Can we please do something about this 2 survivor scenario?! It is really boring to deal with.
There are 2 survivors left. Killer downs 1 of them then searches the whole map for other one. It is a waste of time and not very engaging. Give the downed survivor a way to insta-die after like 15s-20s of being downed. It gives the last survivor a fair chance at escaping. Otherwise its an automatic win for killer with everyone DCing when the last survivor is found. There really isn't another way to counter this currently, at least not one that I can think of.
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Remove hatch and replace it with some other objective that doesnt make last 2 survivors stealth hard. Calling for it for 3-4 years but somehow people still think giving win to a surv with 0% effort is a fair mechanic.
-29 -
3k is a win, hatch means absolutely nothing. There's nothing stopping the killer from hooking the 3rd survivor. The only people slugging for 4k's are killer mains who tie their entire ego with being a good killer player lol.
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1. We have adepts and used to have tome challenges directly tied to 4k.
2. Once again. Killer won a game. How is that fair that one surv gets to escape? With ZERO effort, in a LOST game, you might even get hatch spawn under your legs. Answer THAT question.
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As long as hatch is an rng escape mechanic, the best play for killers will be to slug.
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Removing hatch isn't it. Got to be some hope for survs to get out. Number of games where gens don't get finished are very high and once that becomes obvious in a game survs have absolutely no motivation to play on besides trying to squeeze out a few bloodpoints out of a losing game.
Shame antislug got killed. Maybe basekit unbreakable at 2 survs left would help this issue. Slug still gets pressure but doesn't force one player to wait a bleedout timer.
Tbh a lot of it is down to killers. I will 100% slug for the final down but only if I'm either: doing a specific 4k challenge (I very unconcerned about getting a 4k in a normal game), or particularly want the 4th surv dead because they've been toxic or not helped their team. Generally if I do the latter I'll let the slugged surv struggle out and give them hatch if they don't abandon, unless the whole team was toxic. But a lot of killers will play for 4ks like their life depends on it, and it's totally unnecessary, like I said I have zero issue with final surv getting hatch unless they been toxic.
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- non-argument. Slugging for the 4K happens way more often than just Adepts.
- The Killer still won the game. That the Survivor MIGHT get a pity escape does not change that at all. Even when Hatch spawns, the Survivor is at a disadvantage in finding it, since they move slower than the Killer and have to hide. They can basically only get lucky.
I just dont understand why people need to prolong a game where they clearly won. Nobody will debate that a 3K with not all Gens done and a Hatch Escape would be a clear win for the Killer. Yet Killers like to waste everyones time by slugging for the 4K while the Survivors have no way to actually speed this up (the last part is important, before someone comes up with "Yeah, but what is with Survivors waiting at the Exit Gate"…).
@Topic:
At the very least the Survivor on the ground should be able to abandon in a 2v1. This would allow the Killer to slug for the 4K while wasting only the time of one person instead of 2.
In general it is sad that at this point the best way to play the game is to be the antimate.
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Yeah I play both sides about equally and I agree the 2 survivor end game scenarios are super unfun for the survivor side. I think the most fair solution is to let survivors abandon with no penalty if there are two dead and more than 1 gen left. This allows killer to get 4K against the bots if they want to and also allows survivors to not be forced to wait out the slugging for 4K scenario that is so unfun.
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Hatch does not count as a win for a survivor. 99999 out of 100000 times a killer slugging for a 4k is not going for an achievement. Killer still gets the same amount of mmr with a 3k as they do for a 4k. Like I said, all ego.
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Make hatch appear when there's 2 Survivors left before endgame, but Killer can mori a downed Survivor at that point. Everyone gets an aura reveal of hatch so it's a race.
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I've been calling for a manual bleedout speedup for awhile, even if it only kicks in when two people are left. That would make hooking more valuable and keep the match moving. I don't understand why killers are allowed to just avoid a whole part of the game because they don't like it.
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Ego or not, you still didnt answer my question how is that fair that surv gets to escape with zero effort.
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How is being the last one alive zero effort? How is finding the hatch zero effort? How is staying hidden while the hatch hunt happens zero effort? All for no MMR for the survivor?
