Fast track is unfair and bad design

I need to tunnel cause they nerfed pig and I'm not even a pig main. This one's for you piggy

Idk I think Fast track is just a Win harder perk? You were pretty much winning with it but you didn't really need it y'know?

Killer power diversity justifices bad perks? So Stbfl got nerfed cause Nurse exist? Unbound was good then they nerfed it. Too strong on Nurse? Both good chase perks btw which lower tiers use more. So this arguement isn't even consistant with how devs balance the game. We haven't seen a good exposed perk in a while despite the Nurse nerf and no, Friends till the end is not good.

"Some killers have add-ons that allow them to be played in unique ways". Not every killer has one, you don't have an infinite amount of add-ons and not every single one of these are improvements over the base-kit power. This isn't 2020. We don't have Huntress with 3 Iri hatchetes or Alch ring Blight that can win with one hand and closed eyes (that's a good thing btw just saying).

Via perks that you can share with every survivor. Putting that aside i don't know why would you change this? If you give survivors even small individual additional boost like vaulting 3% or cleanising 10% faster then you are going to just see the ones with the best effects, and i do not think we need less diversity in DbD.

What side effect? If a perk is overtuned it means that the perks simply needs a nerf, killer diversity has nothing to do with it. The only side effect is that strong killers make use out of perks better than lower tiers.

If perk is broken on a stealth killer then it will be probably unfair for the rest and deserves a nerf. Even if you create one that only buffs stealth killers, then maybe it should stay considering it affects such mediocre killer archetype, depending ofc on how good it is.

Obviously some perks cannot be designed becouse they would work too well on S tier and yet you can just nerf them like they did to Nurse to prevent her from using Starstruck and Awakened Awareness. Still no buff to either despite that.

It all depends. If you want to goof around or play interesting builds then Killers have bigger pool of interesting perks and builds. If you want to win, Survivors have bigger pool of good and stronger perks.

5 hooks is 90% permanent progress, when all survivors have fast track. I would say that definetly makes that game faster. You really don't need many hooks for this.

With each hook you give survivors BNP with 18% permanent progress.

Thing is hyperfocus+stakeout you kinda need full build around it. Fast track is very good option to use even as single perk.
I don't think it's broken on level of MFT,CoH,MoM, but it is overtuned and quite an unhealthy design imo.

I used Fast Track on a meme build before the buff; it didn't need it. It was fine as is. I fear now that the community is complaining about it, it will get nerfed/or changed to something worse than it's original release. Then it becomes a useless perk, and we already have enough of those.

It would have been better to address Red Herring and give it a buff/change. That perk is terrible and only two people in the entire DBD community use it.

"noed guarantees 4 Downs in end game if all survivors are still alive"

equivalent would be NOED gives you at least an easy down in endgame

I said exactly the value that Fast track gives to survivors, I didn't say they will 4 escape because of it.

Regarding your "issues"

You already did the math to assume the person hooked isn't on a gen.

I did math for 3 survivors, on the screenshot all 4 survivors had fast track. So someone would need to not be on gen while 4 other survivors get hooked to lose the value of Fast track.

You can die with charges.

With 3 charges? sure. Otherwise if you get tunneled, you are not getting charges. If you die with 9 charges you screwed it.

You can dump charges into a gen that's already almost finished.

I will tell you a secret. You can choose to not hit great skill check.

You can have all 3 final gens with charges added, only one of these actually matters.

True, but one of them will still get done faster because of fast track.
You can choose to put all of them into one gen too…

You can be at cap doing something other than a gen when someone is hooked and those tokens are wasted.

You were not working on single gen while other 4 survivors were hooked? Yeah, not even Fast track can save this level of useless.

Killer power diversity justifices bad perks?

Here's what I'm responding to: Killer perk diversity is underwhelming compared to survivor

Why bad perks exist is different topic and one that its pretty easy to look at both sides on, especially if you want to just go perk by perk.

So Stbfl got nerfed cause Nurse exist? Unbound was good then they nerfed it. Too strong on Nurse?

Good thing I explained it as a general issue and gave more examples outside Nurse.

"Some killers have add-ons that allow them to be played in unique ways". Not every killer has one,

That's why I said 'some' and not 'all'.

not every single one of these are improvements over the base-kit power.

Do you want diversity, or do you want the most powerful thing every time? Because at a certain point saying 'I want a wide variety of unique killers, them to have a wide variety of perks they can use, and them to have addons to play them in unique ways - and for all of them to be equally strong' eventually becomes unrealistic.

Via perks that you can share with every survivor. Putting that aside i don't know why would you change this? If you give survivors even small individual additional boost like vaulting 3% or cleanising 10% faster then you are going to just see the ones with the best effects, and i do not think we need less diversity in DbD.

You wouldn't. It's an asym. Both sides are going to be unique.

