So still no ghoul changes huh?

This is the blight problem you don't give a killer an insane mobility ability and then make him regular speed there has to be a tradeoff and if your arguing against this then why is Chucky 4.4ms? Make him 4.6 then make it make sense.

Furthermore even if ghoul is 4.4 he still has a insane mobility ability to close the distance this wouldn't be an issue for him or blight if they were 4.4

So leaping across the map with his power, stopping on a dime behind a survivor., and then downing them doesnt count as using his power because he still uses the basic attack button? I suppose we need to buff spirit then by that logic.

Both sides have easy to use perks. Down a survivor and half the gens explode. Hook a survivor and all the gens block. Kick a gen or load into the map to bypass any game sense in locating survivors. I can keep going...

2 things.

1. I don't understand what you are trying to show me here because this is maps and we are talking about a specific killer
2. If you read i mention nightlight because its the only current data we have (albeit very small and slanted for sure), and then immediately start talking about OFFICIALLY RELEASED STATS from the developers so again, not sure what you are talking about here.

This! People tend to forget or not care about the fact that the hit through the wall might have actually happened while the survivor was not behind the wall.

I've had this happen multiple times. I see the hit clearly happen way before the survivor is behind a wall or rock or any obstacle, but when i pull closer the survivor is behind something making the hit look janky.

For some reason i've noticed this happen more with console folks. Its the same thing after i down someone and they teleport 2 meters forward, happens a lot with console players.

Blight can down with his power, Ghoul can't. You just want Ghoul butchered.

E: Like here's the thing, you suggest 4.4 m/s which is already a flawed idea but then you were like "also let's nerf all these other aspects of his power" to the point where you can't seriously say you think that he'd be worthy of being 4.4 m/s. I get it, he can be annoying, but you're not actually arguing for a reasonable solution. You want him Skull Merchant'd.

Tell that to all the people who refuse to play now because of Ghoul lol

Why would I let you know who they are? If this thread wasn't enough to show how much people dislike them, then I don't know what to tell you.

People who aren't playing the game aren't going to be telling you specifically "I stopped playing because of Ghoul" they have moved on until nerfs are posted, I know too many people who Ghoul was the final reason they stopped playing followed by the announcement of the QoL being cancelled.

Screaming anime child who grabs you through walls might excite you, but it certainly doesn't others, myself included. LMAO

idk if you look at what killers are 4.4 m/s (including Vecna 2) or lower (Nurse) you can see that the primary way of downing survivors is directly tied with using their abiltity to injure down and/or they have a power that almost completely ignores traditional survivor defenses/movement capabilities in a very obvious & intuitive way. If you make Ghoul 4.4 m/s then you naturally have to actually buff his power significantly to make it more consistent at securing downing people without having to engage with the standard looping gameplay. Because 4.4 m/s looping just isn't viable, even if the killer has great map mobility and the ability to quickly injure (but not down) with their power. See old Legion…there's a reason we all used the 3 hit down add-on or moonwalked people to death instead of trying to frenzy then chase normally.

That means buffing his power vaults, removing the cooldown on pallet break thing, making leap targeting more consistent (because it "lingers" on objects/people seemingly depending on ping or something) so you can make bodyblock plays all the time, giving him his range back, etc. Or make it so leap attacks down outright. And I don't think anyone really wants that? Because that's how you get old Chucky 2.0 on steroids.

Increasing cooldowns just sounds boring for everyone. I guess it technically would raise the skill floor, which is part of the reason why you see more Ghouls than Billy/Blight (or at least I do), but kinda lame. People like pressing buttons in the videogame. Making it so people can press buttons less is a lazy way of doing game design. See Marvel Rivals.

The only way I could see making 4.4 m/s work is if you made him 4.4 m/s when not enraged, and 4.6 m/s while enraged. That would introduce an interesting dynamic where you're highly encouraged to use leap attacks as often as possible (and hit the QTE) to stay enraged and able to chase properly. If you end up in a chase for too long to the point where you run out of enrage, then you might have to leave it. If everyone stays injured, you might want to still use your leap attack anyway so you can get your movement speed back. In this scenario (and IMO they should do it anyway) they'd probably need to address the whole "you landed the leap but didn't get the attack off but you still get enrage thing" but that's neither here nor there.

Freddy can be good of course. On top of being able to teleport he can spawn many dream pallets and at least when survivors are asleep his dream snares are good in chase and he has an add on that puts people back to sleep faster. At the same time I wouldn’t seem him as being lethal to the point of needing any change. I would sooner talk about the real issues such as map layouts and other more concerning problems. Finding the sweet spot on pallet density and addressing hyper gen focus seems more important to me. But the game isn’t so simple and any change can trigger issues that will also need addressing. Certain killers either their various strengths and weaknesses will need to be considered along with perks and other such elements from both sides. I think rocket science might be easier to master ……

I was gone for a while, so it's a bit late of a reply.
But in short:
You can easily filter through messages, but if enough of those messages appear, it's something to worry about in general. Even if 40% of users say "X sucks", it should be the full time job of one of the analysts to find out why people think X sucks and do something to reduce why it sucks. It could be 100% fine and working as intended, users are not experiencing joy when seeing that thing. Unconstructive feedback might not help find the issue, but it SHOULD make it a higher priority because its mentioned more often.