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Because it isn't a win for the survivor, its a safety valve for the match to end by giving them something to try for instead of just hiding.
There are also scenarios where the survivor does in fact deserve that escape and it wasn't zero effort. I have been the last survivor standing because the killer was completely unable to catch me in chase, my team went down but I didn't. These still regularly turn out in the killers favor since they either slug for the 4k or just find hatch before I do. Before the abandon update that scenario regularly had the killer hump you as if they beat you. Killer ego IS the problem in these scenarios.
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You can hide in a locker whole game and still be last one to survive. In fact, usually, the last one who stays is some gen jockey who never goes for unhooks and either repairs or stays in the bushes whole game which is not really the brightest skill expression you can have on surv side.
And you are not going to suggest hiding in a locker or ctrl in bush while killer is in chase with another surv/ finding a hatch is some insane skill expression? First one i can understand although you would be better off playing prop hunt if thats gameplay you find intensive. Second one is straight up just luck…
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survs are already allowed to leave without a penalty in a staggering amount of situations, hatch is already a free win for a lost game
the idea that killer-win endgame needs to favour them even more is absolutely insane
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>ts a safety valve for the match to end by giving them something to try for instead of just hiding
Yeah absolutely it doesnt ever happen that 2 survivors remain and both just stealth hoping another one will be caught earlier than them so they can escape into a hatch. Never happens. Hatch is what saves us from that scenario… oh wait-10 -
Idk about your matches but the last person in my killer matches is often the one I ignored because they were too good at chase and too much effort, so the best person gets the hatch if they find it before me.
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So hatch should spawn sooner or both remaining survivors should have some reason to continue interacting with the game, like say a comeback mechanic or an alternate objective. Further extending the bad scenario by keeping slug for the 4k is just silly.
Also good job ignoring the scenario I described where the survivor does in fact deserve an escape.
The insane thing is that anyone can reasonably think that slugging for the 4k is OK or healthy for the game. Anyone defending it proves they have zero care for the survivor experience in the game. Survivors can only abandon if everyone is hooked or downed, the entire rest of their team is bots, or they have been slugged without being hooked multiple times.
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as i said last person is either the one who stealthed whole game or stay whole game in the main building like garden of joy or swamp where i will waste enermous amount of time chasing them
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So by your own admission, being a gen jockey and actually progressing the game for survivors is the person least deserving of hatch... I think someone just had a Freudian slip...
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I wouldn't be mad if hatch were removed because it doesn't fulfill its original purpose of an anti-bottleneck mechanic anymore. It'd get rid of those really annoying hatch challenges too.
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i agree with your first statement, there should be some alternative objective for survivors when 2 of them remains so they can actually put some effort instead of just hiding. I never said slugging is healthy, but game literally forces you if you want to guarantee 4k after a deserved win. Slugging at 2 survs is the most logical and rational thing possible if you are going for 4k. Only reason every killer doesn't do that because its massive waste of time. Thats what is actually silly.
Also at the end of the day for survivors its a team game, if your team loses you also should lose. It should't be allowed to take a deserved win for killer just because someone got unlucky with a team, well too bad bro, there are enough games that will allow your individual skill expression to matter more(or just play killer). "surv" side in the assymetrical genre isn't about that.
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it's called not being a wuss and just hook. hatch exists precisely to just end these kinds of standoffs but naturally it's the killer who has the problem and somehow twists it into thinking that the hatch is the reason they are stalling the match out.
heck, I usually don't mind dying. If I were against, say, a Pinhead I'd be more than happy to solve the box and let him take me if this were a respectful community. But all I'll get for the trouble is a slugging so you may as well play it safe and if they start slugging, drag it out
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As matter of fact, yes, chases is literally most skill expresssive thing for survivors, player who makes a build around avoiding them just admits they are not as good in the game as others. Thats not bad, everyone free to choose their playstyle(there are killers who exclusively play nurse or ghoul). And i am not saying they do not deserve a win, but surely there is a reason other 3 teammates died?
