to the devs which is why the game is so incredibly killer sided.
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No. Stop playing. Full stop. There is nothing in this game that will respect your time. Hurt BHVR where they care the most. Their wallet. Personally I've already put my report in on steam that the game is false advertising, because thats what it currently is. Its not a back and forth, its a "you queue for survivor and have to suffer through being someones torture victim" that's not the game I spent my money on.
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You're not the only one lol but ultimately it doesn't matter what you or I think. They're a business at the end of the day, and as long as folks are happy to keep paying up for new cosmetics there's no incentive to change how things are. If they're not retaining enough new survivor players, they now know the Play as You Wait feature will help pick up the slack.
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It's probably just there attempt to get killers to understand how miserable of an experience solo queue is maybe once they get 25+ min que times and it gets added to 4v1 they will realize something is wrong
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I mean they will keep the map changes so it's still a survivor sided patch going live.
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Yeah, why do you think queue times are so bad? Survivors figured this out 6 months ago.
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What is your average escape rate? I want to understand why you believe the game is so “killer sided.”
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I almost never lose on killer in 1vs4. I literally don't remember when I lost the last time. This was not the case 2 or 3 years ago when I had to work for wins.
SoloQ experience has gotten worser and worser over the years. I just want twd achievement and then Im probably done. Swf is only way to go.
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I just posted my stats to show that I play survivor more than I play killer and I fully disagree with you. Is my opinion only valid if I agree with you?
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I honestly don't know why they added down votes to the forum, even the most supremely neutral takes will have 30 down votes. I have been more on the survivor side for nearly a couple years at this point but it's pretty obvious by the down votes of certain posts and replies how many one sided survivors there are here.
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Why don’t you play competitively then? I’m not trying to be rude - it’s a serious question. If you are that good, you could make some money in competitions or streaming.
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Did we forget that the pallet density on a good chunk of maps is going to be increased? The anti-tunneling changes may not be coming, but having pallets spawn closer together is definitely going to help.
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Ok if I’m not allowed to have an opinion based on my on experience, then let’s use the overall escape rate stats. On average, survivors escape 40% of the time. Apparently this is way too killer-sided. So what should the average escape rate be then? At high MMR 4-man SWF it’s 45%. I have no idea what my MMR is but I do know what when I face a full team of coordinated SWF who are all very good at looping I have to sweat my butt off to get kills. I’m not a god-level killer and I don’t play the s-tier killers. Maybe I’m just very bad at killer, but I’ve seen plenty of other killer players on this forum with similar feedback. Is this game only going to be not “killer-sided” if the average escape rate is 45% or higher for all players?
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50% like any BALANCED game should be.
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The latest average escape rate for survivors at 4-man SWF at high MMR (so the most difficult level for killers) is 48%, according to BHVR stats. So what you want is for the average killer at average level to have an even more difficult experience than this? I am just wondering if you are considering this at all.
I truly believe we need a game mode where survivor players can go against bot killers and adjust the difficulty level to their liking, because that is the only way some people are going to be happy.-3 -
I play only 2v8 for now, the only mode I feel like is fun for me, normal mode is just so unfun with all this tunneling/slugging and humping after that
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This entire forum was a series of consecutive tantrums and threats to permanently quit the game when the ptb was first announced.
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I agree they should've push new elusive status with longer endurance (should also work on endgame) thing and anti-slug at least, we desperately need new content on survivor gameplay it's really stale and boring lately
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I am the average killer at average MMR and the buffs were extremely appealing to me.
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Sorry if I was unclear in what I was referring to in my comment. This specific comment you are replying to wasn’t about the anti-tunnel/anti-slug stuff. It was addressing the overall balance question - essentially what should the “target” escape rate be. My comment was directed at those who feel that it should be 50% average across all survivor players rather than 40%.
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I see it, but all of this discussion is about how the potential buffs and penalties will affect who. There's this habit of almost everyone to use high MMR, skilled 4-mans as the base around which all balance should revolve, as though the vast majority of players should have to suffer because these people exist. As much as I hate going against people like that and I will 100% lose when I do, I don't think the game should orbit around them. If they're better as a team then you'll lose and that's fine. With some tweaking, these changes would help the average, fair killer and make the average survivor feel less hopeless and that's what's needed.
And if it's 48% ER for them that's kind of abysmal for the cream of the crop when there are killers with 90% KRs. I've never seen a survivor stat even approaching that number.
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“but it would be 100% deserved to all killer mains that immediately started doom posting about these changes”
There were a lot of YouTubers that were killer mains that I liked and I was subbed for a long time but after this update and the way they were acting with the doomposting, I unsubbed from them. The only dbd YouTubers I follow now are Scott June and Otz.
Also these people doomposting were gonna play anyway.