It all depends. If you want to goof around or play interesting builds then Killers have bigger pool of interesting perks and builds. If you want to win, Survivors have bigger pool of good and stronger perks.

And again, killers have a pool of good and stronger base kit killers to choose from. Every survivor is the same. It's much easier to design and balance something when you are only looking at one set of variables and not 42 and ever increasing.

This is the big problem I see with this conversation. Many killers don't spare a thought for how unfair all these wins they get against both weaker and stronger people are—they just win and move on—but then get upset when exceptional players beat them.

Both the comeback ability and snowball potential are part of the problem too, yeah, and it only exists on one side. I can loose three gens with no hooks as killer and still win if my momentum gets going. Such momentum is basically unstoppable. Meanwhile, that momentum the survivor side had with those three gens can disappear in a poof.

For all of us who aren't one of the top comp squads in the world, from someone's point of view you are in the 'bad at the game' category.

I've met my fair share of insanely good people that are at the top of stats and performance and think the game should be balanced around their 10k+ hour experience. They're totally blind to the reality of the game for 95% of the players. Everyone's limited view is a big part of the problem when it comes to discussing this game. It doesn't help that the popular CCs everyone watches are likely in that top 5% and don't reflect anything normal or average.

I get what you’re saying, if you’re choosing not to tunnel and you feel like you’re getting punished, that’s frustrating. But where I push back is the framing. The “this perk leads to tunneling/slugging” argument isn’t new, it’s just the latest version of something people have been saying for  years. The justification changes, but the behavior doesn’t.

Even in your example, the logic kind of reinforces that. Saying “because I didn’t tunnel, gens flew and I lost” naturally implies that tunneling would’ve made you win. And that’s exactly the kind of reasoning people have used long before this perk ever existed. So it’s hard for me to see this as something the perk is causing, rather than just another situation where tunneling is being framed as the optimal response, its kind of like a boogeyman that’s used as a looming threat. Tunneling before this perk would be just as successful as tunneling after it. 

Even if we said that the perk just incentivizes tunneling, I feel that gets tricky, because the incentive already exists at a baseline level, regardless of perks. I said this previously but if the game had no perks in it whatsoever, tunneling would still be strong (stronger probably) and popualr, because its efficiency and impact is not dependent upon perks. So if tunneling is still going to happen before the perk, during the perk, and after the perk, then the perk itself isn’t really the root issue there. And that’s kind of my main point. If argument is just that the perk might be too strong, that’s completely fair. If it’s overtuned, it should be adjusted. But that should be based on actual impact like escape rates, usage, overall data, not tied to a behavior that’s been a constant in the game no matter what.

I don't take screenshots of every single one of my matches like you do (not to mention the new bug where the scoreboard totally glitches out and you can't see the final match results at all sometimes) but if I did, I could show you just as many cases of 3-4 escapes where I was the only one running Fast Track. is it just Fast Track alone? No, but it's the combination of other perks that it has made much, much worse. Now, they could nerf everything else, but none of those were a huge problem until Fast Track came along.

But okay, you are right lets say. So then I won't feel guilty at all with my build that lets me personally finish 2-3 generators in less than the time other survivors finish the rest. Unless the killer tunnels someone, every game I've been in today has been at least 3 of us out. Last one vs. an Iridescent Hatchets Huntress on Dead Dawg was a 4-escape and that's one where I did 3 generators (the 3 non-Blood generators, other survivors were doing the Blood generators, I ignored them) by myself because of how she spread out the hooks like a good little killer.

News flash. You still get stacks of Fast Track even when you are on hook. So just because others are giving me stacks does not mean that I am just sitting on generators. Also, even if I don't finish a generator all by myself, that's 18% or more progress that the killer CANNOT REGRESS. This makes it quicker for other survivors to finish those generators, even If I do not. I can't comment on YOUR games, I can only comment on my own, and in my experience, with the new Fast Track I am getting way more escapes than I used to and seeing more of my solo queue teammates getting out too… and this is coming from a Killer main. You'd think I wouldn't be as good as a survivor (I mean, I am not usually. I always make the joke that if someone is getting tunneled in a match, it's me. Though I am getting somewhat better in chase, I still am terrible.)

If you get tunneled, it doesn't matter what perks you brought, they are all useless. Even second chance perks as they just delay the inevitable. Especially in solo queue.

Yea, like I said. I am agreeing with ya'll now. The perk isn't broken, I just know how to use it in a way most others apparently don't. As long as it remains only awesome players like myself and JG_Darhk that can make it work consistently, it's all good.

I mean, if you are a god looper then yea the killer likely isn't going to tunnel you. But the point is that if the killer is intent on tunneling you personally, none of those perks will make much difference, not even Iron Will and Lucky Break vs. a killer that knows what they're doing.

However, I think part of the problem with all of this is we all have nothing but anecdotal evidence of anything we say about a PvP game's balance. Even big name content creators only can say what they see and have the video to showcase. It's still all anecdotal.