http://dbd.game/killswitch
Lightborn - needs a rework!
This is a perk that kills a lot of fun for the survivor side. Streamers and/or highly skilled survivors will just genrush when they find out the killer has lightborn. But genrushing is boring. The kind of survivors I mentioned above are bored of gens. They go for the thrill of possibly getting a flashlight save. Or blinding the killer at a pallet/window, for a chance of making the chase a bit more challenging for the killer.
Less skilled players might take ages to realize the killer has lightborn, and then throw the game by going for the thrill that's robbed from the get-go. Which is silly. Why this immunity with 0 workarounds?
Forever Entwined (a perk from Ghoul) is much healthier, in my opinion. It doesn't make flashlight/-bang and pallet saves impossible, but instead makes them take much more skill. I've seen even really good survivor streamers struggle against it. (but able to save sometimes!)
Another incredibly annoying thing survivors go through is having to wait in the pre-match lobby until the last 5 seconds to equip a flashlight, just to potentially avoid the killer equipping lightborn. It is very, very draining and ridiculous. It's also annoying for the killer to be hit for 3-4 flashlights last second, without the killer being prepared for it.
Why not make Lighborn a healthy perk instead? (instead of godmode insulation with 0 workarounds)
You can rework Lightborn to contain any of the following elements instead of just giving immunity to light:
- make the timing super precise, like it was in the olden days
- make survivors exhausted upon picking up a survivor from the ground, making crutch perks like Background Player or Sprint Burst unable to activate to aid the flashlight/-bang save
- make recovery from the blind and the stun faster
- after a successful blind, gain blind immunity for 5-10 seconds, to avoid being chain-blinded
- whoever blinded you becomes hindered and/or exposed, to make the save attempts have more weight on them
I want you to make Lightborn into something that increases the skill requirement for the survivors. Current lightborn just cuts off fun, and a whole match is then wasted for no good reason. You did that with Distortion, you turned it from a perk that rewards you from evading the killer, into a perk that rewards you for successfully engaging in chases with killer, and having the skill to last in them.
That's why I love Moment of Glory, Clean Break and OLD Blood Rush. They have thrill in them, but also reward skill. I'd love to see Lightborn going from a braindead perk that kills fun, into a perk that doesn't disable fun, but increases skill requirements instead.
Comments
-
As a Killer, I run Lightborn pretty much 100% of the time. There is nothing less fun as a killer as being unable to get a hook off because the moment you start to pick a survivor up you're yeeted into three deathrays and chain blinded. Rinse and repeat.
-2 -
[Shadowborn] and [Two Can Play] don't see much selection, and I think the reason for that is very complicated, but boils down to action economy versus perk value.
If you nerf Lightborn the gamble stops being worth it compared to the consistent value of Pain Res, Corrupt Intervention, etc etc. Which makes gens harder to do, which isn't fun for anyone but that's the killer meta.
In order to lure someone into light born use without total immunity, it would have to pack some serious benefits; enough to outweigh the constant value addition of a better perk in that slot. In short, Light born would have to be more consistently worthwhile than Pain Res by example, or, more conditionally worth while than something like BBQ or Dead Man's Switch. The changes would need be some uncomfortably large impact to killer benefit for lightborn to remove its immunity. But that's fine because Blinding with a flashlight may be fun but it is not the objective. The gens, which you cited not wanting to do, are the the objective not flashlighting a killer.
Blinding a killer is fun, but being blinded is the opposite of fun. There's a perk that fixes that unfun, and you want to removed because it ruins your fun. That's the boil down of this argument from my perspective. I don't even run Lightborn but this feels like a 'let them eat cake' flavored argument.
"Another incredibly annoying thing survivors go through is having to wait in the pre-match lobby until the last 5 seconds to equip a flashlight, just topotentiallyavoid the killer equipping lightborn. It is very, very draining and ridiculous. It's also annoying for the killer to be hit for 3-4 flashlights last second, without the killer being prepared for it."
I can't say much to this. If I see survivors do this I tunnel them immediately until they leave.-2 -
I agree the killer should not have a perk that just deletes a whole aspect of the game. Survivors should still be able to get the save in some way not have these situations of "haha you cant do flashlight things go gen rush…oh wait no!"
I think adding everything you suggested makes it too strong. fine with suggestions like better timing, exhausted and hindered (def not exposed) But I think a token system would also work, Kind of how they made distortion for survivors due to killers finding that playstyle boring.-1 -
im not sure whats 'fun' to the person who cares about being flashlight saves to the point of wasting a perk slot on them being forced to experience them anyway
from the killer's pov, what is 'interesting' about a perk being a skillcheck they have no agency over the outcome of? it makes it inconsistent and frustrating, for an already niche pick
0 -
I really feel like Lightborne is fine as it is. It's not a strong perk at all. This conversation has been passed around the forums about a few hundred times and it leads back to the same answer every-time.
-1 -
How about no.
4-man flashy squads are a pain to deal with.
-4 -
Its one of the few perks in the game that helps ease "killer anxiety" as playing against a team of people with flashlights/flashbangs/blastmines on discord so that they always drop in an area where if you pick them up as the killer, you are either getting hit with a pallet, or blinded by 2 people at once. This perk removes that particular stress of being in a situation where there is nothing you can do except start slugging everyone.