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I say it all the time, but that would be quickly undone with a 3rd Resident Evil chapter. It's nearly impossible to affect the turnover rate strongly enough that you don't end up being replaced.
It really depends. When the stars align, the game is more viable and more fun for Survivor. That doesn't change the fact that we still get Killers who will aggressively camp/tunnel/slug from the very start of the trial before I even know I have good synergy with my teammates. Or that the game still doesn't do all that it can to help Killer pull in extra kills at/near the end of the trial, regardless of how they performed.
All that to say that I agree with you, but I only think it's one part of the issue. At some point it might be worth considering adjustments that scale between MMR brackets and things like that.
During that Blight streak a couple of years ago, someone said that the disparity between the big comp teams points to a fundamental imbalance with the game. That despite any variables, you shouldn't have one side maintaining a 10x higher win streak. The answer might be that Blight is too strong. It might be that Survivor is too weak. Whatever it is, it's there and it's not invisible.
It's a delicate situation. While you're absolutely right, it becomes a problem when the anti-go next/AFK crows fiasco was so recent and much more dire. I wanna say they've learned from it and hopefully that's what we're seeing now, but those consequences still exist.
I think we can all agree that the way they handled the situation overall has contributed the most to the unrest.
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I understand your frustration, OP. However, there were some pretty serious problems with the systems as they were implemented on the PTB, and number changes alone were not going to be sufficient to fix those issues. Unlike the anti-3 gen system which is actually pretty good at only punishing 3 genning and not interfering with normal play, this was not the case with these systems at all.
The slugging changes weren't actually too far off from being okay (only thing that was needed imo was to remove basekit Tenacity and stop the 90 second timer from increasing in certain situations), but the tunneling changes had a lot more issues and the triggers for certain bonuses/penalties were far too broad and didn't take enough context into consideration. For example, there was no differentiation between a survivor actually getting hard tunneled vs. a survivor who got off the hook and immediately went back to a generator, or a hex totem, or some other important objective (ie. the system didn't take conspicuous actions into account, only whether they were last hooked or not, which is too broad). Unhook protection mechanics were still abusable even with no collision (you could still put yourself inside the other survivor basically), and in rare cases, there was actually an edge case which rewarded the killer for tunneling if two survivors were hooked in a short timeframe (ie. Survivor A is on hook, Survivor B gets hooked before Survivor A gets saved, killer goes back to hook and hard tunnels Survivor A, but it counts as a non-consecutive hook action and gave bonuses which shouldn't be awarded). There were some other issues as well. Smaller tweaks and number changes weren't going to be able to address these problems, and overall, it was not in a state that was ready to release to live servers.
I do want these problems with the game addressed, but it needs to be done the right way, and I would much rather delay the system's implementation and take more time to improve it rather than rushing something into the game that is flawed and incomplete.
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It's not just "one sided survivor" players who think this update should go through (after some changes of course). Tunnelling doesn't just affect survivors. It helps mask issues that weaker killers desperately need addressed by artificially increasing their killrates and making them appear fine on the surface. In the same vein, those who increase their MMR faster than they should will then come here complaining about swfs every single game because of course theyre getting more difficult opponents at a higher MMR bracket. What else did they seriously expect? Falling back into appropriate MMR brackets will improve the feel of the game for everyone.
The benefit i do think it will have for survivors is it making the game more attractive, especially for new players, as it removes the negativity bias they develop every time they get tunnelled out. This also benefits killer by helping with queue times.
You wanna talk about downvotes, I guarantee alot of killer mains will throw some my way. Goes both ways.
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I fully agree with you, like everything you said. It wouldn't bother me personally one bit if the changes got pushed through other than the game incentivizing kicking gens more and more when it's kinda my bit to never to do so(obviously irrelevant). It's just not a killer sided take to say something like 6 hooks is a bit much or base kit tenacity shouldn't be a thing or that it's not crazy to push this back one patch for refinement. Those comments shouldn't be met with 4 upvotes and 36 downvotes. Both sides drop crazy takes on this forum but the neutral ones from a slight killer perspective are met with massive downvotes. The mecca person will say the most anti-killer, survivor biased thing and be met with a positive upvote ratio. It's a simple observation and it makes it hard to take this forum seriously.
A month or two back I said the kill rate numbers are always going to look bad because of how many survivors in any mmr just play for fun one game or troll or whatever else, even 4 man swfs will go into a game just to mess around even if they could walk on a killer. A chest build is innate trolling and game losing behavior but you can't fault people for using a build for fun(it just means they are lowering their chances to win).Like 4 mans in god validation dh, prime CoH, 100% bugged IW and UB had 47% escape rate. 50% escape rate even above the soft cap would indicate survivors are broken. That comment got like 20 downvotes and 3 upvotes. That's not an absurd thing to say and it's not even killer biased, anyone who plays survivor would know I'm right unless they are exclusively playing to win in 4 mans. People just don't know the nuance of statistics in regards to their multiplayer game.
