http://dbd.game/killswitch
We need more Elusive perks! (and old perks rework as Elusive perks!)
I'm really looking forward to this new effect in the game, and I really hope it can form many stealth playstyles in the future.
But as I can see, there're many stealth perks which the effects are very similar to the Elusive effect, but have some small difference between them, and now we have a status to define these stealthy effects, so I think it is an opportunity to carry forward and make Elusive more identifiable in the game.
For the perks what I think can make a use of Elusive effect, see the table below:
Perk Name | Current Effect | Differences with Elusive | Description |
|---|---|---|---|
Babysitter |
|
| Altruism perk, and some kind of returning unhook Elusive |
Come and Get Me! |
|
| Altruism perk, which already risk themself while using this perk. In current version it can't really help people if the killer have ears |
Low Profile |
|
| A low pick rate Stealth perk, just a little buff and make a name for Elusive! |
Parental Guidance |
|
| Same as Low Profile |
Teamwork: Toughen Up |
|
| Same as Low Profile |
Comments
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Oh my god I accidentally posted it, let me take a while to finish it
Edit: Done!
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Yeah, I do not mind having these applied to the previous iterations.
I am aware that people will view them too strong because people will argue that tunneling is a part of the game, "Why are you taking a part of the game away from me?" I will say that I do believe if you apply this to a Borrowed Time, No One Left Behind, Babysitter - I'm only speaking on these three because they are my experience of providing anti-tunnel to other survivors (even if I don't use NOLB myself all that much)...you will see killers, at least in mid-high MMR proxy camping more (which I myself do not mind, you proxy camp to your heart's content I am going to go do gens, reset other survivors, or I will waste your time on the hook.) type of mentality.
So, even though I can your perspective on giving these perks a little love (I do use Borrowed Time and Babysitter together) just to prevent someone from being tunneled off hook. I will tell you by I know how killers are and how they think (even if I haven't played that side of the role seriously in a year) if I was an Onryo main (who I played) and I saw Behavior apply that to the game and I came from a "I must tunnel you to create a 1v3 as quick as possible." (I didn't think like this when I played Onryo - however, this is what high skilled killers think and operate on.
They think, "Okay, you're going to handhold the survivors more - I will proxy camp to ensure once I see Yui off the hook I will follow her, down her, hook her again (it's why you see so many people complain about second chance perks).
Why is it that second chance perks get so much hate? You have to eat a DH to rehook a survivor, you have to eat an OTR/DS to rehook a survivor, under your want to add this stuff to other perks - the same logic applies.
I am fine with it, if I notice a killer is proxy camping or let's say a killer gets in chase with a Sable in the middle of the map. I unhook Yui with BT/Babysitter + Elusive effects, you will have people complain that my build (which isn't meta at ALL) is unfun, unfair, and ruins their tempo.
Edit: I do believe people should have people on the hook longer. I will sit on my gen and complete it and I will look at the hud determining - my Gen is the lowest progress I go for save, my Gen is the highest progress I can wait and complete my Gen first. - same thing for when I see someone getting tunneled, I will unhook the later into their unhook progress bar. There is no reason why a survivor who notices a killer is tunneling to go insta-unhook them again. I will take a protection hit for the tunneled survivor, I'll try to heal the tunneled survivor - but I am not going to go down for you (killer will down me, I'm on the ground, and then Yui is still in chase wanting to be obliterated from the match). I can sympathize with tunneled people, but you know I cannot control that any more than taking a hit for you, pallet stunning, or flashlight save (even if this is only seconds of help, that's all I can provide for you).
Just my 2 cents here.
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Yep, I can see how Elusive frustrating the killer who wants to tunnel for builds like Remember Me, or just simply wants to tunnel, but that's the point why the "perks" exist, you build them for a playstyle and/or to counter a playstyle. And I'm glad you mentioned it.
Those rework suggestion are based with my experience, as a Altruism perk lover, these perks which has stealth effects can't really do thier jobs(hide people from killer) at most of the times, and it might finally do things with these buffs.
And the main purpose of why this post is made is because I really love this new bunny status effect, and I would love to see it appear in more perks! :D
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For sure, I see perks as cause-effect.
It's why when I see all the time here and in my own games of tunneling, I will use these perks.
Borrowed Time + Off The Record
Borrowed Time + Babysitter
Off The Record + Blood Rush
Off The Record + Wicked
Believe it or not, I do not use Decisive Strike. Not that I think the perk is horrible, I just don't care for a 4 second stun when most of what I see in my games are Nurse, Blight, and Kaneki. I would rather have OTR + Blood Rush to waste your time. You hit me, I use BR to trigger another Sprint Burst. You want to come after me still, I will take you away from your three gen and I will take you across the map on a journey.
That's why I use Deja Vu, so I can directly loop away from the 3-Gen if in chase or break it so it never comes an issue to begin with. I do believe that the new perk, I can't be bothered to look it up won't really have as much play time in mid-high MMR - it's too situational to only apply to the obsession, but I also understand why Behavior didn't make it a universal experience either.
I like the idea of it, it would help people in low-mid MMR to stop being tunneled so early on in their own games - but mid-high MMR would also be affected to survivors more efficient and you have killers being upset over that. To me, as I've always said perks are tools and you will get consequences for the perks each side brings or playstyle the killer/survivor provides for a trial.