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god, how its a killer problem? Killer has clear goal in the game-4k. The most efficient way to get it is slugging at 2 survs so latest one doesn't get to escape. Killer is WRONG for playing for their goal? Will you realize its a game mechanic that makes it the most efficient play and not killers being asses who want survivors to stay in the game for another 10 minutes?
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People play to win and this is true for both sides and the best way to win is to reduce rng odds. Killers have no reason to not slug to avoid hatch spawn. There is no benefit to letting hatch spawn. It's up to the devs to create a more interesting 1v1 finale mechanic which I doubt they'll do. So we'll be stuck with the poor current hatch implementation that incentivizes slugging.
There's no reason to shame players for playing the way that is most optimal for their role.
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It's also a slasher movie simulator.
Ever heard of the Final Girl trope? Pretty common.
Doesn't even need to be a girl, necessarily. Ash for example is a male Final Girl.
It's just common in horror movies for all of the characters to die except 1, who then has to try to survive.
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The thing your missing is that you don't need a 4k to win, you already won. If you have ever told someone they should care less about winning then wanting a 4k that badly is hypocrisy. Any mechanic they try adding for the 2v1 will be lambasted and never see the light of day unless it heavily favors the killer. The silly part is slugging for the 4k, you don't need to 4k. I don't see anything being added to the 2v1 unless it dramatically favors the killer side, otherwise it will be lambasted and never see the light of day, at which point we just end up with the same problem just in a different way.
While I agree that survivor is a team game and I don't consider it a win if I get hatch and my team dies I have seen too many people argue that its a team game when it benefits them and that it isn't when it benefits them. Its a team game when the survivors lose or you want to call a survivor bad but a solo game when talking about escape rates and what constitutes the survivor winning. Its whichever best fits their current argument. It also means that the killer needs to accept that just because they killed someone that doesn't make them better than that specific player.
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Sorry but i am yet to see a horror movie where character gets to escape thanks to hatch spawning right under their legs. Mind sharing?
MCs in those movies almost always have to put A LOT of effort or mindgaming to escape
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Bro i want 4k to win. Who said you don't need it? You get merciless killer and pretty sure its required for iridiscent emblem. You get MORE for getting 4k. Thats already enough reason for wanting it. Maybe last survivor should also be auto-sacrificed because 3 escapes is already a win for survs and entity doesn't want poor killer to feel bad?
Also i dont mind survivors winning, but only when its fair win, 5 genning and opening exit gates, not win button spawning under their butt.
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Only reason every killer doesn't do that because its massive waste of time.
Definitely not true. Plenty of people don't feel the need to wipe everyone out. 3k is a win.
if your team loses you also should lose
Survivors are four individual people that, if soloing, have nothing to do with one another. The game doesn't have enough team elements in its basic makeup to make this fair. As it is, DCing and early game throws are rampant in my killler matches. I give people hatch in at least one match every time I play because of teammates ruining it immediately. I wouldn't want to see that ability removed. This game is not fair as it is. Survivors have to have at least individual hope in a lost match.
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You really don't get much more for a 4k vs a 3k and then only bloodpoints which I have also been told are meaningless when it benefits someones argument. I would actually be happier with the auto-kill system than the existing one simply because it eliminates slug for the 4k. (I read that wrong at first and thought you were talking about the 2v1 scenario) Many people love to argue that kill rates are inflated because of how easy it supposedly is to secure one in endgame, once again it just depends on if it helps their current argument.
So survivors should get a way to kill the killer. That sounds like its what you are arguing for.
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I have an option to do 4k, are there ANY reason why wouldn't want to do it? Only when its much more effort than 3k which is what we have now. I really dont think i need to reason why its normal for a player to want to secure a complete, deserved win.
>So survivors should get a way to kill the killer
Are there anyone who would prefer hatch to this? Sounds much more fun and interactive, especially if bhvr manage to implement it in a way that doesnt feel too one-sided.
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There is so much nuance and RNG in this game to the extent that erroneously suggesting that a gen jockey is the reason 3 other people got sacrificed is for sure one of the most uninformed takes of all time.