It's the job of business analists and in this case also community managers, to convert those messages into a single ticket and adjust priority based on how common the complaint is, how severe the reaction is to the players and what the effect is. Constructive feedback, normally speaking, will be summarized if it actually deconstructs on why, and will be added to the ticket if multiple people have similar feedback. But that requires people reading the feedback at all. Right now, it just feels like every single feedback gets summarized into a very generic sentence, and those sentences are summarized into a single ticket, while using chatGPT or something to summarize it. Which means that common complaints will have bigger impact than detailed complaints, where back in the day, it was the other way around.

Pain Res these days is a perfect example of it. It's TOO effective on mobility killers. Especially since they improved scourge hook spawns (prior to that, you pretty much required Agitation if you wanted consistent value, nowadays, no matter where you down someone, unless its Midwich, you can basically guarantee value). It has issues. It is known that it has issues specifically on mobility killers and it's only working on normal speed killers if they tunnel (which, they couldnt rely on as much if Pain Res would disable after 1 kill). There was a period before where Pain Res was too effective on mobility killers, 15% of people wrote feedback on why it was too effective (info on where the generator with the most progression is+15% regression applied+you could hook anyone to trigger it, meaning it was effectively free and could trigger it 12 times). You had 85% of people just spouting "pain res too stronk, plz nerf". Nowadays, I have seen up to 30% of posts explaining why pain res is a bit problematic (mobility killers can tunnel and still profit off Pain Res, especially thanks to DMS and Grim Embrace, even tho the perk was changed to make tunnelling less effective), and that 2 simple changes (mainly disabling it after 1 kill) can make the perk 1000x more fun to face.

As for my "militant" perspective. No, I have been constructive, even for the majority of the period when constructive stopped having an impact. They have shown that the past 2 years, constructive feedback doesnt matter. I've seen essays on why something doesnt work, and what would be changed to make it work in 2020 and 2025. In the 2020 version, you would maybe see a perk see a slight nerf in their power, but a huge buff in their utility, making it overall a big buff. In 2025? They just make big number bigger, see the bigger number didnt do much, make the number even bigger untill it does do something, then a new killer or perk comes by that actually offers utility in their power that has synergy with that perk and now the perk is busted. People love to hate on the old stance of "bhvr cant buff something without also slightly nerfing it", but that did grow consistency in balance.

And while that does lead to sudden changes that might not work, at least it leads to changes. We've been giving extremely constructive feedback on why RECOVERING WHILE CRAWLING, and CRAWLING FASTER should be basekit, aka effectively Tenacity basekit.. There has been reached a consensus that while some killers will struggle with that, the vast majority wouldnt even notice, because most killers do not need to slug. It would hard counter killers who slug early game (especially tournament nurses and blights), and hard counter slugging in the 2v1. Yet the moment it got implemented, 3 big name content creators claimed it was a BS change and got their communities to yell at BHVR. Despite their reasoning literally being "Why shouldnt I be able to slug survivors for 4 minutes?". 3 years of consistent constructive feedback vs 1 week of yelling. They have lost the right to constructive feedback by listening to people who just echo someone, without even considering the fact that further adjustments can be made (as an example, slugs get their aura revealed every 30 seconds). They decided to follow the screams, rather than years of consistent points.

So simply put, we(people who have been giving constructive feedback for years, but recently got denied because of vocal minorities) decided to scream the opposite, untill they actually have proven to listen to why something needs to change. It's part of the reason why my playtime went from 20 hours a week, to barely 20 hours a month(and that's only because of gamemodes). I would instantly jump back to 10-20 hours a week if they implement basekit anti-slug and improve basekit anti-tunnel, as they promised they would early 2025. Untill then, I will watch the playercount trend drop and only log on if I see a small spike because 2v8 or smth returned for 2 weeks.

There is a very simple or very complex way you can go about this. The simple way is to prevent the ghoul from canceling his power while he is mid swing so he cant just instantly basic attack you after traveling across the map to your location.

The second option is to completely change the way he gets his enraged mode. You can keep the mid swing cancelation to do this. After the Ghoul ends a swing, he has "x" seconds to perform some sort of basic attack/bite that will then put him into his enraged state. (the autolock hitscan is just too easy)

In his current state, his animations are buggy and you can't always tell when he is using his power because he's just stuck in the normal running animation, the initial hits are super easy and have 0 skill expression, and being able to just swing and cancel all movement/swing penalty by cancelling power mid swing make the second hits also super easy to achieve.

You can either keep him like legion where first hits are easy to get, but the second takes skill and mind games to get, or make the first hit have downsides like missing, but the second hit is easy (like previously mentioned)

isnt that crazy? i feel like they'd scream if they came out with a killer who's power just jumps 3 meters forward and doesnt do anything special lol