I don't personally rely on it myself as im confident in how to avoid blinds when picking up, but a newer or less adept player who just wants to get used to the role, usually enjoys that perk greatly and will bring it even if the team doesn't start with flashlights. Removing that perks ease of use will cause several killer players who aren't as comfortable playing that role, stop playing the role entirely as flashlight/flashbangs truly are one of the most annoying parts of playing killer role.
Working that hard to get someone down only for it to reset everytime you pick someone up is not fun, and encourages team slugging. At the very least there arent much for perks to combat sabo squads besides walking faster and farther with 2 perk slots
-1 -
No thanks, lightborn can stay exactly the way it is.
I get the survivor pov of wanting to go for saves and making a build around it and I am normally always pro build diversity but I be totally honest with you when it come to lightborn I don't care about the survivors and I need to be a little bit selfish here.
First of all I second everything shanoa above me already mentioned.
And second if lightborn would be changed in anyway that takes away the 100% immunity that would probably be the day I uninstall for good. No I am not unable to counter flashlight saves I do know how to do it that's not why I run lightborn.
I have a medical problem with flashlights. For whatever reason my brain does not like when I lose vision in games, when I get blinded and I move around to follow survivors via sound I get dizzy and it takes me more then just a second to get a grip on where I am in the map after the blind endet. (This isn't a dbd exclusive issue for me)
This essentialy turns every blind into a full on stun for me which means against someone with a flashlight looping would be the horror cause every pallet break would mean I stand there until the blind is over.
So that means without lightborn I would have to dodge every lobby with a flashlight and if a survivor last second swapps or bring residual manifest or just finds a flashlight by chance in a chest I can't chase that survivor and realistically this would mean I am better of not playing the game.
Bhvr can help those people that use lightborn cause the blinding triggers their light sensitivity but my problem can't be fixed cause losing vision is kinda what the blind is supposed to do.
And yes I know the game cannot cater to every problem even so they should try their best with filters to help people for example with plagues vomit. But we don't talk about me wanting something added to the game, I already have a solution in game right now. I pay for the problem I have with a perk slot that could be used for a perk that is stronger. Yes it happens that I completely counter the build of someone but from my personal experience this happens relatively rarely and many survivors just bring a flashlight without a build around it. And it happens way more frequently that I essentially gimp myself and no one has a flashlight so I only run three perks since I don't specifically equip lightborn to counter but always have it in my loadout.
-1 -
Ironically a 4 man flashlight squad is the best thing for a killer since that means at least 2 of them will always circle around the downed survivor and not doing a gen. Eventually they will do a mistake and will end up either slugged or wounded.
As for the topic - if only perks on survivor side that ruin fun for the killer would be addressed…..
1 -
I don't know about you, but I never use lightborn on one or two persons with a flashlight, I only use it on 3-4.
The reason is simple:
It's simply not fun to play against 3-4 flashlights, sure you can still hook if the survivors have a singular braincell as a company, but if they are actually not just bad, it's more likely that you 4-man slug them. Now the flashlight is not even the only problem - they almost certainly have ub, maybe even with power struggle and the perk from tep to movefaster and heal up during it and they could also have the exhaustion-perk that's like sprintburst while picking up.
So let me explain what you basically need to do then:
you need to down one so they swarm you and don't just do gens.
You basically need to down every other person.
No one of them can lie in a palette basically because they will save themself if they have more than 1 braincell yet again.
Then you have to basically do this all over again because of ub.
(If should dare to pick someone up you will be blinded almost certainly, and if not they will safe themself)
Because of those people that don't have other plans in this game but to drag out rounds and apperantly try to be the most annoying people ever, I really don't think we should change this perk.
(Of course I know that they don't use this rombo-combo all the time, but even 3-4 flashlights alone are often just super annoying because they simply don't do their objective but to try flashlight you, even if they all go down for it. It's just not fun to play against)
0 -
Lightborn definitely isn't healthy and definitely needs changes- it's the same reasoning as Distortion, you can't have something be completely passive and also hard shut down an entire archetype of tools on the opponent's side, it just isn't reasonable.
I also have this suspicion that Lightborn can sort of stunt a player's skill development, because whenever someone brings up Lightborn being kinda messed up, there's often responses that seem to imply you need Lightborn to counter flashlight squads, which obviously isn't true.
Putting that aside, though, I don't think you need to go too overboard with Lightborn changes. I've maintained for a while that what Lightborn should do is still let the blind go through mechanically, just not affect the killer's screen (+ obviously still give the aura afterwards), so that it allows blind-related perks on both sides to still activate while still providing its own benefit and still helping out people who have accessibility issues with the blind visuals.
If we really want Lightborn to still protect against flashlight saves on top of that, then that part should be limited, like with a token system or something along those lines. Some thought and skill should go into outplaying flashlight saves no matter what perks you bring against them, after all.0 -
As someone that relies on the perk for health reasons think this is a good compromise.
Let it always block the visual effect since I don't think any survivor actually cares about that and make the safe immunity token based.
The only addition I would have is that either the tokens need to be fairly easy to acquire or a token only gets consumed if it actually prevents a safe.
There simply is no good way to play around getting blinded when you need to break a pallet, if that eats tokens too the perk is worthless
1 -
Definitely- if it protects against flashlight saves on a token system, tokens should only be burned when a save would've happened. That way they can be appropriately restricted and scarce while still doing their job.
2 -
For same reason delete blight and nurse?
This is not a good argument.
Based
-1