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Because it is bad for the game, I have friends that quit after one too many times being slugged for the 4 (or they only play killer now). I am a survivor main turned killer main in large part because of slugging for the 4k. You already have a complete win with a 3k, more is just ego stroking.
I would be ok with it being implemented, ideally only once we get down to the 2v1 but the level of vitriol we would see from a large segment of killer mains if the game ever implemented a way to kill the killer would be astounding.
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Yeah, thats why hatch is an issue. Honestly what kind of logic is that, killer wanting 4k is bad for the game? Why 4k is still in the game then? Devs are the ones who should fix it, not the players.
And of course i am talking about 2v1 scenario, letting survivors to defeat killer at 4v1 is batshit insane
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This thread is literally asking for the devs to fix it.
This situation is one of the reasons I prefer the killer role, too.
Yes it's also dumb that two survivors have a rat-off when it's just them.
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I’m not opposed to replacing hatch with some other endgame objective if the goal is to eliminate hatch standoffs but I disagree with the idea that hatch is “giving a survivor a win with 0% effort.”
If a survivor reaches the point where hatch is an option, they’ve already made it to the end of the match. In the overwhelming majority of those cases that only happens because they contributed enough throughout the game to still be alive whether it’s from gen progress or doing well in chase.
If anything, hatch is just the survivor equivalent of things like anti-camp and certain survivor perks being deactivated in end game for the killer sake, giving them a better chance at securing a kill.
You can argue that hatch should work differently, (and I agree!) but I don’t think it’s fair to single it out as some uniquely undeserved mechanic when DBD already has similar things to give both roles another chance to get at least one win.
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If you find it boring just run to the killer and let him down you for quick abandon.
You act like it means nothing to escape with hatch, yet you want it so bad…
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What? How does any of what I said show that hatch is an issue? The problem isn't wanting the 4k, its intentionally creating a bad game experience when you don't have to and have already won. Its the definition of entitlement. We see killers all the time say that survivors shouldn't care about winning or they should consider winning something other than escaping. Yet when it comes to themselves they must win at any cost and it must be a 4k? Its hypocrisy. Devs can't fix something the playerbase won't let them fix and its not like we haven't tried, its been considered a problem for years.
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It's dumb gameplay regardless of side.
If the killer slugs the 3rd survivor to hunt down the 4th, they're being selfish.
Basically telling the 4th survivor, "Give up or waste 2 minutes of your ally's time, because I have now shown I don't care about that."
And now the 4th survivor needs to meet their demands and just give up or also be selfish and try to hide.
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Sigh, honestly i am already kind of bored of arguing, you guys have those weird assumptions that makes me feel like either you just want to feel better about yourself or straight do not play a game. Simple experiment. For 20 games, at the beginning of the match hide in the locker/ctrl in the bushes until first chase. Rest of the game play normally. Then do this again but play whole game normally sitting on a gen at the beginning. Then compare how much times you was the last one standing. Get back to the thread with the stats if you want to continue that "last standing is the skilled one!" argument.
Hatch isn't survivor equivalent of endgame because killer still has to put effort in the endgame, in fact its your normal dbd gameloop with a chase and hook. Also you have a choice whether to camp last hook or try to get more kills. And even if you just camp, unless you play bubba, survivors still have solid chance of unhooking safely. Its much more interactive that just win button hatch is. Maybe if killer could find an orbital laser that auto aims at one random survivor and obliterates them that would be fair equivalent.
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Hatch is what forces slugging, hatch is a problem, what else did you mean? Do killers slug because they are evil and want all survivors to feel bad and suffer and they just toxic people who should be banned from this game?
Also i still FAIL to see how wanting 4k is an entitlement. Its what games wants from you. Its a win. Would you agree with a mechanic that auto sacrifices last survivor? No? Not giving killer even 1 kill when you already won? Surely you are entitled person.
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Hatch is some to none effort its rng and only can be influenced by offerings that are one way more sided (to side that uses them because other side cant see them directly that its hatch or other offering with secreat).