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I definitely don't enjoy being tunneled but this negatively impacts killers tuned specifically to aura reading such as Scratched mirror myers, I'm about to make a post about that but yeah myers fell way down the tier list especially in scratched mirror mode with this recent update.
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i just want post unhook Elusive🙁. all the perks you mentioned could benefit from Elusive. I would throw in a few more perks too.
Dance With Me: giving this perk Elusive would be a fun way to partially counter I’m All Ears.
Buckle Up: would be a really nice Anti-Slug perk and make it stand out a lot more.
Deception: would make the perk more consistent and not borderline useless while injured.
Off The Record: This one might be controversial but since it no longer lasts 80 seconds, i think it would make sense and simply the perk even more by just stating it gives Endurance and Elusive for 40 seconds after being unhooked. it already has 2/4 of the effects from Elusive and used to also hide scratch marks so i dont see any harm with just adding Elusive to it.
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As someone who plays about 70/30 killer/survivor, this sounds like nightmare fuel.
I think a lot of survivor mains misunderstand why tunneling happens. Most killer mains don't actually enjoy tunneling. It's not about picking someone and ruining their game for the fun of it (it is for some, sure. But its very much the minority), its them trying to win and having limited options to do so. Gens are so fast these days, and survivors can heal in under 5 seconds with meta perks. Tunneling, slugging, and proxy camping become the only way for killers to generate pressure and buy themselves time.
From a killer perspective, tunneling isn't the problem, its the symptom. As long as its the most effective way to win a game, the killers who are focused on winning are going to do it.
I say this as a killer who goes out of my way to not tunnel, and i frequently lose because of it. I have more fun having a competitive, intense game than I do when I focus on winning. But I'm not the norm, the norm is killers playing to win, and if they want to win they have to tunnel.
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No, no we don't. It's like you all want killers to double down on all the things you supposedly dont like. Killer chase perks aren't allowed to be good, Hex perks are ass, Elusive everywhere kills aura, so what do you think killers are going to do? Keep stacking slowdowns because theres nothing left that's reliable to use.
Stripping killer information results in more camping, tunnelling and slugging because there is no time to waste looking for survivors anymore with gens flying and all the second chances so you have to force more efficiency. Aura's actually promote chasing other survivors.
Do you all just not realise that limiting killers options isnt what you want to do?
Are we going to turbo buff killer perks to counter this? (lol no BHVR wont) More screaming, more expose, more hinder, more broken, denying windows/pallets, denying second chance perks etc etc etc. Killer will have to become far far more lethal with extended timers on everything (delete vigil too) to make other perks worth using with the direction you want to go. And thats without considering nerfing other survivor stuff to compensate. (If you can hide easily then chase/exhaustion perks have to be nerfed hard)
Starting a power creep perk arms race isnt going to be good for the game whatsoever.
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I do agree that many may not enjoy tunneling, but even when gen regression was strongest, and there was not a reason to tunnel, it was still extremely common. It's because it's the path of least resistance. Speaking from experience, even when something isn't necessary at all, if it's still easier, then players will do it. And I say players not killers because it has nothing to do with a specific role. If you're curious about what I mean, the very first iteration of 2v8 is a perfect example, as flashlights didn't exist, no perks, and pallet saves didn't exist (because killers would just stomp and they would instant go to hook) and full 8 team slugs still happened, and it happened so often that they had to add in pallet saves, and flashlights for an anti-slug in the next iteration so that it wouldn't happen again. There was no reason to slug because saves were not possible, but it's easier to slug everyone to win rather than hook so that's what players did. OR the infinite toolbox bug, everyone ran it. Because it made the game easier. Anytime a perk, map, killer or item is bugged it shoots in popularity because many players like when things are easy. Players are going to do whatever is easiest, and tunneling has consistently been the easiest way to get a survivor out of the game since.. well since the game existed.
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I mean now that we have elusive it would be easier just to give the older concealing perks elusive instead of letting them be power crept by elusive
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I really want more help for survivor. I personally think the role is in a bad place for the average player. But I'm going to be very out of character and give this a hard no. I think Elusive was a great idea as a post unhook protection. It should be included in the basekit BT for 15s. That would be a perfect use for the concept. But it becoming an element of perks is really concerning, particularly one's like Extrasensory Perception that you can trigger on demand.
As a killer who is against tunnelling but uses aura to find a new target fast, if everyone starts hiding their presence and negating my build (especially the unhooker, in a case like Come and Get Me), you're leaving me with just the one target I can see: the recently unhooked. I think killers are really going to pay for not allowing the ptb changes to go through (with modifications) if we keep seeing Elusive in perks. I also really don't want to switch to these agonizingly boring anti-gen builds everyone uses, but if my aura read ones become non-viable, what am I supposed to do?
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I'd like to see survivor and killer mains get more new stuff, but I think elusive is a miss outside of the unhook elusives. If a party wanted to run full stealth with elusive all that does is encourage the killer to target and kill whoever they find relentlessly, regardless of previous hooks. All this would lead to is a meta in where the weakest person on your team gets tunneled not because the killer chose to, but because that's the only person the killer could find.
It would also, yes, enforce the slowdown meta.1