With all that said the tunneling and slugging changes with very minor tweaks should be pushed through and the game is slightly killer sided on average imo right now. It doesn't help the playerbase isn't very competitive and don't go out of their way to learn.
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It's really not that deep. Again, as me and countless other unbiased players have stated, survivor is still the stronger role, before this update goes live and since the beginning. Stop complaining and just be patient, its gonna come back in a few months with balance adjustments, hopefully ones that target only extreme tunneling and not all tunneling at anytime.
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yeah im not touching survivor till they implement some sort of anti-tunneling. i only play survivor in evetns like 2v8
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The ptb changes were in no way fair. . I had 2 matches against bully squads and it felt like 2017 again
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How the heck is your milquetoast taken beingdownvoted
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So you lost 2 games, and you think that's abnormal in a pvp game? So it's "fair" when you win most games?
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My guy, not all of the problems with the survivor experience in game can be solved with pallets.
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They were probably better then you the PTB doesn't have MMR. I had a few games my self where the killer 12 hooked the team at 3 gens. The team you have and who your vs could be any skill level. This is why the PTB shouldn't have been used to test the system AT ALL. It should have went live for testing give everyone in there own MMR brackets the chance to see how it plays out.
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Buddies and I tend to play every Friday - last few weeks have been doing HD2 instead. Had planned to come back Friday (couple days ago). Come back to fixes being “paused” and SEVEN tunneling slugging killers in a row before we gave up and went back to HD2.
Im becoming suspicious that we’re in the stage of the game where we’ll look back in a few months and realize this is when the game died.
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we were just doing fine when there was no basekit BT, anti camp meter, or suggested anti slug and anti tunnel mechanics. why this sudden uproar of survivors needing 1000 things in their basekit to play the match, tunneling, slugging, camping has always existed but that never made me quit the game
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It will never be enough for some people
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Because overreacting to the SLIGHTEST inconvenience is where killers put the bar this week.
Or is it only ok when THEY do it? My b
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You didn't play the ptb did you? It was in no way an overreaction.
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Right. Totally. Totally a killer player and not a salty survivor going. "Hello fellow killers". Power struggle and flip flop with the basekit anti slug was obnoxious as sin, and with breakdown and sabo builds survivors could create 3 minute dead zones where they just could infinitely get back up.
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all Im saying is i better not hear no killer complain about queue times when patch comes out(especially the streamers), sympathy is out the window
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Two matches against organized, skilled players isn't exactly a good reflection of things overall. I lose against bully squads outside the ptb too.
Post edited by cogsturning on-1 -
Dunno man, you're kinda downplaying that you misunderstood what was happening with the update and then saying you don't care if killers as a whole get affected by the blowback as long as it hurts the ones you had a bad engagement with online. Like I know it's callous and stupid and mean to just say touch grass but legitimately please go outside and maybe invite an online friend or two to meet up. Like I live near this cool chinese store that's run by old ladies called and it's one of the best places to go for neat and different snacks to head home with. Like there's a lot of revitalizing stuff you can do that necessitates walking away from the game. I want you to log off and go hang out at cool places because this clearly affects you. Also try out blood sausages, they kinda suck after the first one as the aftertaste ramps up, sorta like bacon but with a more exotic flavor.
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almost like… killers (and some survivor mains) were giving actual feedback for them to collect. Instead of whining about things with no real information/suggestions other than “killers mean! Always tunnel! I want to be able to play bad and still get to BM at the gates with my buddies!”
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Yeah people were pointing out issues. Right now is just survivors going reee
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Many posts criticizing these changes admit that slugging and tunneling have to go, but that these changes are too heavy handed and broadly punishing to normal gameplay instead of targeting the problem behavior? How is that against ANY change? Or do you just try to demonize a whole group of people you disagree with by pretending they all completely agree with the worst examples among them because you have no real valuable rebuttal to their points? Just looking at the notes anyone with any amount of game knowledge could see that the basis for these changes was flawed.
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At no point in my post did I say the changes weren't flawed. You're making a whole heap of assumptions about me. This community has been embarrassing over the last week and I stand by that. I've given my feedback over the changes enough elsewhere.
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no but you’re trying to portray this delay as a product of nothing but uninformed outrage instead of what it was, a needed delay of extremely flawed changes.
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im glad they didnt push the changes, if they did i would certainly have never touched killer again and im sure many others feel that way
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No, I was literally referring to the fact that the meltdowns started before the PTB had even started, and as such prevented constructive conversations from being had on this forum once it had come out. I said nothing about identified flaws.
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I've noticed a huge up tick in slugging and tunneling this last two weeks like the conclusion killers came to about the potential anti t/s system was just to do more of it. Luckily I also have no mither so no slugging for me
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