After hatch survivor has other chance and thats gate and this is effected mostly by Map (some maps have spots where killer can stay and watch both gates others like hawkins,larrys,gideaon have no way for killer to watch them only maybe singularity and thats it), killer (killers with mobility or some area traps can secure gates and patrol them more then killers with none mobility or traps but again this is highly influenced by map), perks can make difference like noway out but they can easily countered compare to previous things.
So hatch is very cheap thing it can literary spawn under your feet as survivor or killer and even when killer finds it it doesnt give him that kill as reward for winning that gamble there are gates which arent easy to patrol too (read above) so yeah hatch is sometimes zero effort.
There are only few ways to make hatch compleatly no effort and its offering (if other side has no idea and didnt checked the macht info in game), bots and cheaters know excatly where the hatch is because it spawns with all things on the map only its hidden (trapper can find it kinda because he cant place trap on it so he can hatch check or other killers with simular power to trapper like hag). Bots and cheaters will know where the hatch is 100% of times and run to it, then people with offering being visible for them and then people guessing its in like shack or main.
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People will use any excuse they can to do whatever they please in the game. Its entitled to think you deserve a 4k instead of accepting that a 3k is a win and that hatch is an intended mechanic. Its you stroking your ego, that is entitlement, you literally feel entitled to a 4k. The killer has a lot of options for securing a kill in endgame, the survivor has no way to escape other than wait for their teammate to bleed out if the killer slugs for the 4k, the scenarios are not even remotely equivalent.
You are going out of your way to avoid something the devs intend as part of the endgame. You're the one making assumptions about how people play the game and what I think about it. There are a lot of good reasons to slug when playing killer, slug for the 4k isn't one of them. If you don't touch gens as survivor you just lose, claiming that people that sit on gens are not contributing is ludicrous.
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Why are you strawmanning bots and cheaters when I've already said that a 3k is a win for killer?
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The entire endgame needs to be completely rethought and redone, both on survivor and killer sides. It has far too many issues where the most optimal move from either side is to not engage with it at all. So much so that people will very often do the 'stupid' thing simply because it actually has some form of gameplay, which then leads to them getting BMed, insulted, and abused, by both teammates and opponent.
But certain people here very obviously have zero issues with all anti-camp being turned off in endgame, which makes it extremely easy to all but guarantee an extra kill against anything but very coordinated teams with at least 2-3 more alive, and for many killers with insta-downs, 100% guaranteed. That's not considered being handed a freebie pity token despite being the exact same thing. That's just being 'fair.' Can't imagine why.
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Because 4k is too its just about hiding then and there are features to sip this.
Since when wil people cry here that killer with only 3 chases lost all gens or 3 gens in 1 chase tha twasnt even super long or long just casual???
Its basicaly same thing if you are a m1 killer with 4 survivors alive on 1 gen left you are done and no one demands features to change that.
Bots and cheaters are walling things like killers position or hatch thats why dislike them maybe you like to play against wallhacks (walls is shortcut) but I dont especialy constant ones that arent in with rules like perks but thats maybe your speciality personaly Im not fan of that, knowing that bot or cheater with walls are running directly to hatch.
Why someone should get automatic escape when he and his team faulied??? Is it something new in 2026, you still have chance to hide and then hatch or gates depending on situation.
Its even compareable to survivors not wanting killers to have abandon once they lost (exits are powered and they have none survivor in their grasp - hook,slug) but on this forum looking for equal takes is luxury thats super rare.
There are ways to skip this like faster bleed out or resoneable basekit antislug (Resoneable not that nonsece that was in both anti ptbs) but thats not what is this all about, it looks more like someone wanting to free escape because he thinks he deserves one because he outlived (or out rat) his teammates.
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Tbf… they could (sorta) go back to the old mechanic in that sense, with a little difference! Make it to where the hatch will not spawn, ever, until a specific amount of generators are completed, even if you’re the last survivor alive. So let’s say the last survivor is alive and 4 gens need to be completed, the last survivor would need to complete 1 gen to then allow hatch to spawn and give them a chance to escape.
Basically, if enough of the objective is not done before the last survivor is on the field, hatch will not spawn until it is done. (I threw out a random number at 3. Not meaning go with 3.)
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